A Different Angle on the 'Weight Debate'

[Robo]

Don't laugh, I'm being serious..... I may have changed my priorities a bit.

Pack Weight. There's loads of great advice on this forum about pack weights. Keeping below 10% of body weight. Doug's view of <20% FSO. Then overall trying to keep pack weight as low as possible, with a popular 'zone' seeming to be 6-8 kg.

I've actually managed to get my 'first timers' pack weight to about 5kg, less food and water.

So I was thinking.....

I'm actually a fair bit overweight. Whilst I planned my Camino over 12 months ago, it was 'too far away' to get serious about weight loss and fitness. I actually dropped 5 kg and put it back on again in the last 12 months.

I'm actually not that unfit. I've been walking with my pack occasionally over the last 12 months without any real problems. But I will seriously start losing some weight anyway. It will all help.

OK, I'm a bit of a last minute type of guy in everything I do.... So now that my Camino in under 4 months away, it's time to get serious.

Back on the diet. Personal trainer to get me exercising more etc etc. I'm a bit of a 24/7 workaholic and that always gets in the way of things like exercise....

OK, back to the point.

I reckon in terms of priorities, mine are:

1. Get 'walking' fit. (I love the comments about 'get fit' in the first week of the Camino' That's my type of training)
2. Lose some weight.
3. Try to learn a bit of Spanish....

My priorities are in that order. (changed based in feedback from forum members)

The logic being, every kg in weight I can lose, is like taking a kg out of my pack. Or is it???

So the Question is this. And maybe a Sports 'expert' has the answer.

Is my logic wrong?

i.e. My body is used to carting around my weight. It's adapted. It's used to my current weight. Obviously the more I can lose the better. Less weight on joints etc.

But my gut tells me that a 1 KG lost in body weight is not quite the same as a 1KG reduction in pack weight. Pack weight is deadweight and an additional burden that the body is not used to.

So pack weight probably does more harm to the body than excess body weight.

What do you think? Not something I am losing sleep over. Just one of those things that one ponders....

But I'm still aiming to lose 8-10kg of body weight too Hedging my bets!

 

[NicoZ]

The logic being, every kg in weight I can lose, is like taking a kg out of my pack. Or is it???
!

Sort of but not really.

It's virtually impossible to drop just fat. You'll drop some muscle also. Think of a weight lifter. The chubby guy in the super heavy weight classes will almost always be stronger then the lean guy in the lower weight classes.

Then you've got issues like recovery . If you are losing weight you're short of calories. It's harder to recover in that state.

Instead of worrying about the scale think of fitness goals. How far can you walk with your pack? How do you feel? How do you feel the next day.

 

[Robo]

Winners have a plan. Losers only have an excuse !

You obviously are a winner !

Buen camino

Not quite sure how to take that

 

[Robo]

Sort of but not really.

It's virtually impossible to drop just fat. You'll drop some muscle also. Think of a weight lifter. The chubby guy in the super heavy weight classes will almost always be stronger then the lean guy in the lower weight classes.

Then you've got issues like recovery . If you are losing weight you're short of calories. It's harder to recover in that state.

Instead of worrying about the scale think of fitness goals. How far can you walk with your pack? How do you feel? How do you feel the next day.

As I said, I'm not losing sleep over it. I'm quite comfortable walking with my pack and with some added fitness training and extending my walks a bit I'm sure I'll be fine.

The question stemmed really from curiosity. But you are quite right. Rapid weight loss will not be ideal either.

Balance in all things

 

[dougfitz]

I can see where where body mass and pack mass might have similar effects on your skeletal structures, but I don't think it would be the same for your cardiovascular system. My view would be that keeping any extra body mass supplied with blood will be an extra cardiovascular load not generated by extra pack mass.

I have no special expertise on this, so I would also be interested in knowing.

 

[wayfarer]

Hi Robo, some people loose weight on the Camino, others don't, so do not bank on it. You will eat more on the Camino to make up the calories you burn otherwise you will tire and may make yourself ill. Plan your walk as you are and if you loose the weight you want to then that is a bonus.

