Marcia Shaver
New Member
- Time of past OR future Camino
- Frances (2008), Via de la Plata (2011), Portuguese (2014), Le Puy (2016-2017)
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Did they tell you the name of the new reservation system,?First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
I'd be curious to know which day in April it was. As it happens, the hospitalero group said in their May newsletter that on a particular day around the middle of April of this year, two busses with 140 people arrived and they were told that there were no beds available. They accepted it but they all wanted a stamp in their passports so that created quite some activity. Roncesvalles is for many Spanish pilgrims the start of the Camino de Santiago so they are bound to arrive on a bus.Yes, I do mean 2 big buses arrived and people piled off and went to the big Albergue. It was very disheartening, but I tried to look at it like they were just starting out and were really Pilgrims. The sign in the big Albergue in Pamplona gave me pause because it looks like anyone can stay.
Good to knowIs this the albergue you speak of @Marcia Shaver?View attachment 58310
yesGood to know
Yes, that was also the day and date mentioned in the newsletter! So these two buses were actually turned away.Our arrival in Roncesvalles was Saturday, April 13.
I think the only "reservation system" here is the one that is used by the Roncesvalles albergue. There is no department that oversees the whole camino.Did they tell you the name of the new reservation system,?
Do sorry you were injured. Hope you get well soon.
I wonder if this is because of the Tourism Dept overseeing the Camino instead of the Cultural?
Thank you for explainingThe OP situation appears to have been a function of two, normally independent variables that occurred simultaneously to create a "perfect storm." When a large group of pilgrims descends on a town with finite bed space, they fill up. When this happens over a traditionally busy time of the year, Holy Week (Semana Santa) this is exacerbated.
What I have read in another thread pertaining specifically to the Monastery at Roncesvalles is that the abbott in charge there, did a deal with three tour companies to set aside 60 valuable beds for tour group use. That is all I know. But this is a full third of all the beds (180) available there. The ripple effect of pre-reservation en masse, combined with the scenario reported in the OP, clearly brought this result about.
Also, because these waves of pilgrims functions like the proverbial pig in the python, the 'completo' condition will roll through the entire Camino on a schedule closely following the standard Brierley stages. Stated another way, if you are caught in this wave, you are screwed if you stick to the same schedule as all the others in this clot.
The ONLY way to avoid this perfect storm is to be where the 'pig in the python' is not. You do this by altering your dates of arrival and departure from all terminal points on the Camino Frances.
You DO NOT want to be arriving on a Friday or Saturday at: Roncesvalles, Pamplona, Logrono, Burgos, Leon, Astorga, Ponferrada, Sarria, or any other village or town with convenient rail or bus links to the world. Even away from formal national holidays, like found during the Easter period or other key dates, like the Feast of Santiago on 25 July, most weekends during the season from Easter to October will find this condition at most of the 33 Brierely stages.
Finally, the burgeoning success of paid tour groups that provide logistical support without busses: reservations, mochila transportation, advance meal payment, etc. is becoming a large problem, especially on the Camino Frances. It is growing fast on the Camino Portuguese as well, especially from Porto to Santiago.
As the Holy Year approaches in 2021, expect more innkeepers and the folks in charge of the better and larger places to stay at preferred locations to be doing backhanded deals to keep their rooms full, at the expense of regular walking pilgrims. These folks are acting in their private commercial interest. I may not like it, but I do understand it.
So, to avoid this unfortunate situation:
You are not going to see more new beds come on line in time for the Holy Year. The locals would rather turn pilgrims away than deal with added competition. Also, there is NOTHING you can do to affect the sort of backhanded deals done at Roncesvalles or other places of accommodation.
- Alter your days of arrival and departure from the standard segment stopping places.
- Make advance reservations when you can, CONFIRM those reservations
- Have a Plan B for EVERY walking day... If I cannot get a bed / room at A, I will do B, or C.
- Walk at a different time of year, or
- Walk a different Camino route.
Sorry this sounds gloomy, but it is the facts of life as I see them. IMHO, the Camino de Santiago, at least the most popular route is nearing saturation during the peak and preferred times of the year. I do not have the answer for everyone. The ideas I listed above will help but they are intended to get you down the road with less stress. I cannot solve this problem myself.
