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And anyone who has all the answers correct should failI say the Pilgrim Office should start giving a test about the Camino before handing out Compostelas!
What is the name of the albergue by the river just past a bridge?
What is the distance between A and B?
What is the name of the church leaving Melide?
How many times did you have to cross a river by stepping on stones since Sarria?
Name two trick to avoid or cure blisters?
What is Compeed?
Describe your albergue routine.
I say the Pilgrim Office should start giving a test about the Camino before handing out Compostelas!
What is the name of the albergue by the river just past a bridge?
What is the distance between A and B?
What is the name of the church leaving Melide?
How many times did you have to cross a river by stepping on stones since Sarria?
Name two trick to avoid or cure blisters?
What is Compeed?
Describe your albergue routine.
Mayer they should require all pilgrims to wear a fitbit or other activity tracker to prove that they actually walked.
I can just imaging the dude walking with 52 fitbits around his necks for the bussing touristsMayer they should require all pilgrims to wear a fitbit or other activity tracker to prove that they actually walked.
My only opposing comments are that: ...and (2) it devalues the accomplishment of legitimate pilgrims.
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only problem is that while I've walked the entire Camino Frances, I can't answer your questions except for the last two. Unless I can refer to the Brierley guide. LOLI say the Pilgrim Office should start giving a test about the Camino before handing out Compostelas!
What is the name of the albergue by the river just past a bridge?
What is the distance between A and B?
What is the name of the church leaving Melide?
How many times did you have to cross a river by stepping on stones since Sarria?
Name two trick to avoid or cure blisters?
What is Compeed?
Describe your albergue routine.
I should care why?
Who says it's about an accomplishment, but rather respect for the rules set up by the Cathedral, the organisation who gets to decide what constitutes this particular pilgrimage.I am sorry, but I still don't see why I should worry about cheaters. They diminish nothing of the accomplishments of the people who comply with the rather arbitrary rules.
Who says it's about an accomplishment, but rather respect for the rules set up by the Cathedral, the organisation who gets to decide what constitutes this particular pilgrimage.
Why would you want that certificate if you don't care what it stands for?
Why would you walk this pilgrimage route if you don't care what it stands for?
And why would you flaunt for disregard for the Cathedral, this pilgrimage and for those who do follow the rules in front of those who do believe.
It it about faith and religion after all. Is nothing sacred anymore? Not even a sacred route whose only reason for being is based on a religion and its rules?
And what about all those volunteers who give of their time, energy, work, because they believe in this route as a pilgrimage, with its rules, who keep albergues open, clean, welcome us with open arms who do all this as an expression of their faith and because they believe in this route as a sacred one. Would they be doing this to support the tourist trade and for the benefit of private wallets?
It is not about wether or not others are taking away from my accomplishment, as walking the Camino is not about an accomplishment. For that you can go walk anywhere else that has no religious meaning. But on a religious pilgrimage, a Catholic pilgrimage, on this pilgrimage, I am sorry, but the Cathedral gets to decide what the rules are when it comes to the proof you have walked it and under what conditions. Nothing arbitrary then.
I wonder how many would walk the 100km, queue to get their Compostela under false pretences, if they also had to go to confession in order to get their precious vaccation souvenir.
This thread is turning into a rant. A rather amusing rant!
Recently forgot to take my fitbit off at the ukulele group - two hours of hard rock uke gave me 5700 steps!Lol, that way I wouldn't have got a single Compostela in my whole pilgrim life - bad memory. Now if you would ask me for the color of the friendly dog in a village some days ago - that I could answer easily ;-)
Dangles her FitBit from her hand - swing, one meter, swing two meters, swing ...
Buen Camino, SY
But that doesn't take into account "Pilgrim Brain", that groundhog state of mind that causes you to look back over your shoulder in puzzlement when a fellow pilgrim asks you where you stayed last night.I say the Pilgrim Office should start giving a test about the Camino before handing out Compostelas!
What is the name of the albergue by the river just past a bridge?
What is the distance between A and B?
What is the name of the church leaving Melide?
How many times did you have to cross a river by stepping on stones since Sarria?
Name two trick to avoid or cure blisters?
What is Compeed?
Describe your albergue routine.
IMHO, The longer the tactic is tolerated, the more it will spread. Human nature can be dark at times. Some people will always seek an advantage, an easier way out, a cut-corner, or a "cheat" to mitigate honest effort and commitment. This is not something of my invention. I observe and report.
My concern is less for the present, than for the near future. What happens when the percentage of "cheaters" rises to even single digit volumes? I have no idea what it is at present, but I feel certain the number is almost infinitesimal compared to the overall volume...today...
But, what happens when the Pilgrim Office has to issue Compostelas to - let's say 2 - 3 percent cheaters. I will tell you from experience that even this small number on a busy day means the difference between a two-hour queue and a one-hour queue. The reason is simple, if I were cheating, I would show up at the busiest time of day to game that the staff is under pressure to move the queue and likely ask fewer questions.
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Hahaha, I walked it and I would flunk that!!!I say the Pilgrim Office should start giving a test about the Camino before handing out Compostelas!
What is the name of the albergue by the river just past a bridge?
What is the distance between A and B?
What is the name of the church leaving Melide?
How many times did you have to cross a river by stepping on stones since Sarria?
Name two trick to avoid or cure blisters?
What is Compeed?
Describe your albergue routine.
Or "Please show me your feet".I say the Pilgrim Office should start giving a test about the Camino before handing out Compostelas!
What is the name of the albergue by the river just past a bridge?
What is the distance between A and B?
What is the name of the church leaving Melide?
How many times did you have to cross a river by stepping on stones since Sarria?
