- Time of past OR future Camino
- Many, various, and continuing.
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wayfarer said:The Camino is for those who choose to walk it, regardless....
Hi Scruffy,scruffy1 said:There is entirely too much agreement on this subject
Rebekah Scott said:(For the record: Not all the Jews on the camino or on the forum feel it´s important to identify themselves as such. And not all Israelis are Jewish.)
As for the Original Posting:
I am not being provocative. I do like to stimulate discussion and question presumptions, though. I do not set out to discourage potential pilgrims, but I do hope they will take a good look at themselves and their motivations and attitudes before they come here. The camino is not for everyone. It is hard and dirty and sometimes miserable, dull, expensive, rude, foreign, and frustrating. There are tons of Christians here, and Christian architecture and rituals and culture. And there are bedbugs, too. There is NO shame in bailing on it if you find it too much.
If you are hating this and want to head for the beach instead, first sleep on your decision. Make up your mind in the morning. If you still hate it then, get on the next train and go and enjoy yourself! I know a lot of people "stick it out" and finish up and maybe that makes them proud of themselves, but I feel sorry for the other pilgs who have to walk with them.
Just sayin.
Reb.
William Marques said:There are plenty of people who are much happier to spend their holidays on the beach and who think we are mad to put ourselves through what we do to to walk across Spain. Who is to say who is right.
I would drop the "SHOULD" and emphasize "if they have chosen to try".People change, grow and learn on the camino so I would suggest that those groups of people you've identified are perhaps exactly the type of people that SHOULD do the camino (if they have chosen to try!!).
The "Camino a Santiago" for me is a "Camino de la vida" in a nutshell. Where am I going, why and how? So I started with the latter: planning, budgeting, getting "ready", mentally and physically growing towards the goal. Then came reality: smells, sounds, feelings, reactions, opinions and long stretches of being alone with the winds, temperatures, distances, ups and downs, pains, thirst, hunger, wetness...and yet so many beautiful, memorable moments which ultimately superseded the hardships. The goal is Santiago, trust of afterlife, feeling a hand on your shoulder which presses "yes you can" but leaves you free to meet the challenges in your own way. This "is not for everyone".....maybe yet :?:Pieces said:...who should decide whether the Camino is for someone or not...
Oh dear! Did you get drunk as well? I ended up telling Reb all about my sordid love life! Buen Camino!Tincatinker said:My experience of the Peaceable is still one of joy and shame. There is no perfect life.
David said:good point Reb - good point. Exactly so.
As for those who 'diss' (criticise?) others for how far or not they walk, etc ...why do they do that? Funny thing is, I have never seen this yardstick that some pilgrims measure others by, is it on a Camino marker somewhere? ..... :wink:
The statistics from the Church in Santiago show the increase in the number of pilgrims who walk for "other" non-religious reasons.
Bama Hiker said:This is a good post and one I like being discussed. In preparing for my Camino walk with my brother later in 2013 or early 2014, we have noted many people walking as "tourists on a cheap vacation" rather than as pilgrims on a religious experience. The popularity of the movie "The Way" has brought a large number of recreational walkers and tourists to the Camino, who are changing the experience from a journey of Christian faith into some other type of tailored commercialized hiking vacation. We have already seen the decline of our Christian Christmas holiday into something completely the opposite of the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ. We are having to plan to walk in either the October-November or March-April time frames to avoid the "tourists." The statistics from the Church in Santiago show the increase in the number of pilgrims who walk for "other" non-religious reasons. We know it will be a bit more difficult to walk the Camino during these times due to the weather and the closure of many alberques. We just hope the Camino experience doesn't degrade into some type of cheap atheist vacation destination. Thanks for the post!
Bama Hiker said:This is a good post and one I like being discussed. In preparing for my Camino walk with my brother later in 2013 or early 2014, we have noted many people walking as "tourists on a cheap vacation" rather than as pilgrims on a religious experience. The popularity of the movie "The Way" has brought a large number of recreational walkers and tourists to the Camino, who are changing the experience from a journey of Christian faith into some other type of tailored commercialized hiking vacation. We have already seen the decline of our Christian Christmas holiday into something completely the opposite of the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ. We are having to plan to walk in either the October-November or March-April time frames to avoid the "tourists." The statistics from the Church in Santiago show the increase in the number of pilgrims who walk for "other" non-religious reasons. We know it will be a bit more difficult to walk the Camino during these times due to the weather and the closure of many alberques. We just hope the Camino experience doesn't degrade into some type of cheap atheist vacation destination. Thanks for the post!