Hope this helps.
I don't know whether there was a tour operator involved. I actually thought that this must have been a privately organised trip. I'm sometimes an avid reader of the bulletins of the various amigos associations and although I've never seen them on the road myself I know that they all organise group trips where a large group walks a few days along a camino or other. I can imagine that there are other Spanish groups like this. But I don't know any further details.LMAO thinking about how a tour operator dealt with 2 bus loads of pilgrims without beds.
When I was a hospi at San Anton, we would have a "busload" of tourists show up every few days. They were normally all from the same country and would come in to snap photos and listen to our interpretation of some of the architecture. The best part was they left small donations in the donativo jar and rarely demanded to use the toilet.I don't know whether there was a tour operator involved. I actually thought that this must have been a privately organised trip. I'm sometimes an avid reader of the bulletins of the various amigos associations and although I've never seen them on the road myself I know that they all organise group trips where a large group walks a few days along a camino or other. I can imagine that there are other Spanish groups like this. But I don't know any further details.
Okay, I can understand your response but any group coming in a bus or two has to been organized by someone. Just look at the numbers of people who descend on Lourdes daily.I don't know whether there was a tour operator involved. I actually thought that this must have been a privately organised trip. I'm sometimes an avid reader of the bulletins of the various amigos associations and although I've never seen them on the road myself I know that they all organise group trips where a large group walks a few days along a camino or other. I can imagine that there are other Spanish groups like this. But I don't know any further details.
I was able to reserve 2 beds in this popular albergue for September 8. I went directly to their website, didn't use booking.com.
First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
My husband and I have just arrived in Burgos. We have not booked ahead at all but were lucky to get the last 2 places at the monastery at Roncesvalles. We have stayed at the municipal and private accommodation along the way and have enjoyed the freedom of being able to stop when we want and enjoy the local experiences. Except for Roncesvalles everywhere else we have stayed has not been fully booked. Sorry your experience was so different. I am, however, not sure if the last 100 kms into Santiago will pose difficulties with accommodation.First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
As far as I know, the only way that you can book the Roncesvalles albergue is on their own site.I was able to reserve 2 beds in this popular albergue for September 8. I went directly to their website, didn't use booking.com.
Crowded Spanish routes aren't the only option, of course. The Holy Year would be a great time to walk routes in Germany, or Geneva-Le Puy in France. There's no need to give up a healthy year of walking .. we don't know how many of those we have left.at least for the Holy Year (2021) I do not plan to walk a Camino.
First let me say that I love the Camino, ...
Marcia, so sorry to read of your injury and of your troubles with just getting a bed for the night. I’ve heard many times that to be a pilgrim is to suffer at least a little, but this sounds just crazy. It gives me pause in my planning and dreaming to walk the Camino again in 2021, the next Holy Year. I have heard some predict many more thousands are anticipated that year. I wonder then if I should take a less traveled Way; e.g. the Primitivo, Norte, etc. and do it in non-peak season? I share your concern that maybe the Camino has become too well loved. I’d like to think the two busloads were actually peregrinos starting out and not a “Club Med” version of the Camino.
Prayers and best wishes for your recovery.
Also, because these waves of pilgrims functions like the proverbial pig in the python, the 'completo' condition will roll through the entire Camino ...
The ONLY way to avoid this perfect storm is to be where the 'pig in the python' is not. You do this by altering your dates of arrival and departure from all terminal points ...
You DO NOT want to be arriving on a Friday or Saturday at: Roncesvalles, Pamplona, Logrono, Burgos, Leon, Astorga, Ponferrada, Sarria, or any other village or town with convenient rail or bus links to the world. Even away from formal national holidays, like found during the Easter period or other key dates, like the Feast of Santiago on 25 July, most weekends during the season from Easter to October will find this condition at most of the 33 Brierely stages.
