- Time of past OR future Camino
- May 2023: Via Francigena, Lucca to Rome
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Here's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
Yeup. 3 coworkers said they wanted to walk in 2019. So they dragged me to dinner and Gad je tell them about planning and details. None of them ever hiked in their lives and all were out of shape and overweight. So I started by emphasizing that they needed to change some things in their lives and start working out.
Here we are 6 months later and not one of them has made any plans. But they keep “talking” about it.
Lol!
I am disappointed for them. They seemed so sincere and the spiritual aspect really resonated with them. They were never going to walk with my husband and me, but I had hoped they’d at least try a short Camino on their own. I gave them short easy options. Oh well.
As with all things in life. there is Talk and there is Do
I am disappointed for them. They seemed so sincere and the spiritual aspect really resonated with them. They were never going to walk with my husband and me, but I had hoped they’d at least try a short Camino on their own. I gave them short easy options. Oh well.
I really hope s/he will eventually go for it.Funny, I’ve only had one person express sincere interest in walking. Most just think it’s crazy and something they’d never want to do.
I'd be happy for a sibling or parent to join me for a day of a Camino. I'd be careful to choose a stage where the walk would be pleasant and not too long for them. The thought of adjusting my pace and preferences to walk with them for a week or more doesn't appeal. Perhaps you could coordinate dates to have a family member (or members) join you for a short day of walking, and then let them go do the touristy things that interest them in whatever city or region you choose, while you continue to walk?I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
As with all things in life. there is Talk and there is Do
Or as one little guru put it, a few years ago.........
"Do or Do Not, there is no Try"
Hmmm don’t be too quick to judge. When planning for my first Camino I read on the net that 90% of people never train at all. I Kinda wish I’d never read that.Yeup. 3 coworkers said they wanted to walk in 2019. So they dragged me to dinner and asjed nme to tell them about planning and details. None of them has ever hiked in their lives and all were out of shape and overweight. So I started by emphasizing that they needed to change some things in their lives and start working out.
Here we are 6 months later and not one of them has made any plans. But they keep “talking” about it.
Lol!
I really get that. Half the fun for me is being solo.My 'potential' future Camino friends all say "I would really like to do it some day" - some day being the key ....
... but, just the thought of joyriders jumping on to my next Camino?? I shudder, I really do!
Wow that’s kind of sadIn general, most who are attracted don't talk about doing it with me some day but that it would be nice to do. A much more abstractly expressed desire. There were two exceptions.
About five years ago, I started talking about walking the Camino when I retired. My fourteen year old son said he would like to do it with me. I had promised him a trip with me when he was sixteen. He suggested walking the Camino then and walked the whole way with me to Finisterre in 2016.
After I got back, I wrote an article about the experience in the newsletter at work. I did get an interesting response from one person. Not the usual "I'd like to do that some day" but "You mean you are allowed to take rest days and don't have to walk the Brierly stages exactly as written?". She had started walking the Camino but had pushed herself too hard and had to stop at Leon due to medical issues. She talked about trying again sometime, with this new knowledge, if she could get the time off work.
Wow that’s kind of sad- she was beating to another drummer.
I found some of the best etapes were in non-Brierley villages. I learned to avoid Brierley stops wherever possible.Sadly not that uncommon. Many people walking the Caminos have little previous experience of long-distance walking and lack the experience or confidence to plan their own stages. As it is the most popular English-language guide they often assume that Brierley's stages are the norm and manageable for a newcomer. I have met a number of people who struggled with them but had already committed themselves to Brierley's stages by pre-booking accommodation and their travel home.