Still a good subject for those prepared to discuss the very good original post.Rebekah Scott said:Sigh.
lizlane said:Until t
Kevin F. O*brien said:To Jubilado - thanks for your remarks! Why ? Because of course they reflect my thoughts entirely!! And this was what I assume Reb was trying to say. Several times I have assisted people in ending their Camino because either physical or emotional circumstances prevented them from continuing. Things just don't turn out the way we want them to occasionally, and anybody who has lived for a while should accept that. I also blame some of these books and films for giving people a false impression. I read many of the remarks with humility and respect and thanks to all who made a post or two.
Jubilado, I read about your being ill on the Levante and hope you will be back there soon. Let me know if there is anything you are wondering about. You will love it!!
Buen Camino para todos,
Kev
Glad to hear that Lizlane! Good luck with the new job! If you live for the next few months from spaghetti, lentils, bocadillos, bananas and yoghurt you will not only save enough money for the Camino but have a body that is perfectly trained for it!lizlane said:As for me, I started a new job today. A really well-paying one! :lol: So a Camino might just be in my future after all!
lizlane said:Nothing gets me more steamed than reading posts from people who DID have the chance and came away miserable! It really bothers me. Yet I suppose meeting the intolerant, the complainers, and the shallow here in the forum is truly preparation because such people are sure to be there as well! So I may as well get over it now.
tyrrek said:Oh dear! Did you get drunk as well?
PILGRIMSPLAZA said:http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=GBaHPND2QJg&feature=youtu.be
We're all pilgrims to our final destinations.
Merry Christmas & Happy New Year to all!
Jubilado said:tsetsgee said:I look forward to seeing how far I can push myself more mentally than physically,
It's a choice of course. But why would you want to do that?
Consider trying to benefit from an opportunity to escape striving and stress. It's a holiday from all that.
You say that you're not interested in Europe - fine- but if you are walking the Camino Francés it is Camino de Santiago, Camino de Europa.
CaminoGen said:Bama Hiker said:This is a good post and one I like being discussed. In preparing for my Camino walk with my brother later in 2013 or early 2014, we have noted many people walking as "tourists on a cheap vacation" rather than as pilgrims on a religious experience. The popularity of the movie "The Way" has brought a large number of recreational walkers and tourists to the Camino, who are changing the experience from a journey of Christian faith into some other type of tailored commercialized hiking vacation. We have already seen the decline of our Christian Christmas holiday into something completely the opposite of the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ. We are having to plan to walk in either the October-November or March-April time frames to avoid the "tourists." The statistics from the Church in Santiago show the increase in the number of pilgrims who walk for "other" non-religious reasons. We know it will be a bit more difficult to walk the Camino during these times due to the weather and the closure of many alberques. We just hope the Camino experience doesn't degrade into some type of cheap atheist vacation destination. Thanks for the post!
Wow! I hope you can check some of the attitude and stereotypes before you leave. As an atheist, I had the most wonderful conversations about religion with open-minded people from all over the world. Also, you will find that most people walking the camino don't wear their religion on their sleeves. Even though I'm an atheist (but baptized ), I participated in a lot of prayer circles and masses because I know and accept the history of the Camino Francès.
Bama Hiker said:This is a good post and one I like being discussed. In preparing for my Camino walk with my brother later in 2013 or early 2014, we have noted many people walking as "tourists on a cheap vacation" rather than as pilgrims on a religious experience. The popularity of the movie "The Way" has brought a large number of recreational walkers and tourists to the Camino, who are changing the experience from a journey of Christian faith into some other type of tailored commercialized hiking vacation. We have already seen the decline of our Christian Christmas holiday into something completely the opposite of the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ. We are having to plan to walk in either the October-November or March-April time frames to avoid the "tourists." The statistics from the Church in Santiago show the increase in the number of pilgrims who walk for "other" non-religious reasons. We know it will be a bit more difficult to walk the Camino during these times due to the weather and the closure of many alberques. We just hope the Camino experience doesn't degrade into some type of cheap atheist vacation destination. Thanks for the post!