Name two trick to avoid or cure blisters?
What is Compeed?
Describe your albergue routine.
@t2andreo, I generally consider your posts as sources of wise and sage advice, but this is far more passion than practicality. There are many issues here, not just with your suggestion.All I seek to do is raise consciousness, and at least get the veteran pilgrims to agree that the cheating phenomenon is one that should be carefully observed, measured, and learned about now, so changes to processes and rules can be made by the relevant authorities when and if it becomes necessary.
Have you ever noticed how society only works unless we all honor pieces of paper that represent something of value or something to be the truth? Let me give an example.
I want my Compostella to have value. I want it to stand for something. An achievement that is not easily bought for 20 Euros in a back alley in Santiago.
I feel the same way about my college degrees. And the piece of paper that says I own my house. And the piece of paper that says I own my car. I want them to be recognized as legitimate representations of the truth. I did attend college. I did buy a house. I did buy a car.
I don't care when cheating only harms the cheater. However, I do care when the cheater harms everyone.
What nationality are the 'cheaters'?
I suppose it relates to the fact (or myth?) that the Compostela serves as a document that can be added to one's CV.
I also fail to see that the "real world" value of the contemporary Compostela is anything more than a souvenir - very similar to the medals or certificates that you get when you finish a half marathon or marathon as a hobby runner.
I am always a bit skeptical as to why the Cathedral puts "religious" & "spiritual" in the same category. Part of me can't help think it's to boost its importance as a pilgrimage because what is spirituality?Lastly, I believe Pilgrim Office statistics consistently reflect that the majority of pilgrims registering at the Pilgrim Office state that they did their Camino for religious or spiritual reasons. Again, a numerical fact.
I hope this contributes to the dialogue.
I am always a bit skeptical as to why the Cathedral puts "religious" & "spiritual" in the same category. Part of me can't help think it's to boost its importance as a pilgrimage because what is spirituality?
Isn't just about everyone and their cat into "spirituality"? I hear it's something to out into one's online dating profile. Vs the number of people you see walking as vow, going to evening blessings for more that just to witness it?
@t2andreo , when you are invited to give your 2cents about what works and what doesn't work, perhaps you could also include having "religious" and "spiritual" split as the motivation for a Camino.
Really, @SEB, the OP sought information about a behaviour, only one explanation for which was that it might be associated with some form of 'cheating'. It only took three or so posts before we stopped addressing the issue raised by the OP and the thread was wonderfully quickly transformed into a variation of the 'true pilgrim' discussions that occupy us from time to time.And yes, @dougfitz, the subject of the OP is undoubtedly a matter for the cathedral authorities to act upon if they are so minded and remedying the commercially driven falsification of credencials is not something we, as pilgrims can do much about, but it is also the right of any forum member to post comments (conforming to Forum Rules) on any Camino-related subject without fearing snarky replies.
I learnt the word "historicity" - something that is not historically correct but it fits people's ideas of what things were like in the past or what happened in the past.
Really, @SEB, the OP sought information about a behaviour, only one explanation for which was that it might be associated with some form of 'cheating'. It only took three or so posts before we stopped addressing the issue raised by the OP and the thread was wonderfully quickly transformed into a variation of the 'true pilgrim' discussions that occupy us from time to time.
As for your concern about the rights of forum members, I see no particular problem with disagreeing with points of view suggested by other members, and arguing the case from a different perspective, as I have done here. Perhaps my comments on this matter were a little indirect, and only hinted that I felt some of the proposals were fundamentally flawed. I will try to be more direct in future.
Kathar1na, what do you mean by the cult of relics being a phenomena that does not exist in contemporary times?Just wanted to add that the phrase "(medieval) cult of relics", just like the phrase "(medieval) cult of Saint James" are quite established phrases to describe phenomena during the Middle Ages that do not exist in contemporary times.
I am always a bit skeptical as to why the Cathedral puts "religious" & "spiritual" in the same category. Part of me can't help think it's to boost its importance as a pilgrimage because what is spirituality?
Isn't just about everyone and their cat into "spirituality"? I hear it's something to out into one's online dating profile. Vs the number of people you see walking as vow, going to evening blessings for more that just to witness it?
@t2andreo , when you are invited to give your 2cents about what works and what doesn't work, perhaps you could also include having "religious" and "spiritual" split as the motivation for a Camino.
Not at all, just that I still see the practice existing, and wonder why you say it no longer exists. Ok, perhaps not in as great numbers, but still being practiced.I sense that any reply (about societal changes over centuries) may be interpreted as an attack on contemporary beliefs and I definitely have zero interest in going there
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This is why I don't get a compostela, it's not a souvenir and it shouldn't be devalued for for those who believe in it. The association offers a non religious completion certificate if you need a paper to prove you finished, but for me the value of the Camino is in the experience.If it didn't have "value", I doubt we would see the masses of the last 100km, let alone the masses jumping in and out of taxis on that stretch. Otherwise a simple picture of the person standing on the Obradoiro plaza with the scaffolding in the background would also be a good souvenir.
Yes, good to keep the stats up. I understand that they read out the names of completing pilgrims in the cathedral too, I had someone come up to me in Santiago and tell me that the old boy reading our the list had stopped at mine and had several goes at it, before another priest looked over and shouted out "Hel", not sure if it was the name or the Spainish silent H that was giving him problems.For me, the compostela was not especially important -- I value my credencial much more -- but I went to the office in Santiago because I wanted my name added to the long, long list of pilgrims who have walked the Camino.
I wondered about that when I read the posts above. Things are long enough as it is, I cannot imagine having to sit through the names of hundreds or even thousands.They used to read out the names, but I think there are now too many and for many years they have condensed the information ...
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