 

[jmcarp]

...There's loads of great advice on this forum about pack weights. Keeping below 10% of body weight. Doug's view of <20% FSO. Then overall trying to keep pack weight as low as possible, with a popular 'zone' seeming to be 6-8 kg...

There are so many variables that it's impossible to define an exact goal -- that's why they're called "rules of thumb." The 6-8 kg "zone" comes from the experience of thousands who have trod the path before you: That seems to be the average of "needed" clothing and gear -- with a small allowance for the "might needs" that we all think we just can't get along without. Forget the "wants". But even that can vary with the needs of the season and even with the differences in weight of clothing for larger or smaller persons and males and females, and whether or not you include food and water (you generally only need to carry enough food for an emergency meal or a couple of snacks, and enough water to get you to the next known source of replenishment). Estimates based on body weight seem to be based on "average-sized" people, so if you are larger or smaller than whatever the ill-defined average is then you should probably adjust accordingly. In the end, the only real test is to load your backpack with the clothing and gear you plan to take, then go out and walk 20 or 25 km / 12 or 15 miles on two or three successive days and see how it feels. Once you're on the Camino, you can discard stuff in the albergue cast-off bins or ship it ahead to Ivar in Santiago, or you can buy the things that you truly need (or pick them up from the albergue cast-off bins).

 

[kmrice]

But my gut tells me that a 1 KG lost in body weight is not quite the same as a 1KG reduction in pack weight. Pack weight is deadweight and an additional burden that the body is not used to.

I think pack weight and body weight are about the same, at least as far as your legs are concerned. Before walking the CF last year, as I trained, I dieted to lose weight, and increased my training pack weight as I lost body weight. I ended up weighting the same, fully dressed and with my loaded pack, as I had, stark naked, when I started training. My Camino went very well, so, it worked for me. On the Camino, the weight of my pack never seemed to be an issue.

Not sure whether I lost any weight on the Camino. I think I did, but, if so, I gained it all back, and then some, eating tapas, churros and chocolate, ham, and cod fritters in Madrid, before returning home. Once home I discovered I had gained 2 lbs.

Karl

 

[cher99840]

I wouldn't say that your logic is wrong Robo, but I think it is kind of a non-issue. You have your pack weight down to an admirable level. As for your weight and fitness measures, if you concentrate on a healthy diet and walking some everyday (with your loaded pack), these two areas of focus will take care of themselves.

 

[Mark Lee]

Both Caminos I walked, by the time I reached Santiago I was about 10 kilos lighter and my shorts/pants waist was too big and I had to cinch my belt all the way down. I was also skinnier in the upper body, so it seems it was a loss of fat and muscle. I certainly felt the healthiest I had in years. I did not cut back on my eating or beer drinking on either Camino. In fact it seemed I was always hungry.
Of course within six months of returning home, I had gained the weight back. No way to replicate walking 15-30 kilometers a day with a pack on your back up and down hills, etc, and weight training brought the muscle weight back.

 

[cher99840]

Oh, lest I be misunderstood in my "healthy living" diatribe-----that is for camino preparation. Once you are on your Way, eat anything, everything.....

 

[Robo]

I wouldn't say that your logic is wrong Robo, but I think it is kind of a non-issue. You have your pack weight down to an admirable level. As for your weight and fitness measures, if you concentrate on a healthy diet and walking some everyday (with your loaded pack), these two areas of focus will take care of themselves.

As I said, it was really a question born out of curiosity

I'll plan to lose a bit of weight 'sensibly'. It will be a big benefit.

 

[JohnMcM]

Robbo,
I'm told it's always good to lose weight unless you are already underweight

I like your question and can get a feel you are not overly-concerned about the issue as such. I'm no expert and you aroused my curiosity with your musing.

Now I shall have many, many sleepless nights until tomorrow morning thinking through your question.

 

[AJ]

...some people loose weight on the Camino, others don't, so do not bank on it. You will eat more on the Camino to make up the calories you burn otherwise you will tire and may make yourself ill.