Not necessarily. I just came off the Via de Bayona and have spent last night and tonight in old-fashioned old-school albergues. Tonight in San Nicholas near Itero de la Vega, and last night in San Anton. Last night there were 4 pilgrims for 12 places and the hospi said the night before (? not certain here, but it was some time this week) there was no-one. Nada. Tonight SN nay be full, maybe not.booking is now essential,
I beg to differ. The Frances IS crowded, no doubt about thatThe only thing we can do is boycott by not doing Camino.
As I hung out there yesterday afternoon, people helped themselves to the toilet, in spite of the 'privado' sign on the door....and left no donations.The best part was they left small donations in the donativo jar and rarely demanded to use the toilet
My husband and I have just arrived in Burgos. We have not booked ahead at all but were lucky to get the last 2 places at the monastery at Roncesvalles. We have stayed at the municipal and private accommodation along the way and have enjoyed the freedom of being able to stop when we want and enjoy the local experiences. Except for Roncesvalles everywhere else we have stayed has not been fully booked. Sorry your experience was so different. I am, however, not sure if the last 100 kms into Santiago will pose difficulties with accommodation.
I am so sorry for what you have gone throughFirst let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
I checked the website of the Jesu and Maria albergue in Pamplona. They are owned by the municipality of Pamplona and indeed, they have different prices for pilgrims, tourists and groups. From 1 May until 30 September, it’s for pilgrims only, and from 1 October until 30 April tourists are also accepted and reservations are then possible. I don’t think that’s something new. And in general, people travel now more and more during their non-working time, whether they are pilgrims or not.According to both Eroski and Gronze, the Jesu and Maria albergue in Pamplona accepts non-pilgrims but they don't agree whether this is always the case or only until 30 April of each year.
First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
Hello My daughter and I started from st Jean,,,, on the 9th of April so one week before you we had a booking a Ronceshvallas. But only just got two beds in Valcarlose In our time frame there was a party of twenty four they were very well organised down to putting on the track their own arrows where they obviously thought the camino ones were not good enough . We also had problems getting beds at time I also saw a municiple albergue with a sing on the door at 12.30 saying SOLD OUT I am very suspicious that even the municipals are bowing to pressure from large parties such as the one I have mentioned considering the nature of this party of twenty four,they would have had the ability to pull strings at a bishops level between their two countries. ( I am Catholic)First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
We are currently walking and have also been told that "tourists" can now stay in al argues even municipal and they can reserve these bedsYes, I do mean 2 big buses arrived and people piled off and went to the big Albergue. It was very disheartening, but I tried to look at it like they were just starting out and were really Pilgrims. The sign in the big Albergue in Pamplona gave me pause because it looks like anyone can stay. Yes, the Camino has become over loved! We will just have to adjust the way we approach it. I did not think I would like having to make reservations when we walked the Le Puy route, but it alleviated all the anxiety that Luka thought out so well and wrote about. Reservations did end up giving us the option to dawdle, go into all the churches, talk to the farmers, have a leisurely lunch, and arrive without the stress of uncertain accommodations. Thanks to the well wishers on my knee injury. PS: Portugal was really fun anyway!
How odd. Did you talk to them? Did they perhaps belong to a Friends of the Camino association?there was a party of twenty four they were very well organised down to putting on the track their own arrows where they obviously thought the camino ones were not good enough.
I was just wondering whether people are not aware that in some parts of the country it is still the local amigos de camino associations who maintain the signs and arrows and not some public administration entity. And they do go on group walks.How odd. Did you talk to them? Did they perhaps belong to a Friends of the Camino association?
All this discussion is disheartening and unfortunately counter to the spirit with which we all embarked. Looking at the wider map of caminos why not investigate the less trodden paths: e.g., Budapest-Wien-Linz-Salzburg-Graz-Zagreb-Triest?Our arrival in Roncesvalles was Saturday, April 13. It was probably the worst possible day to start, and not what we planned. We had flight delays and other logistics that pushed us to start the Saturday of Holy Week. Thank you for telling me about the Albergue in Pamplona. Even allowing tourists until April 30 is sort of bad because so many are starting to walk earlier to avoid the crowds. It just was not my year to do the Camino, but I surely will not make that mistake again. I am so thankful that others are having a different experience, but I do still think it is worth a cautionary word.