I always explain that the only way to walk a Camino is on your own - I need to walk at my own pace and not have the distraction of being responsible for somebody apart from me. Obviously I will offer assistance to other Pilgrims if needed but on the whole walking alone is best as in reality on the Camino you are never alone.Here's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
You misunderstand. I wasn't judging them. It was an assessment based on knowledge. They just haven't done anything to plan and aren't going to actually go. And for them, yes, training is a big issue. You just don't have all the facts. The point is, many people say they want to walk and then realize how hard it is and don't get any further than just talking.Hmmm don’t be too quick to judge. When planning for my first Camino I read on the net that 90% of people never train at all. I Kinda wish I’d never read that.
I trained 1x week for 8 Weeks before leaving, with my longest walk being 2.5 hrs wearing a waterpack.
My first day on the Camino I walked 24k with a 7kg pack. Over the 16 days I walked between 16-32 k /day. I’d never walked before and am about 8kgs overweight. I got one blister, one black toenail and I found up to 22ks easy, up to 32ks was a little taxing. It took me 5 days to get comfortably into stride. On The Way I met a very walk experienced fit lady in her 60’s who comfortably walked 32-36k/day. She said it always takes her the first week to “adjust” wherever she walks.
So don’t discount your friends for not training to your method, Providing they have a good attitude not training won’t be an issue.
I'm going to be bummed just a little bit, because I genuinely believe a camino would speak to them, and the twist to the story is: we decided to walk the Tour du Mont Blanc as a family instead. And that will be incredible. But I'm also bemused that they don't balk at an 11-day backpacking trip in the Alps, but that they were intimidated by the unknown of a "camino." I have a couple theories on why this is, but it'll be a long digression & I might make another thread on that.MichaelC: I can relate, but don’t let it bring you down. ... If my family members and friends actually join me in ‘21, great; if not, then that’s OK too.
I can relate to this. I have certain friends who I feel would really relate to the Camino. Others who have a deep desire to walk but are intimidated. I try to give gentle support, and share stories about the wide variety of people I met. I hope some of them walk one day. But also ...I am disappointed for them. They seemed so sincere and the spiritual aspect really resonated with them. They were never going to walk with my husband and me, but I had hoped they’d at least try a short Camino on their own. I gave them short easy options. Oh well.
I've got those friends too! More of them than the spiritual kind, really. If I were to organize everything, and play team leader, I could rally an easy dozen to join me. And I genuinely like planning adventure vacations, and have friends who've followed me to jungles, mountains, and deserts ... but I also shudder at the idea of being any kind of team leader on a Camino*. It just doesn't feel right to me.My 'potential' future Camino friends all say "I would really like to do it some day" - some day being the key ....
... but, just the thought of joyriders jumping on to my next Camino?? I shudder, I really do!
Yeah. That'll be the plan when I venture out onto a pilgrim trail again!Always better on your own I think
Sleeping in albergues was one of the biggest "stepping outside my comfort zone" experiences for me on my Camino. Prior to my Camino, I'd never slept a night in a hostel of any sort, and the only experiences I'd had sleeping in bunks in a room with many other people hadn't gone so well. In retrospect, I'm so glad I stayed in albergues. All the close relationships I formed came from meeting people at albergues. My biggest fear in walking the Camino was that I'd be lonely. Staying in albergues helped ensure that that fear was never realized. That is hard to explain to people.I'm going to be bummed just a little bit, because I genuinely believe a camino would speak to them, and the twist to the story is: we decided to walk the Tour du Mont Blanc as a family instead. And that will be incredible. But I'm also bemused that they don't balk at an 11-day backpacking trip in the Alps, but that they were intimidated by the unknown of a "camino." I have a couple theories on why this is, but it'll be a long digression & I might make another thread on that.
I can relate to this. I have certain friends who I feel would really relate to the Camino. Others who have a deep desire to walk but are intimidated. I try to give gentle support, and share stories about the wide variety of people I met. I hope some of them walk one day. But also ...
I've got those friends too! More of them than the spiritual kind, really. If I were to organize everything, and play team leader, I could rally an easy dozen to join me. And I genuinely like planning adventure vacations, and have friends who've followed me to jungles, mountains, and deserts ... but I also shudder at the idea of being any kind of team leader on a Camino*. It just doesn't feel right to me.