"I have been walking for almost 6 weeks and don't seem to have lost much weight."

"You are eating two 3 course meals every day."

 

[jumpingin2014]

Is my logic wrong?

i.e. My body is used to carting around my weight. It's adapted. It's used to my current weight. Obviously the more I can lose the better. Less weight on joints etc.

But my gut tells me that a 1 KG lost in body weight is not quite the same as a 1KG reduction in pack weight. Pack weight is deadweight and an additional burden that the body is not used to.

So pack weight probably does more harm to the body than excess body weight.

What do you think? Not something I am losing sleep over. Just one of those things that one ponders....

But I'm still aiming to lose 8-10kg of body weight too Hedging my bets!

I think your on the right track as pack weight will not contain additional muscle mass which body weight could. No doubt both excess body weight and pack weight will put additional stress on joints such as ankles, knees, spine etc. How efficient the cardio works will be dependent on both as well. I personally lost 10-12 kgs but had I used walking poles\sticks and reduced my pack weight I could have significantly reduced the overall impact a 800 km hike put on my lower body joints. I sprained my ankle and was not able to do what I had set out to do and had to bridge for days I needed to heal with a bus or train. My approach now is "managing" the Camino with average health and fitness by reducing pack weight, using walking sticks and paying attention to my body and resting before I injure myself. I am more determined then ever to do this but understand I need to manage my Camino around my limitations. In hindsight this seems patently simple but for some reason I was anxious to keep moving and covering as much ground as I could - not too intelligent. I am also working on strengthening and increasing flexibility in my knees and ankles before I go in 2016 - god willing!

Set yourself up for success - Buen Camino!

Mark

 

[ebrandt]

Hi Robo -- I walked my Camino in April 2013 to celebrate losing 150 lbs. I have kept my weight off for 2.5 years. I am not a doctor or health expert but here are my thoughts from my experience:

1. Whatever you do to lose weight do so by eating healthy, balanced, nutritious food. I did WeightWatchers and I know there are other programs. Quick fix diets that deprive you of nutrients will weaken you and may cause issues for your walk.
2. You seem like you are fit and will continue to work out while losing. My anecdotal experience is that every kg you lose is a kg not putting pressure on your hips, knees and feet. Yes you will lose some muscle, but not much if you work out thoughtfully and eat right while losing.
3. You won't lose weight on the Camino unless you cook for yourself. Mostly you will be eating in bars -- think one step up from fast food. Lots or olive oil, wine and bread. Plus you will be hungry and need the energy after long days walking. We found that fresh veg. was hard to come by in many spots. Even cooking for yourself might be difficult from a weight loss perspective because you won't be able to shop for food in a supermarket very often so you won't have musch choice on ingredients. Instead you will be basically buying supplies at small convenience stores. From what we say pilgrims were eating lots of pasta, smoked sausage and cheese.

All this leads me to really encourage you to take off those kilos before you walk, continue training while losing and then just enjoy your walk!

Liz

 

[Robo]

Good points Mark.

Without going 'over the top' I just want to give myself the best chance of completing and enjoying my first Camino. So I have my pack weight well down and use poles. I have good gear. So the rest is really getting my body as well prepared as I can. Within limits of course. It's not like I'm going to give up Red Wine and Cheese! There are limits

Because I'm such a lazy 'last minute' type of guy, I have enlisted the help of a Personal Trainer for a few sessions. To help me get motivated, do the right exercises and basically keep me accountable and 'on track'

Today I asked him specifically about the rigours of a Camino type walk, shin splints etc. The explanation of what shin splints actually are was a bit gruesome..... Definitely want to minimise the risks of those...

Two things I guess stood out. OK, three.

1. Don't focus on losing body weight as such, and watching the scales daily. Focus on overall health and fitness. As others have already pointed out.
2. Physical training needs to include specific exercises to strengthen joints, key muscles and overall core.
3. Having a regular stretching and warm up / warm down routine will go a long way to avoiding injury such as shin splints. I'll do that on the Camino too, not just in training. I think just make it a routine / habit. Each morning before starting. After each beak etc. Just takes a couple of minutes.

