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Another flasher on the Camino near Rabanal del Camino

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Stephen

Active Member
Camino(s) past & future
Twice walked from St Jean to Estella and once from Sarria to Santiago. Maybe someday I'll find the time to do the entire walk.
I've found the time. Just completed SJPP to Santiago. 25 Aug to 1st Oct, 2016.
And now the Portuguese from Lisbon.
#1
I was walking about 100 mts behind a group of French women, passing a forest area about 2km from Rabanal del Camino, when I heard them burst into shrieks of laughter. When I reached the place where they'd been I saw a man standing among the trees with his trousers and pants around his ankles.
Their laughing was probably the best reaction but things might have been different if a woman on her own had encountered him.
It would be a shame if reports of this kind of behaviour put anyone off walking, but to be forewarned is to be forearmed.
 

natefaith

Moderator
Staff member
Camino(s) past & future
Sarria-Santiago (2009)
León-Ponferrada (2014)
Camino Inglés (2017)
#3
Our goal is to repeat this statement: https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...women-on-the-camino-tips-from-the-mods.47474/ every time an incident is mentioned here on the forum.

There is continuing concern about incidents affecting female pilgrims. We reiterate the advice given by a number of pilgrim associations and the Spanish authorities:

Before you set out, programme the emergency number 112 into your telephone.

Consider downloading this App issued by the Spanish government:

https://alertcops.ses.mir.es/mialertcops/info/info.xhtml

The app allows anyone in Spain to send an alert from a mobile device "smartphone'"straight to the police..

If you feel threatened or uncomfortable or if you are assaulted in any way TRY TO REMOVE yourself to a place of safety immediately

Call the police – the best number to use is 112 which covers all of Spain (and much of Europe) and which has operators who speak English.

And please, please, REPORT all incidents to the police. Too many of these unlawful aggressions are never reported, which means that the full extent of the problem is hidden from the authorities.
 

Coleen Clark

Active Member
Camino(s) past & future
Walked August 2015, planning on walking August 2017
#4
I would definitely alert the police with a call to 112.
But I am reminded of an incident in the grocery store where I looked over at a guy who was trying to get my attention. He was flashing me and all I could think of saying was "Thanks. I almost forgot to get baby carrots." He left. He was not smiling. My three little boys were giggling, and I had to have a talk with them afterwards about showing their stuff. I'm pretty sure the lesson got thru to them, and they were not traumatized by the whole incident. That is the whole reason I kept it light and made it a learning experience.
I can't vouch for the perp if he was traumatized or not. I think he may never eat baby carrots again.
 
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances , St Jean Pied de Port - Finisterra May/ June 2017
Le Puy en Velay - Ales May 2018
#5
In a world that was fair and equitable this would have been a time for these women to be assertive , especially in this circumstance where a group were concerned . Surround the lowlife quickly and while his pants are down overbalance him till he lands on his ; presumably naked bum , hopefully onto mud or rocks .
How unfortunate that this just can't happen safely.
 

notion900

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
>
#7
Each time we get a report like this, it seems that someone who has never been in this situation will reply suggesting women attack the flasher. I understand where the impulse for this kind of response comes from, and it's well intentioned, but I think, highly inappropriate. Men attacked by women are likely to become more violent to other women in future, not less. Even laughing at them could increase their existing lack of respect for women and make it far worse for other women in future. I do understand that laughing is a nervous reaction linked to embarrassment, and some women can't help but do that in this situation, but I actually think being laughed at could contribute to a man becoming a rapist, to 'teach women a lesson'.

The appropriate response is to remove yourself from the situation, leaving your backpack behind if you need to run, and memorising everything you can about the individual, and immediately report it to the police. If you are attacked, of course, use every means necessary to defend yourself, but advice to attack the man shows absolutely no understanding of the situation whatsoever.

Could the mods address this trend please?
 
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Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances , St Jean Pied de Port - Finisterra May/ June 2017
Le Puy en Velay - Ales May 2018
#8
I don't believe anyone has suggested ''attacking the flasher''.
The comment was qualified by '' How unfortunate that this just can't happen safely.'' because of course the '' World'' is not '' Fair and equitable ''
It was meant as a lament that such situations cannot be dealt with in such a way as to allow women to retaliate .
To suggest Moderators address '' this trend '' is also presumptive , must all women run , scream and hide , or cower behind the nearest bush ?
Not all women are physically inept , I have been fortunate to associate with a number who could quite literally tear such an offenders arms off .
 
Camino(s) past & future
----
#9
Even laughing at them could increase their existing lack of respect for women and make it far worse for other women in future. I do understand that laughing is a nervous reaction linked to embarrassment, and some women can't help but do that in this situation, but I actually think being laughed at could contribute to a man becoming a rapist, to 'teach women a lesson'.
Thank you for this comment, @notion900. I think it is the first time that someone points this out on this forum (i.e. laughing as a nervous reaction). Many anectodes and no doubt well-meant advice in the forum threads want to teach us that we should laugh at and ridicule an exhibitionist or person who masturbates in public and in full view, narratives that are often presented with a veiled reference to penis size.

There is most certainly some danger that this can increase frustration and anger that may be acted out on another woman at another time and place in a more aggressive form. I wish posters would refrain from this kind of advice.
 
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CaminoDebrita

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances SJPP to SdC Oct/Nov 2015
Frances Burgos toSdC March/April 2016
W. Highland Way August 2016
Camino Somewhere September 2017
#10
I think that most of the people here are adults, well-intentioned, and many are very well educated.

To presume that the mods and even those posting here have not been down (ed. for misspelling) this conversation path would be off mark. We've been here before--oh, yes, many a time.

I think the majority of women here are also well-experienced in the ways of this naughty world, and while the advice to program in 112, remove oneself, and avoid laughing are all good bits of advice--the reality is that each woman or group of women will react a bit differently.

In the situation, which is not well practiced, different responses will kick in.

Just as in Leon, when a man who was following me and my companions--in fact, I had sternly admonished one to STOP conversing with him and WALK quickly on--seized me by both shoulders and moved in for a kiss.

My response was to shove him so hard with both hands on his shoulders that he flew backwards. Flew. Then, I walked on. One just never knows what the right response will be, and while a mental rehearsing is helpful, it is not muscle memory.

As most online, I'm a mature adult and have also (sadly) been in these situations many times, although with a few years on me, seem to be losing my supreme appeal! (a side benefit of maturity).
 

notion900

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
>
#11
I don't believe anyone has suggested ''attacking the flasher''.
The comment was qualified by '' How unfortunate that this just can't happen safely.'' because of course the '' World'' is not '' Fair and equitable ''
It was meant as a lament that such situations cannot be dealt with in such a way as to allow women to retaliate .
To suggest Moderators address '' this trend '' is also presumptive , must all women run , scream and hide , or cower behind the nearest bush ?
Not all women are physically inept , I have been fortunate to associate with a number who could quite literally tear such an offenders arms off .
We do 'retaliate' - by using the force of law, not by descending to a brawl which will only make it far far worse for the next woman who follows us. Perhaps you could read my report of my recent experience which nowhere mentions me hiding, screaming or cowering.
 
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Annie Little

Active Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances Sept-Oct 2016
#12
Even without my pack I would not be able to outrun anyone .
I have my own plan which involves ignoring and keep moving BUT if someone advances towards me in a menancing way or flashes and tries to come closer I WILL defend myself ! by using poles and a small tin of hair spray which I keep in side pocket of pack for such occasions .
I will remember that these perpetrators are cowards BUT I am NOT
 
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