It should be noted again, for those totally new to caminos and this discussion, that the problem with insufficient albergue beds is very limited both in time and place. It concerns mainly Roncesvalles and the small towns or villages before reaching Pamplona, and very few periods in time, usually in late April, in early May and in early September and then usually just the weekends and the long weekends on which public holidays in major European countries fall. The dates of some of these public holidays vary from year to year.All this discussion is disheartening and unfortunately counter to the spirit with which we all embarked. Looking at the wider map of caminos why not investigate the less trodden paths: e.g., Budapest-Wien-Linz-Salzburg-Graz-Zagreb-Triest?
This is so worrisome. We are going a year from now and the main appeal of this entire journey is to be able to flow with each day and not have to plan ahead ( except for the first two nights). Now I'm wondering if this is really the case of we should reconsider doing the French way and do another one instead. Anybody else have thoughts?First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
I've only done (so far) the Francés and the Norte (Norte in the summer), and I found that the Norte required more advanced planning than the Francés.This is so worrisome. We are going a year from now and the main appeal of this entire journey is to be able to flow with each day and not have to plan ahead ( except for the first two nights). Now I'm wondering if this is really the case of we should reconsider doing the French way and do another one instead. Anybody else have thoughts?
Yes I know who they belonged to but I am trying to be PC in this matter and keep my faith in the spiritual breakthrough my first Camino gave me. Saying any more would open up a can of worms and we may never get the lid back on. Enough to say I am very worried about where the camino is going.How odd. Did you talk to them? Did they perhaps belong to a Friends of the Camino association?
Thanks for your comments! I walked the Camino in 2014 & 2016. There was quite a difference in those two years. WIFI was spotty at best in 2014 but getting a bed was easy. In 2016 there was a lot more pilgrims, WIFI was available, and getting a bed was a bit more difficult!! I am thinking of walking in 2020, I’m 77 and this will probably be my last one, but would like to do a route less traveled! Any suggestions on alternates? ThanksNot necessarily. I just came off the Via de Bayona and have spent last night and tonight in old-fashioned old-school albergues. Tonight in San Nicholas near Itero de la Vega, and last night in San Anton. Last night there were 4 pilgrims for 12 places and the hospi said the night before (? not certain here, but it was some time this week) there was no-one. Nada. Tonight SN nay be full, maybe not.
The thundering herds want wifi and hot showers. One way of getting out of sync with them is to be happy with quiet snd simplicity. Unfortunately these options are now few and far between. So it is not much of a solution.
But if it works? Heaven. I spent the whole afternoon in San Anton reading and just sitting there soaking it in.
I beg to differ. The Frances IS crowded, no doubt about that
My unscientific impression is that there are way more people on this meseta stretch than last time I walked through here in 2016. But besides getting out of sync with the Frances herd, there are still plenty of options.
Many other routes are virtually empty.
As I hung out there yesterday afternoon, people helped themselves to the toilet, in spite of the 'privado' sign on the door....and left no donations.
All this discussion is disheartening and unfortunately counter to the spirit with which we all embarked. Looking at the wider map of caminos why not investigate the less trodden paths: e.g., Budapest-Wien-Linz-Salzburg-Graz-Zagreb-Triest?
Dave, I totally agree with you and think it is worth questioning one's motives to do a Camino versus the limits of one's comfort zone.Perhaps one reason is that many pilgrims want to end their pilgrimage in Santiago de Compostela for the purpose of visiting the Cathedral and the Tomb of St James. Of course, there are many Caminos that end in Compostela, but some of those are likewise seeing growth and increased pilgrim traffic.
Dave, I totally agree with you and think it is worth questioning one's motives to do a Camino versus the limits of one's comfort zone.
I have arrived in SdC as many times as I have stopped short and walked for a few weeks somewhere in Spain, there are many great trails to follow.
On Monday I leave for Le Puy en Velay to walk to Cahors, granted it has taken me some work to make sure I have bookings along the Cele Valle variant, but after Cahors I plan to jump ahead to Burgos and walk the CF across the Meseta for 3 weeks to Ponferrada and call it quits. The only reservations I have in Spain are at Norte y Londres, San Zoilo and Hospederia Monastica Pax.