 

[Robo]

Hi Robo -- I walked my Camino in April 2013 to celebrate losing 150 lbs. I have kept my weight off for 2.5 years. I am not a doctor or health expert but here are my thoughts from my experience:

1. Whatever you do to lose weight do so by eating healthy, balanced, nutritious food. I did WeightWatchers and I know there are other programs. Quick fix diets that deprive you of nutrients will weaken you and may cause issues for your walk.
2. You seem like you are fit and will continue to work out while losing. My anecdotal experience is that every kg you lose is a kg not putting pressure on your hips, knees and feet. Yes you will lose some muscle, but not much if you work out thoughtfully and eat right while losing.
3. You won't lose weight on the Camino unless you cook for yourself. Mostly you will be eating in bars -- think one step up from fast food. Lots or olive oil, wine and bread. Plus you will be hungry and need the energy after long days walking. We found that fresh veg. was hard to come by in many spots. Even cooking for yourself might be difficult from a weight loss perspective because you won't be able to shop for food in a supermarket very often so you won't have musch choice on ingredients. Instead you will be basically buying supplies at small convenience stores. From what we say pilgrims were eating lots of pasta, smoked sausage and cheese.

All this leads me to really encourage you to take off those kilos before you walk, continue training while losing and then just enjoy your walk!

Liz

Thanks for the encouragement Liz and WELL DONE for not only losing the weight, but keeping it off.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Hi Robo -- I walked my Camino in April 2013 to celebrate losing 150 lbs. I have kept my weight off for 2.5 years. I am not a doctor or health expert but here are my thoughts from my experience... All this leads me to really encourage you to take off those kilos before you walk, continue training while losing and then just enjoy your walk!

Liz

Congratulations Liz: you are an inspiration. I went to visit your blog and commend you on maintaining the weight, pushing boundaries once again with your planned Primitivo and for volunteering as an hospitalero in Rabanal (my favourite village!)

 

[Walli Walker]

Liz, you say that you won't lose weight on the Camino unless you cook for yourself. I ate and drank in bars for the whole 800km as well as devouring masses of chocolate and bananas (and anything else I could get my hands on). I was always hungry. By the time I got to Santiago my walking pants that were a tad tight to start with were falling off me and I could take them off without undoing them!

 

[WldWil]

So, in contrast then, that means the extra 10 pounds I put on over winter doesn't mean I get an extra pound for my 10 percent of weight to carry?

Guess I will have to get it back off then. Just a bit of humor. ..

 

[jumpingin2014]

1. Having a regular stretching and warm up / warm down routine will go a long way to avoiding injury such as shin splints. I'll do that on the Camino too, not just in training. I think just make it a routine / habit. Each morning before starting. After each beak etc. Just takes a couple of minutes.

I totally agree with this too Robo I intended on stretching every day before I begin walking and after the day is over. Unless you normally walk 20-30 kms a day - you need a plan to manage the physical stress of the Camino. I think you are on the right track.

Mark

 

[Patch]

5 kg, well done, thats a reasonable amount to carry no matter how fit you are. I would suggest that walking 5 hours a day minimum, every day for a few weeks will result in weight loss and a trimmer figure as well. Enjoy your walk...

 

[Kathy F.]

1. I focused on getting fit, not on losing weight.
2. I lost 12 pounds on the Camino. Don't worry, I found them again when I got back home.
3. Learning Spanish is going to be VERY useful on the Camino. And I think it might be harder than losing weight.

Buen Camino

 

[Robo]

1. I focused on getting fit, not on losing weight.
2. I lost 12 pounds on the Camino. Don't worry, I found them again when I got back home.
3. Learning Spanish is going to be VERY useful on the Camino. And I think it might be harder than losing weight.

Buen Camino

I'm only planning to learn 'a bit' of Spanish

Enough to book a room, order a meal, ask where the pharmacy is. It's actually only a few dozen words.... I think it's worthwhile when spending a bit of time in a country to do that, and it's really not that hard.