Yeah. That'll be the plan when I venture out onto a pilgrim trail again!
*edit: unless it were my paying job - then I'd jump at the chance!!!
let's just accept that the reasons, the joy, the satisfaction/ peace/ connection we all have found in our Caminos is not meant for every one
Like pushing love and marriage because we are so happy, or the latest book or ... we were called or found ourselves on the Way, but not every one has to find THEIR way on The Way
people can be pulled into our excitement especially if they have not found their own solution. It is temping to try and suck that energy up from someone else who has the passion and drive. But as we know, someone's energy will not sustain someone else
My suggestion? Let it be. They may not be mentally ready. They may not really want this at all even if it sounds good. And we may be trying to convince them of a Camino when their path is meant to be somewhere else
Nanc
How very true.
I had never heard of the Camino until I watched 'that' movie.
Then I felt I had to go.
It was the emotional and spiritual aspect that drew me in.
And whilst that was 'only' a movie, the whole experience for that first time was very similar.
I think if people are not 'drawn' to it it some way, it will be hard for them to imagine what it will be like and why they might enjoy the experience.
During summer, I see the beaches packed with people.
I just don't get it............
People actually go on holidays for weeks at a time, to sit on a beach
Go figure.............. I'd be bored senseless. (and Yes I've tried it)
It's funny, but people assume I must love bush walking back here in Australia.
Not really.
I do a short circuit near our home when Camino training, that's all.
Then they say, "But you must really enjoy walking"
And my response is generally something like..........
The Camino really isn't about walking.............
Maybe that's the 'disconnect' that many potential Pilgrims have. That stops them trying it.
They think it's all about a long walk ........
It took me 4 years from getting to know about Camino to actually doing it. I'm sure I was a pain in the backside for many friends and family pestering them for info and my achievements in preparation.Yeup. 3 coworkers said they wanted to walk in 2019. So they dragged me to dinner and asjed nme to tell them about planning and details. None of them has ever hiked in their lives and all were out of shape and overweight. So I started by emphasizing that they needed to change some things in their lives and start working out.
Here we are 6 months later and not one of them has made any plans. But they keep “talking” about it.
Lol!
Yup, every complication becomes a distraction. Find your “family” where you encounter them, and then walk with or without them.Always better on your own I think
Funny, I’ve only had one person express sincere interest in walking. Most just think it’s crazy and something they’d never want to do.
Yes, i had that experience! Planned my camino only because two good friends agreed to be along. They dropped out, of course. So glad they did, enjoyed being alone so much. Besides, one is never truly alone on the camino! (So, do you want a walking partner, or are you just kidding?!)Here's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
After 8 solo trips my then (2017) 20 year old daughter asked if she could join me. I booked the flight immediately and Santa brought everything she would need for the adventure. In May we did Porto to Santiago and she was amazing. Caught on to the bohemian lifestyle imposed by the Camino without any hesitation. Like all my other camino’s this was a completely different experience but somehow more satisfying.Here's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
Agree wholeheartedly. Did my first Camino this year all on my own from Villaviciosa to Oviedo and then the Camino Primitivo to Santiago and on to Muxia and Finisterre. Also plan on doing mire, but if I ever walk with someone it will be a very careful selection to get the right partner.Always better on your own I think
You are currently in charge of your hiking destiny. Don't let anyone encroach on that liberty for any reason. And that's my final offer.Here's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
Yes! All I hear is, "Why would you want to do that???" They think we are crazy for wanting to try it. They are comfortable in their daily routines and do not want to be uncomforable. But my husband and I are going to try it in March and we will see for ourselves. I guess some people don't care about the adventure.Funny, I’ve only had one person express sincere interest in walking. Most just think it’s crazy and something they’d never want to do.
