- Time of past OR future Camino
- 2009-2022: CFx6, CP, VdlPx2, Mozarabe, more later.
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I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
Norway = Norge
Sweden = Sverige
Gothenburg = Gøteborg
Denmark = Danmark
Copenhagen = København
Italy = Italia
Rome = Roma
Venice = Venezia
Florence = Firenze
Tuscany = Toscana
Germany = Deutchland
Munich = Munchen
Switzerland = Schweitz
Spain = Espana
just to name a few,
and so many others. Why? Disrespect and ignorance, IMHO. Not to mention: The national names are more beautiful to pronounce than their English "correct" equivalents. Why is this so?
As you may notice, I try to write proper English, in respect of the English-speaking audience; But I do not feel that the rest of the world receives mutual respect for their laanguages with regards to names, at least...
Those of us here in Los Estados Unidos don't feel the Spanish mean any disrespect by referring to our country in their own language.
I guess you should be glad Tasman was Dutch and not French or you'd be dealing with a moniker derived from "Pays Bas."Most languages have their own versions of place names, to make them easier to pronounce - not necessarily disrespect or ignorance. England is Inglaterra in Spanish, Angleterre in French, Inghilterra in Italian and so on. España is Espagne in French and Spagna in Italian. Then there were those explorers (from all over Europe) who just assigned names to places that already had them, and the new ones stuck. Abel Tasman (Dutch) sailed past my country in 1642 and a Dutch cartographer later named it "Nieuw Zeeland" (because... it looks so much like the Netherlands??). There are Spanish, English, Portuguese, Dutch and other names for former colonies whose original names have been forgotten or are just now started to be re-acknowledged. I don't think the English language can really be singled out.
I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
Norway = Norge
Sweden = Sverige
Gothenburg = Gøteborg
Denmark = Danmark
Copenhagen = København
Italy = Italia
Rome = Roma
Venice = Venezia
Florence = Firenze
Tuscany = Toscana
Germany = Deutchland
Munich = Munchen
Switzerland = Schweitz
Spain = Espana
just to name a few,
and so many others. Why? Disrespect and ignorance, IMHO. Not to mention: The national names are more beautiful to pronounce than their English "correct" equivalents. Why is this so?
As you may notice, I try to write proper English, in respect of the English-speaking audience; But I do not feel that the rest of the world receives mutual respect for their laanguages with regards to names, at least...
I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
Norway = Norge
Sweden = Sverige
Gothenburg = Gøteborg
Denmark = Danmark
Copenhagen = København
Italy = Italia
Rome = Roma
Venice = Venezia
Florence = Firenze
Tuscany = Toscana
Germany = Deutchland
Munich = Munchen
Switzerland = Schweitz
Spain = Espana
just to name a few,
and so many others. Why? Disrespect and ignorance, IMHO. Not to mention: The national names are more beautiful to pronounce than their English "correct" equivalents. Why is this so?
As you may notice, I try to write proper English, in respect of the English-speaking audience; But I do not feel that the rest of the world receives mutual respect for their laanguages with regards to names, at least...
It's pointing the way to a fresh pork supply?Why does the sign on Alto de Perdon read "Nuevo York?"
We didn't do it!
Blame it on the Brits....
Careful JW or the language might get colourful!Isn't an American talking about the English language a contradiction in terms? (duck!)
Abel Tasman sayled past , at first they named it "Stateland ' , because they thought that it was connected with ' Staten eiland van Zuid Amerika '.Most languages have their own versions of place names, to make them easier to pronounce - not necessarily disrespect or ignorance. England is Inglaterra in Spanish, Angleterre in French, Inghilterra in Italian and so on. España is Espagne in French and Spagna in Italian. Then there were those explorers (from all over Europe) who just assigned names to places that already had them, and the new ones stuck. Abel Tasman (Dutch) sailed past my country in 1642 and a Dutch cartographer later named it "Nieuw Zeeland" (because... it looks so much like the Netherlands??). There are Spanish, English, Portuguese, Dutch and other names for former colonies whose original names have been forgotten or are just now started to be re-acknowledged. I don't think the English language can really be singled out.
If you have ever had a chance to drive/ride on the Autopista between Biarritz to Bilbao (through Spanish Pays Basque) you will see directional signs written in Spanish, Basque and Arabic. The nod to the Arabic language is because there is still a part of the population in our mountains who have Muslim origins dating back to the 700's. It makes the modern history of the world look a little puny, n'est pas?You should see the first nations languages out here... they started to put up some signs in some places with those words and i'm still makingfaces.
Example:
Remember they basically just made up this written language in the last 50 years or so.
He, he,
No fever. I was just wondering. I guess English is taking more and more over worldwide. Maybe a good thing? I occasionally work as a skipper on a tourist boat: Ever so often I am spoken to in English by people who do not even bother to ask if I speak the language. They just assume. Germans and Spanish are very happy when I can speak (some of) their language. Oh well, no big deal. Sorry for the misspelling, Pano.