A few lessons online with Marcus Santamaria would seem to do it. I bought his course (quite cheap) a while ago. In fact I put the audios on my phone and listen to them walking to work each day.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

3. You won't lose weight on the Camino unless you cook for yourself. Liz

I have l'ost up to a pound a day, not watching what I was eating, just not overindulgent. Not Only that, I kept losing a pound a day after getting home as my métabolism was so revved up.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I'm only planning to learn 'a bit' of Spanish

Enough to book a room, order a meal, ask where the pharmacy is. It's actually only a few dozen words.... I think it's worthwhile when spending a bit of time in a country to do that, and it's really not that hard..

One of the things I enjoy the most on the Camino is chat tong with the locals I meet, including hospitaleros. Why not invest more time learn ont the language than posting here ? 12 words won't do much more than none, and certainly with the impression loft behind I ma afraid. All unies and local colleges offre courses - chu not invest 3 hours a week for a semestre?

 

[Robo]

One of the things I enjoy the most on the Camino is chat tong with the locals I meet, including hospitaleros. Why not invest more time learn ont the language than posting here ? 12 words won't do much more than none, and certainly with the impression loft behind I ma afraid. All unies and local colleges offre courses - chu not invest 3 hours a week for a semestre?

A great idea, though sadly I am rather time poor. Comes from 80-90 hour weeks running 6 businesses

But I did say 'a few dozen' words, not just a dozen

But I'd rather not cut down my time here. It's too valuable a learning experience!

P.S. Whilst I would love to attend Spanish Classes, one of the downsides, is that you can end up learning a lot of things that you don't need. The benefit of the online classes I find, is that I can be somewhat selective and pick the bits I know I'll need.

Given enough time though, I agree classes would be ideal.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Liz, you say that you won't lose weight on the Camino unless you cook for yourself. By the time I got to Santiago my walking pants that were a tad tight to start with were falling off me and I could take them off without undoing them!

I agree with Walli Walker, I always lose about a pound a day, and keep losing the same for about 2 weeks after getting back home because my metabolism is so raved up. I do not endulge eating more than usual just because I am walking, but I will have some wine, some chocolate and some olives. I will have a daily slice of tortilla de patatas (breakfast), but also an ensalada mixta at lunch or dinner, depending on what else is on the menu. I think the key is protein, protein, protein.

This fall there was a day I did not stop at noon to eat, thinking I would be ok until the next stop. Big mistake. I was actually feeling dizzy and out of energy. My guidebook did not indicate anything for 6 kms or so further along, but thankfully I found a place only 3km out. It looked like nothing: 2 metal and 4 chairs out front, no lights turned ou inside, and just a counter top. I thought all I was going to get was a piece of bred but I tried my luck. The lovely lady asked what I wanted and I said "anything, but ideally protein. A can of tuna will do". She made me a beautiful tomato salad, and grilled a tuna steak. Then she came over and offered me some Txacoli made at the vinyard across the road. I took a picture of that meal ;0)

 

[David]

I like it! Have you ever noticed that carrying a litre of water in a bottle on your pack - weighs a kilo - but, if you drink it all down, the weight disappears from the pack but you don't notice that extra kilo in your body - at all?
Strange isn't it!

 

[ebrandt]

I have l'ost up to a pound a day, not watching what I was eating, just not overindulgent. Not Only that, I kept losing a pound a day after getting home as my métabolism was so revved up.

Well I totally commend those of you who managed to lose weight on the Camino. I thought I would but no such experience. I maintained, but just..... Maybe too much wine.... Cafe con leche...... Bread....... Oh, and cheese! . As someone who is a little neurotic about keeping track of each calorie, I guess I rebelled in the freedom afforded by walking 25 km a day!