I realize it is more expensive, but fond another pilgrim, if you are alone,First let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
OooFirst let me say that I love the Camino, have done many routes, and always walked in the spring (holy week included). I don't want to complain, but to warn other Pilgrims about the apparently new reservation system. In April my husband and I began walking at St. Jean Pied de Port for a repeat of the Camino Frances. We found the town of Valcarlos completely booked, and when we arrived at Roncesvalles we were told it was completo due to the "new reservations policy". I am talking about the Monastery. We were exhausted but went to the Tourist information and they were totally unhelpful: no help in reserving, calling a taxi, etc. Two bus loads of people showed up an hour after we were turned away and took the beds we had been denied. We walked on to Burquette: totally booked. Pilgrims were desperate. A kind hotel person took pity on me after informing me that the next 2 towns were fully booked as well. He called a camping area a few kilometers off of the main route and reserved one of the last places for us. We walked on down the main road and had to hurry to get food before their dining area closed. The next day Viskarette was fully booked and we slogged on to Zubiri without stopping. Pilgrims were literally running down the steep hill and I kept thinking "There goes my bed". Upon arrival we learned Zubiri and Larasoanna were both completo. There were dozens of dazed Pilgrims milling around trying to figure out what to do, and the shop keepers were completely unhelpful. Who could blame them, as they were over run by all of us. No taxis were available. Finally a Danish couple secured a taxi via phone and it created a riot when it arrived. I felt sick having to say "We 4 booked it and we are taking it" to fellow Pilgrims. As we were going up the hill in Pamplona I felt terrible seeing Pilgrims trudge up the hill with their packs, knowing I was taking their beds. We did get into the Jesus and Maria Albergue, where we saw a sign listing the price for Pilgrims, groups, non Pilgrims and TOURISTS! What? They are now letting anyone stay, and make reservations as well? We were grateful for a bed, but spent 3 hours on email and phone trying to secure reservations for the next week. The next day going up the Alto de Perdon my knee gave out, and the short story is I tore my meniscus and had to end our Camino due to overuse. I would normally have taken 6 days to cover the distance that I was forced to do in 3 days, as I am 65 and my husband is 70. We went on to be tourists in Portugal so it was a nice "vacation", but I am now facing surgery. That night in Puenta La Reina, as I had arrived by taxi and saw Pilgrims being turned away by 1:00 because everything was full, 10 beds went empty in an Albergue that has 40 beds. The same with the next night! This is terrible that people make reservations and do not bother to cancel them, depriving others of a place to sleep. So back to "not complaining": Making reservations is not the end of the world and should not deter you from doing the Camino. In France we needed reservations every night, and knowing this we just planned a bit differently. I am sorry to say that the days of walking just as far as you feel like and getting a bed at 1:00 in the afternoon are finished. This new reservations policy is quite broken, and I hope they reconsider it. In the mean time, plan your stops a bit in advance, and make reservations to ensure your bed. A phone that works in Spain is a must. I only received 1 reply to my queries via email.
Find another pilgrim and use booking.com. I have never been disappointed. A day's walk is so much nicer when you do not need to worry about a bed.Dave, I totally agree with you and think it is worth questioning one's motives to do a Camino versus the limits of one's comfort zone.
I have arrived in SdC as many times as I have stopped short and walked for a few weeks somewhere in Spain, there are many great trails to follow.
On Monday I leave for Le Puy en Velay to walk to Cahors, granted it has taken me some work to make sure I have bookings along the Cele Valle variant, but after Cahors I plan to jump ahead to Burgos and walk the CF across the Meseta for 3 weeks to Ponferrada and call it quits. The only reservations I have in Spain are at Norte y Londres, San Zoilo and Hospederia Monastica Pax.
Hi, is the screenshot of a particular app for the Camino? thank you
GronzeHi, is the screenshot of a particular app for the Camino? thank you
I am not sure I understand your response. I chose to walk alone and prefer not to disturb my peace and quiet with the chatter of walking with someone else.Find another pilgrim and use booking.com. I have never been disappointed. A day's walk is so much nicer when you do not need to worry about a bed.