Most definitely!!! Learned that the hard way....but learnedAlways better on your own I think
Here's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
It’s all about motivation and reason, I did frances last year carrrying the Roll of Honour Afghanistan from the Australian War Memorial and laid 4 poppies for the 41 who dies. I herniated my L4-L5 disc in my back 5 km outside of Burgos and nothing was going to stop me laying those poppies on the shores of FinisterreHere's a conversation I just had with some of my family that caught me totally off guard - and I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's had this!
The relative: Are you really planning on walking again?
Me: Definitely. It was a special time. I really want to walk again.
Relative: Let me know. I'd love to go with you.
Me: That would be amazing. (Thinking: I needed to walk alone the first time, but I would love to walk with family a second time). I'm thinking about doing a couple weeks on the Via Francigena in Italy soon ...
Sister: I'm in!
Cousin: I'm in!
Brother: I'm in!
So I put together some potential plans, and presented it to them.
Sister: You mean we walk every single day?
Cousin: You mean we would walk for two weeks???
Brother: I could join you for a day ...
And I think: what exactly did they think I was doing for three months last year???
Neither had I.None of them has ever hiked in their lives and all were out of shape and overweight.
I saw many pilgrims, those who were in fantastic physical shape, real athletes. I saw them up at the crack of dawn each morning, breezing along the path like it was nothing, passing my fat butt who was huffing and puffing after half a mile on flat ground like I was standing still. I'd hear them say that the Camino was "too easy" and they wanted a real challenge. Then I'd see them a week later, ankles taped up, wearing knee braces, feet shredded from blisters, and catching a bus to the airport to take them back home.So I started by emphasizing that they needed to change some things in their lives and start working out.
I decided to walk the Camino in 2012. It took me until 2014 to actually get there. Those 2 years were not spent diligently planning either. Most of it was just dreaming. I spent a lot of the previous year working long hours and overtime in hopes of going, but I didn't think I would actually go. But in February of that year, I looked at the calendar and at my bank account and decided that it might be now or never. So I booked a ticket that would take me to Paris. I knew to take the train to St. Jean Pied de Port. And I knew I had to be back in Paris in 43 days to get back home. But after I stepped off the train in St. Jean, I had no plans after that. But 35 days later, I walked into Santiago.Here we are 6 months later and not one of them has made any plans. But they keep “talking” about it.
Lol!
To my dear friend. Happy holiday and you obviously didn’t remember my invite to walk with my college buddies. I have 3 definite commitments and 1 maybe. Come on with us. Maybe a November Francis and home in time for Christmas shopping for your wife. I give Silvia and the girls cash. Sílvia says I am such a romantic but they all get what they need not what I want to give them. Just like the Camino!!!Funny, I’ve only had one person express sincere interest in walking. Most just think it’s crazy and something they’d never want to do.
That's interesting. I've just finished reading the introduction by Melczer to his English translation of the 12th century pilgrims guide and according to his research, medieval pilgrims almost always travelled in groups. I wonder how you came to such different conclusions.To me there is a difference between pilgrimage alone (but not ever alone) and Camino with others ... I make no judgements, each are valid - but if someone needs 'pilgrimage' they need to travel alone. Starting with others is a tourist walk - enjoyable, and with wonderful memories, but not a pilgrimage.
From the beginnings of religious writings, some thousands of years ago, it was always made clear that pilgrimage is a solo journey - whether one lives or dies, a solo journey.
This is, of course, only my opinion, but it is backed up by a history of thousands of years of clear writings.
Buen Camino, to all xxx
That's interesting. I've just finished reading the introduction by Melczer to his English translation of the 12th century pilgrims guide and according to his research, medieval pilgrims almost always travelled in groups. I wonder how you came to such different conclusions.