 

[allykat]

Just adding my thoughts from my 2013 Camino (YMMV Obviously)

I trained my body lightly before my camino, but I was already an endurance sort of walker/swimmer and used to going for long periods of time. I had hopes of losing weight but kept my feelings realistic (after all, the guy in "the way" didn't seem to lose anything, why would I?) as I love food and figured I'd eat what I might have lost. My starting weight on the Camino was close to 200lbs (90kg) and I didn't really feel much change once I arrive in Santiago. I felt fitter at being able to walk long distances with a heavy pack, but my clothes still fit and I only noticed weight loss in my face (my chipmunk cheeks from the sun had subsided). It was only when my friend and I wanted to check out pack weight that I realized I was at 70kg almost exactly... a full 20kg drop in weight. My arms were stronger, my legs were stronger and I had somehow lost around 40 pounds in 33 days. That is OVER a pound a day and far more than the recommended 2-3 pounds a week max... but here is the thing;

I have a naturally high metabolism that I under utilize and stunt with junk foods. I also spend most of my time in front of computers doing technical support and playing games. Going on the Camino was like rebooting my body, I was instantly back to my high school swim team body and my metabolism was rejuvenated, I WANTED to run, hike, swim, and I WANTED healthier foods. I gained a little back from the lower level of activity due to busy school and work schedule, but I've maintained a good metabolic rate since. Would losing that much weight in so little time be healthy for everyone? No way, weight loss depends entirely on what you have to lose, how much and you have to lose it. And even more important is HOW you lose it. I was eating the square meals, full of protein, fats and carbs and getting an intense amount of exercise. For me all of that gave me back my accelerated metabolism and put be closer to where I am supposed to be. But each body is different, and not all of us can keep that kind of weight-loss up, so be careful if you do drop a ton of weight on the Camino, to be mindful of how you act when you return to "the normal world".

 

[Robo]

Just adding my thoughts from my 2013 Camino (YMMV Obviously)

I trained my body lightly before my camino, but I was already an endurance sort of walker/swimmer and used to going for long periods of time. I had hopes of losing weight but kept my feelings realistic (after all, the guy in "the way" didn't seem to lose anything, why would I?) as I love food and figured I'd eat what I might have lost. My starting weight on the Camino was close to 200lbs (90kg) and I didn't really feel much change once I arrive in Santiago. I felt fitter at being able to walk long distances with a heavy pack, but my clothes still fit and I only noticed weight loss in my face (my chipmunk cheeks from the sun had subsided). It was only when my friend and I wanted to check out pack weight that I realized I was at 70kg almost exactly... a full 20kg drop in weight. My arms were stronger, my legs were stronger and I had somehow lost around 40 pounds in 33 days. That is OVER a pound a day and far more than the recommended 2-3 pounds a week max... but here is the thing;

I have a naturally high metabolism that I under utilize and stunt with junk foods. I also spend most of my time in front of computers doing technical support and playing games. Going on the Camino was like rebooting my body, I was instantly back to my high school swim team body and my metabolism was rejuvenated, I WANTED to run, hike, swim, and I WANTED healthier foods. I gained a little back from the lower level of activity due to busy school and work schedule, but I've maintained a good metabolic rate since. Would losing that much weight in so little time be healthy for everyone? No way, weight loss depends entirely on what you have to lose, how much and you have to lose it. And even more important is HOW you lose it. I was eating the square meals, full of protein, fats and carbs and getting an intense amount of exercise. For me all of that gave me back my accelerated metabolism and put be closer to where I am supposed to be. But each body is different, and not all of us can keep that kind of weight-loss up, so be careful if you do drop a ton of weight on the Camino, to be mindful of how you act when you return to "the normal world".

My starting weight will be about the same allykat. Maybe a bit less. It will be interesting to see what finishing weight I end up at!

Maybe it's an age, language or cultural thing.

But what is 'stunting with junk food' ?

Is it:

1. A rather messy form of the 'Twister' game?
2. Liquidising and injecting Big Macs?
3. Ordering but not actually eating...Junk Food?
4. Other?

Just curious

I will certainly watch my eating and exercise on returning to 'The World'.....

 

[allykat]

But what is 'stunting with junk food' ?

My Nutrition Professor says that eating lost of processed foods and junk food (McDonalds, Pizza, Pre-Packaged Chips and Sodas with lots of sodium, sugar and the like) can slow down your metabolism as it is quick glucose, your body doesn't have to work as hard to transform it into easy energy or fat, so your metabolism slows to stop expending extra unnecessary energy.