When I was a hospi at San Anton, we would have a "busload" of tourists show up every few days. They were normally all from the same country and would come in to snap photos and listen to our interpretation of some of the architecture. The best part was they left small donations in the donativo jar and rarely demanded to use the toilet.
Edit added on 1 June:
One of my favorite stories was to tell visitors about San Anton's constant companion, a pig, which is immortalized in this stone work.
View attachment 58394
True. Depending on where you are on your way to Saint James, you may get caught out by a public holiday and the shops are closed and you risk starvation ... Whitsun Monday, Fronleichnam, 14 juillet, the 15th of August are coming up next ... but I think the three I mentioned are the ones with the greatest surge of the demand for pilgrim beds in SJPP and Roncesvalles.There are a lot more French and Spanish holidays left on the calendar for 2019.
Yes, I've received the same response from several albergues. Groups are booking an entire place.I attempted to make reservations yesterday at Albergue Casa de la Abuela in Los Arcos for Oct 4th which is forty-four (44) days from now. I was told the entire place is booked (private rooms & bunks) "with a big group coming from Corea". OP, seems your experience is going to be more common.
What a great idea! I'd be in on it but I imagine there's a lot of red tape to go through, either renting or purchasing the properties. Prefab's would be perfect and IKEA-type decor.As there is no one organization that coordinates rules or policies all along the Camino, nothing will change long term. It is up to the locals to force democratizing this process once again (e.g. first come first served, walkers get first dibs). We pilgrims can do little to affect this. Moreover, human nature being what it is, don't hold your breath for changes.
The only thing we can do is boycott by not doing Camino. But THAT sort of defeats the entire process doesn't it?
One solution, which also ain't gonna happen, is for some enterprising business person to develop a chain of inexpensive, standardized, private albergues, using off the shelf light industrial prefabricated buildings. Once erected and decorated on a reinforced slab, you would not easily tell the difference. Each location can be locally themed and decorated. Think the lowest category of IBIS hotels, then subtract features so as to get to pilgrim necessities.
The modern esthetic aside, this is a virtual 'no brainer' business model. It would have a separate, non-Booking.com (with the 15% commission) reservation system. Besides "IKEA new" kind of has a quality all its own.
I know this will never happen. But, IMHO and solely along the Frances, this is I believe the ultimate solution. Were I the Great Poobah, it would be done already.
Just trying to add to the dialog...
We’ve just had the long Ascension weekend. Ascension Day is always on a Thursday and it is a public holiday in a number of European countries. So there was apparently “a big influx of pilgrims” in SJPP and the welcome office said on their FB page that nobody has to sleep outside and they will always find a solution. I can’t link to the photo they published today to illustrate it so I’m pasting it here and hope this is allowed.
So just note this in your calendars for SJPP/Roncesvalles: Easter week/Easter weekend, 1st of May bridge , Ascension weekend ........
I attempted to make reservations yesterday at Albergue Casa de la Abuela in Los Arcos for Oct 4th which is forty-four (44) days from now. I was told the entire place is booked (private rooms & bunks) "with a big group coming from Corea". OP, seems your experience is going to be more common.
I tend to be oblivious about what other folks do, so last September when I was on the Camino Portugues for the first time I was amazed to learn that everyone else used their phones to reserve rooms and to figure out where they are. I don't have a cell phone so was clueless as to how the rest of the world lives on them. It made me sad that so few pilgrims will now understand what we mean when we say "The Camino will provide."It's funny how much a year can change things. This time last year when I was researching to do my camino Frances this year most of the comments said don't reserve you will be compelled to walk were you have your reservation instead of walking till your body feels like stopping. Well so much for stopping when your body is tired, it's walk to your reservation.
My first temptation was to say "It's funny how much a week can change things" but we have other threads for that topic.It's funny how much a year can change things. This time last year when I was researching to do my camino Frances this year most of the comments said don't reserve you will be compelled to walk were you have your reservation instead of walking till your body feels like stopping. Well so much for stopping when your body is tired, it's walk to your reservation.
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