It seems like we can have “hierarchy of sorts” in anything we do in life, IF we so choose. For me, I use the term “pilgrim” quite loosely. So, if we walk to Santiago we automatically become pilgrims because it is St. James’ resting place? BTW, I don’t think St. James was actually buried there, which does not diminish my walk in anyway. How about the walk from Le Puys to St Jean? As far as I know, there seems to be no significant remains of any saint at St. Jean. I like lindseh's invitation. Let’s open our hearts and minds to all who walk. I know for myself, my life has been enriched by my CF walk, not by the physical and concrete as much as the many wonderful souls that I had met on the way. Buen Camino! Hieuffp13 said:The Camino was and still is a Christian pilgrimage route to the final resting place of St James, those not walking the Way for religious reasons are still 'pilgrims' and may be referred to as 'cultural pilgrims' , or more harshly as camino tourists.
The Camino was and still is a Christian pilgrimage route
Yes, I'm sure the Catholic pilgrims get their benefits and rewards when they walk the Camino. I am equally sure that the "other" pilgrims also get their benefits and rewards when they walk the Camino. To each his/her own benefits and rewards. Buen Camino! Hieusillydoll said:There has always been a very clear hierarchy, and although the la Pretiosa claimed that 'all were welcome ....." the Camino's benefits and rewards were always restricted to members of the Roman Catholic Church, not to other Christians.The Camino was and still is a Christian pilgrimage route
I think this "subject under discussion" has been well and truly "derailed".Rebekah Scott said:I made that categorical statement in another thread, and a wise moderator suggested we take it elsewhere so as to not derail the subject under discussion there.
colinPeter said:re: The Camino Is Not For Everyone
I think this "subject under discussion" has been well and truly "derailed".Rebekah Scott said:I made that categorical statement in another thread, and a wise moderator suggested we take it elsewhere so as to not derail the subject under discussion there.
annakappa said:Sorry Ray2607, quoting you....
. It seems it would be most unfortunate for the Camino to become a place where only a certain group were allowed to participate. .......
Could you explain this sentence better? Thanks, Anne
Keep deleting Ivar, It doesn't seem any closer to getting back to "on topic".ivar said:Some posts in this thread has been deleted since they were way off topic.
Saludos,
Ivar
jastrace said:So when I am on the Camino, I don't care why people are there. I am grateful that they are there at the same time as me and I am able to meet them. I am grateful that I get to understand others a bit better and appreciate this amazing world we live in a bit better. I am grateful to be able to spend time in such an awesome country as Spain.
/quote]
Seconded
Yes, Spain is an absolutely wonderful place, full of wonderful people.jastrace said:..... I am grateful to be able to spend time in such an awesome country as Spain.
Jason.
Yes, some very good points in your post.Tia Valeria said:....For me it is the Camino Francés which doesn't feel right 'for me', .....
We are all different and for some 'the Way' (any route) just isn't 'the right way'. Nothing right or wrong in that, just a fact of life.
With some out-of-the-box thinking, they could have done it barefoot, with fifty pound packs, and at a 50 km per day clip! That would make up for the terrain and the soft beds.it was too easy!
Can they share those with us? I have been on several dozen GR routes, and none was difficult overall; just some stretches that require exertion, a bit like leaving Castrojeriz. Is there any chance they exaggerated the difficulty? I have a few friends whose walks are always a bit more difficult than anyone else's, usually after a beer or two.They opted for more challenging GR routes through France and Spain, of which there are many!
My friends decided the camino was not for them without ever setting foot on it.
They found the camino too "mindless"
Bama Hiker said:This is a good post and one I like being discussed. In preparing for my Camino walk with my brother later in 2013 or early 2014, we have noted many people walking as "tourists on a cheap vacation" rather than as pilgrims on a religious experience. The popularity of the movie "The Way" has brought a large number of recreational walkers and tourists to the Camino, who are changing the experience from a journey of Christian faith into some other type of tailored commercialized hiking vacation. We have already seen the decline of our Christian Christmas holiday into something completely the opposite of the reason we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ. We are having to plan to walk in either the October-November or March-April time frames to avoid the "tourists." The statistics from the Church in Santiago show the increase in the number of pilgrims who walk for "other" non-religious reasons. We know it will be a bit more difficult to walk the Camino during these times due to the weather and the closure of many alberques. We just hope the Camino experience doesn't degrade into some type of cheap atheist vacation destination. Thanks for the post!
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