So, when I say stunting with junk food, I meant like stunted growth, as in, slowing unnaturally or causing to not reach its full potential!

Probably just my poor English, not your cultural misunderstanding. I am bad with words.

 

[Robo]

My Nutrition Professor says that eating lost of processed foods and junk food (McDonalds, Pizza, Pre-Packaged Chips and Sodas with lots of sodium, sugar and the like) can slow down your metabolism as it is quick glucose, your body doesn't have to work as hard to transform it into easy energy or fat, so your metabolism slows to stop expending extra unnecessary energy.

So, when I say stunting with junk food, I meant like stunted growth, as in, slowing unnaturally or causing to not reach its full potential!

Ahhhhh Got it. Makes sense now. Technical term, huh....

 

[m108]

my bad habit is that every winter I get extra kilos. Before leaving on the Camino shall be agreed with myself that I'm in a backpack made so many things, how many kg I manage to lose. Every time (three so far) it was 6kg. Works great - I never miss things - it was enough, as well as by wearing did not have any problems - as I do not have a backpack.
This is my little trick
(of course I know that this is not very healthy....)

 

[sueque12]

When I walked the Camino Francis, I was a trim 62 kg from my weeks of preparation carrying a 20 kg backpack stocked to the gills with extra high protein snacks to keep me energized along the way....Needless to say, my pack was way too heavy, I was doling out snacks on the sides of the paths and my neck and upper body hurt for months on my return. As mentioned above in other posts, I will be carrying a few light snacks to ward off my hypoglycaemia, full water bottles and sufficient toiletries which can be replenished along the way. My goal for the Camino Portuguese is to be lighter in backpack, body and spirit! Ultraya!!

 

[sueque12]

CORRECTION!!! My backpack weighed 20 lbs Not 20 kg!! Oops...basic math...not my strong point!

 

[cecelia]

Don't laugh, I'm being serious..... I may have changed my priorities a bit.
But I'm still aiming to lose 8-10kg of body weight too Hedging my bets!

Robo, IMO you'd be better off to focus your attention on being sure you can do long walks up and down hills with a pack. It's very different for your body than gym fitness. Can you walk all day on uneven terrain? Can you do it again and again and again? If you have extra weight you'll lose it as you go. Buen camino.
Cecelia

 

[Robo]

Robo, IMO you'd be better off to focus your attention on being sure you can do long walks up and down hills with a pack. It's very different for your body than gym fitness. Can you walk all day on uneven terrain? Can you do it again and again and again? If you have extra weight you'll lose it as you go. Buen camino.
Cecelia

A good point Cecelia. I've been doing local bush walks for some time now. So quite comfortable walking with my pack. Just need to start extending the distance a bit now.

 

[tploomis]

Don't laugh, I'm being serious..... I may have changed my priorities a bit.

Pack Weight. There's loads of great advice on this forum about pack weights. Keeping below 10% of body weight. Doug's view of <20% FSO. Then overall trying to keep pack weight as low as possible, with a popular 'zone' seeming to be 6-8 kg.

I've actually managed to get my 'first timers' pack weight to about 5kg, less food and water.

So I was thinking.....

I'm actually a fair bit overweight. Whilst I planned my Camino over 12 months ago, it was 'too far away' to get serious about weight loss and fitness. I actually dropped 5 kg and put it back on again in the last 12 months.

I'm actually not that unfit. I've been walking with my pack occasionally over the last 12 months without any real problems. But I will seriously start losing some weight anyway. It will all help.

OK, I'm a bit of a last minute type of guy in everything I do.... So now that my Camino in under 4 months away, it's time to get serious.

Back on the diet. Personal trainer to get me exercising more etc etc. I'm a bit of a 24/7 workaholic and that always gets in the way of things like exercise....

OK, back to the point.

I reckon in terms of priorities, mine are:

1. Lose more weight.
2. Learn more Spanish.
3. Get fitter. (I love the comments about 'get fit' in the first week of the Camino' That's my type of training)

My priorities are in that order.