As a linguist (Spanish and Russian) I can tell you that those languages do the same thing. In fact, the word for Germany in Russian, means "mute". My husband speaks Chinese and Korean, and they, as well, have their own words for other countries.I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
Norway = Norge
Sweden = Sverige
Gothenburg = Gøteborg
Denmark = Danmark
Copenhagen = København
Italy = Italia
Rome = Roma
Venice = Venezia
Florence = Firenze
Tuscany = Toscana
Germany = Deutchland
Munich = Munchen
Switzerland = Schweitz
Spain = Espana
just to name a few,
and so many others. Why? Disrespect and ignorance, IMHO. Not to mention: The national names are more beautiful to pronounce than their English "correct" equivalents. Why is this so?
As you may notice, I try to write proper English, in respect of the English-speaking audience; But I do not feel that the rest of the world receives mutual respect for their laanguages with regards to names, at least...
He, he,
Ever so often I am spoken to in English by people who do not even bother to ask if I speak the language.
And let us not forget that learning a language is a talent / gift. For instance I suck at maths and science...
Being also uni-lingual, I fully understand what you are saying here, but I still think there is the possibility, depending on the situation, that this approach could be misconstrued as arrogance. I would still feel inclined to inquire if the person spoke English, before appearing to assume that he did. I would rather inquire first than assume that he does and, therefore, appear also to assume that were he to speak English, it should automatically follow that he would be willing to accommodate me. Just my thinking ...Sadly I speak only English and that will most likely not change. I recognize it as a short coming. When I address Europeans in English, taking it for granted that they understand, I am definitely not feeling superior, but conversely, bowing to the superiority of those with a more diverse education than my own.
And let us not forget that learning a language is a talent / gift. For instance I suck at maths and science...
Oh I disagreePeople learn to count and do basic operations (adding, substracting etc) even if they never become experts at Maths... Same with languages, you can learn how to say the basics even if you'll never become a translator.
I don't see a big problem if you're speaking "only" one (you're own) language. So do I, although I can make some conversation in about 5 more and understand/speak basics in another 5 or so. Everywhere I go and feel somewhat insecure in my knowledge I just try with simple "Disculpe, habla usted Inglés?", "Excusez-moi, parlez-vous anglais?" etc. and soon we speak lingua franca as someone mentioned already. Maybe it's a bit easier for me being a member of very small nation (a bit over 2 million people) as almost nobody speaks our language so we have to try a little bit harderSadly I speak only English and that will most likely not change. I recognize it as a short coming. When I address Europeans in English, taking it for granted that they understand, I am definitely not feeling superior, but conversely, bowing to the superiority of those with a more diverse education than my own.
Precisely: Same with me (5 mill.). I need to know other languages to get by. But the feeling you get when you can talk, if only a little, with someone in their language, is priceless: Well worth the try!Maybe it's a bit easier for me being a member of very small nation (a bit over 2 million people) as almost nobody speaks our language so we have to try a little bit harder
I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
Norway = Norge
Sweden = Sverige
Gothenburg = Gøteborg
Denmark = Danmark
Copenhagen = København
Italy = Italia
Rome = Roma
Venice = Venezia
Florence = Firenze
Tuscany = Toscana
Germany = Deutchland
Munich = Munchen
Switzerland = Schweitz
Spain = Espana
just to name a few,
and so many others. Why? Disrespect and ignorance, IMHO. Not to mention: The national names are more beautiful to pronounce than their English "correct" equivalents. Why is this so?
As you may notice, I try to write proper English, in respect of the English-speaking audience; But I do not feel that the rest of the world receives mutual respect for their laanguages with regards to names, at least...
OK. Espana in 5 weeks from now. Peace, amigo.You need to get out more.
Isn't an American talking about the English language a contradiction in terms? (duck!)
Having worked all my life as a software engineer, English has been my professional language all those years. It is easy to travel around with that language, but it is so very much more gratifying when you can speak some Italian, Spanish, or fluent German in addition to the Scandinavian ones.@alexwalker -
I was concerned that this thread was going to go sideways early on. It is gratifying that most participants brought their sense of humor. And while we may not like the continual encroachment of English language into the global culture, it is most easily explained as the side-effect of Tim Berners Lee (an Englishman) and his invention (the internet).
I though I was having a conversation in Chinese once.
It turned out to be a Scot.
Couldn't have said it better myself... But it looks like something I could have insisted upon after some bottles of vino tinto anywhere on the CF...As a Scotsman Falcon,
I reply to you by saying " iggly dippy ogle jigglydip doo quibble dimply doc "
You took that off my family crest at Airthrey Castle (Stirling), didn't you?iggly dippy ogle jigglydip doo quibble dimply doc
I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
You need to get out more.
Let me scold thenI guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Catastroph. I stand corrected. No wonder there are warsLet me scold then
Well said... very true... didn't think of thatThose of us here in Los Estados Unidos don't feel the Spanish mean any disrespect by referring to our country in their own language.
... Do the Germans call England "England" no they don't. ....