A monk, a hermit, and a friar sit down in a bar and talk about how to get closer to God.Hi David - true, in more dangerous times most pilgrims moved in groups for safety. Also, medieval pilgrimage was a different thing than today - Chaucer's Canterbury Tales shows that. I should have been more clear really. Since ancient times those on an 'inner journey' have travelled alone, even if they had joined a group for safety.
The outward journey may have seemed as a group but the inner journey was as a lone person. Even today a solo pilgrim moves as part of a loose group, from the other pilgrims we meet along the way.
If a person goes, say, on a religious retreat, they go alone and their electronic devices are taken off them on arrival - there is a reason for that. It is about giving oneself the time for introspection, silence, going through the 'boredom' to something else, and it works. Pilgrimage is, or should be, exactly the same, don't you think?
The thread is about taking friends and/or family along, so my point was that one cannot have an inner journey whilst talking about how Steve is doing with building his garage, or what Tracey said at work ... nor indeed by phoning home all the time, or checking emails and Facebook, posting another photo of another meal, ear-podding music ... one cannot be fully in two places at the same time, so one needs to leave home behind if one wants to be fully on pilgrimage - and - to me - this also goes with taking folk from home with you ... the experience is a different one, filled with chatter about what is going on at home .. filled with having to discuss every single choice ... so, again, to me, there is a difference between the two - and only one is a pilgrimage, the other is closer to a walking holiday.
They are equally valid of course, just that there is a difference and I prefer to go alone, walk alone, make my own decisions, and meet people along the way.
Always better on your own I think
Based on how 2019 is shaping up, my next Camino is looking to be Feb/Mar of 2020. You should join me!To my dear friend. Happy holiday and you obviously didn’t remember my invite to walk with my college buddies. I have 3 definite commitments and 1 maybe. Come on with us. Maybe a November Francis and home in time for Christmas shopping for your wife. I give Silvia and the girls cash. Sílvia says I am such a romantic but they all get what they need not what I want to give them. Just like the Camino!!!
I may be able to swing it. Given your pace and mine we start off in the morning together and the. Blow by me. We can meet for lunch and you can save me a lower bunk at night. Given I will be 66 in March 2020 I will only be doing 20-25k a day max! Speaking of Max maybe I can get our boy to join us. Then you can help me pay for part of his food when he is short on money and wants a third Pilgrim menu.Based on how 2019 is shaping up, my next Camino is looking to be Feb/Mar of 2020. You should join me!
I thought it was Pooh who mentioned that long agoAh, a Yoda reference... Loved it!
That would be outstanding! I'm not sure about the "blowing by you" part though. With a torn lateral meniscus on my left knee, I'm having to be more careful these days.I may be able to swing it. Given your pace and mine we start off in the morning together and the. Blow by me. We can meet for lunch and you can save me a lower bunk at night. Given I will be 66 in March 2020 I will only be doing 20-25k a day max! Speaking of Max maybe I can get our boy to join us. Then you can help me pay for part of his food when he is short on money and wants a third Pilgrim menu.
I’m proud of youIt’s all about motivation and reason, I did frances last year carrrying the Roll of Honour Afghanistan from the Australian War Memorial and laid 4 poppies for the 41 who dies. I herniated my L4-L5 disc in my back 5 km outside of Burgos and nothing was going to stop me laying those poppies on the shores of Finisterre
I think it's more that the ambiguity of the caminos is really foreign to most of us in America. We get hikes like the Tour du Mont Blanc. There's a set hiking trail. You meet other hikers on the trail. You hike to set stops. There are refugios geared towards hikers. These things are easy for us to conceptualize.MichaelC: Just wondering if perhaps your family mbrs might be put off by the spiritual/religious connotations of the Camino as a pilgrimage. I’ve encountered that with some of my more agnostic LOs. For our upcoming Camino one brother, thankfully, is committed and is really stoked. The way I’ve couched it for others is as “an opportunity of a lifetime”. If they feel so moved, they’ll come; but if not, maybe it’s just not the right time. Sounds like you’ve planted the seed.
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