Fifty shades of bacalhau!!!!!!And in the southern countries like Italia, Espana, Portugal, Brasil, etc. they are soo clever with it. As I understand it, they have a saying in Portugal that you are not ready /fit to become a housewife unless you know how to make bacalhau in 365 ways.. And yet, my girlfriend (she is a kithcen maniac, thankfully) recently found a recipe book in Portuguese with the title "50 more new recipes for bacalhau"...
Could have been worse. It could have been a Glaswegian!I though I was having a conversation in Chinese once. It turned out to be a Scot.
Try understanding the English Black Country accent!I remember asking my boyfriend when we were at Belgian festival Pukkelpop ( where there are people from all over the world ) : what specific language two guys next to us where speaking. He calmly answered that it was a local dialect from the west of our country...
I have Jamaican friends and of necessity have had to assimilate some patois to avoid sitting in dumb silence when they meet their compatriots!You won't have to go very far on many of the Caribbean islands to encounter English spoken at its most incomprehensible
Not had to converse in C+ then?Having worked all my life as a software engineer, English has been my professional language all those years.
Yow ay rung theer owr kid!Well, enough is pronounced 'enuff', innit?
I was born in a small seaside town in West Australia. They said much the same thing about a woman's ability to cook herring!As I understand it, they have a saying in Portugal that you are not ready /fit to become a housewife unless you know how to make bacalhau in 365 ways.
Fifty shades of bacalhau!!!!!!
Speaking of the famous cod, has anyone read the Mark Kurlansky book about the history of Atlantic cod fishing? It is a wonderful tale of the Basque Country and how we discovered the New World eons before Columbus and possibly populated all those places claiming to be Celtic.
HAHA, My first trip to the UK, trying to book a room at a B&B in Salisbury, the Lady there and I just looked at each other and Laughed, and she reminded me of the Churchill quote, England and America, Two countries separated by a common language. lolIsn't an American talking about the English language a contradiction in terms? (duck!)
Not how an English person would pronounce it though!Yes, we do! Buen Camino! SY
There are about 296 official languages in North America. American Indians tribes are recognized as independent governments, and most of them have an official language other than English! There are 562 Federally recognized Indian tribes...In South Africa we have 11 official languages
Munchen(Ger): Munich (yes we use the English translation!, which doesn't sound Spanish at all)
I guess I'll be scolded for this, but...
Why on Earth does the English language need to make its own variation of names on places:
Norway = Norge
Sweden = Sverige
Gothenburg = Gøteborg
Denmark = Danmark
Copenhagen = København
Italy = Italia
Rome = Roma
Venice = Venezia
Florence = Firenze
Tuscany = Toscana
Germany = Deutchland
Munich = Munchen
Switzerland = Schweitz
Spain = Espana
just to name a few,
and so many others. Why? Disrespect and ignorance, IMHO. Not to mention: The national names are more beautiful to pronounce than their English "correct" equivalents. Why is this so?
As you may notice, I try to write proper English, in respect of the English-speaking audience; But I do not feel that the rest of the world receives mutual respect for their laanguages with regards to names, at least...
Catastroph. I stand corrected. No wonder there are wars
On the other hand: I am glad that the Portuguese, Espanols, Italianos, Brazils, etc like our Norwegian baccalaSo I guess we are friends then?
Yes I did read it before my camino - wanted to learn a little at least about the Basque area I was about to walk through. And I've been enjoying all the wit and good humor above. Burst out laughing at the Scot/Chinese bit.Speaking of the famous cod, has anyone read the Mark Kurlansky book about the history of Atlantic cod fishing? It is a wonderful tale of the Basque Country and how we discovered the New World eons before Columbus and possibly populated all those places claiming to be Celtic.
Jamaican English is much like my West African French, c'est cool, mon!
And of course engrish.com, always good for a few laughs.
HAHA, My first trip to the UK, trying to book a room at a B&B in Salisbury, the Lady there and I just looked at each other and Laughed, and she reminded me of the Churchill quote, England and America, Two countries separated by a common language. lol
Speaking of the famous cod, has anyone read the Mark Kurlansky book about the history of Atlantic cod fishing? It is a wonderful tale of the Basque Country and how we discovered the New World eons before Columbus and possibly populated all those places claiming to be Celtic.
Jamaican English is much like my West African French, c'est cool, mon!
You should use the Italian. monaco di baviera
Maybe everybody must ask "snakker du Norsk ?I don't see a big problem if you're speaking "only" one (you're own) language. So do I, although I can make some conversation in about 5 more and understand/speak basics in another 5 or so. Everywhere I go and feel somewhat insecure in my knowledge I just try with simple "Disculpe, habla usted Inglés?", "Excusez-moi, parlez-vous anglais?" etc. and soon we speak lingua franca as someone mentioned already. Maybe it's a bit easier for me being a member of very small nation (a bit over 2 million people) as almost nobody speaks our language so we have to try a little bit harder
If...if... The Dutch prince Maurits in the somehere in the sixteenhundreds wasn't kicked out by the Portugese, in Recife/Olinda , in Brasil they should have spoken Dutch by now.I guess you should be glad Tasman was Dutch and not French or you'd be dealing with a moniker derived from "Pays Bas."
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