The logic being, every kg in weight I can lose, is like taking a kg out of my pack. Or is it???

So the Question is this. And maybe a Sports 'expert' has the answer.

Is my logic wrong?

i.e. My body is used to carting around my weight. It's adapted. It's used to my current weight. Obviously the more I can lose the better. Less weight on joints etc.

But my gut tells me that a 1 KG lost in body weight is not quite the same as a 1KG reduction in pack weight. Pack weight is deadweight and an additional burden that the body is not used to.

So pack weight probably does more harm to the body than excess body weight.

What do you think? Not something I am losing sleep over. Just one of those things that one ponders....

But I'm still aiming to lose 8-10kg of body weight too Hedging my bets!

Losing weight, learning Spanish, and getting fit all in four months is going to be quite an undertaking! Your enthusiasm for the Camino will probably get you down the road a ways, but I would recommend moderation so that you do not get injured. I also think that of those three priorities, getting walking fit ought to be the top priority -- that's what will get you further down the road. If you are eating properly, weight loss will take care of itself with the increased activity level of getting walking fit. As for learning Spanish -- any knowledge of Spanish, or lack of it, will do -- you'll learn Spanish on the road too! Bottom line for me: there is no substitute for getting out and doing the necessary walking prior to the Camino.

 

[JennyH94]

Hi Robo -
Best wishes for your pre-Camino weight loss programme - it's a good time to cut down for all of us in Australia with the hot weather having us wanting to eat lighter foods - salads etc.
Once you have your final pack list sorted, would you be able to post it on the Forum? It would be great to see what your final choices are. Around 5kgs is fantastic - well done.
Cheers - Jenny

 

[Robo]

Losing weight, learning Spanish, and getting fit all in four months is going to be quite an undertaking! Your enthusiasm for the Camino will probably get you down the road a ways, but I would recommend moderation so that you do not get injured. I also think that of those three priorities, getting walking fit ought to be the top priority -- that's what will get you further down the road. If you are eating properly, weight loss will take care of itself with the increased activity level of getting walking fit. As for learning Spanish -- any knowledge of Spanish, or lack of it, will do -- you'll learn Spanish on the road too! Bottom line for me: there is no substitute for getting out and doing the necessary walking prior to the Camino.

Sound advice I'm sure...... Don't worry, I'm not spending all my on this forum and planning. There's walking happening too

 

[Robo]

Hi Robo -
Best wishes for your pre-Camino weight loss programme - it's a good time to cut down for all of us in Australia with the hot weather having us wanting to eat lighter foods - salads etc.
Once you have your final pack list sorted, would you be able to post it on the Forum? It would be great to see what your final choices are. Around 5kgs is fantastic - well done.
Cheers - Jenny

Will do Jenny. A few more smaller items still to get (known weights). And a new pack. (already selected) The one I've been training with is not that great. So some weights might vary slightly once the final items are purchased. By all means tell me what I have missed or won't need! No sleeping bag as I don't plan to use Albergues, but have liner just in case...

 

[Robo]

Your enthusiasm for the Camino will probably get you down the road a ways, but I would recommend moderation so that you do not get injured.

The last thing I want to do is to try to do too much too early. I really want to give myself the best chance of getting to SdC. So I have allowed extra time (45 days) and intend to start slow, gradually building up as a get used to the walking. And I have got my pack as light as possible.

For example, at the risk of upsetting the 'purists', my Day 1 will only be to Orrison, then back to SJPDP with Caroline of Express Bourricot. Even if I feel like going on, I won't. SJPDP Hotels are booked.

Day 2 Caroline will drop me back to my Orrison start point, on her regular baggage run. I'll probably send a small bag ahead with her, containing items I don't need that day. So day 2 will be to Roncesvalles.

Day 3 I'll see how I feel, but likely not try for Zubiri, maybe Viskarret. I'm conscious of the advice here on how tough the first days can be.

So my aim is to build up slowly. As many forum members have advised.

If it looks midway that I might not have time to reach SdC. Maybe I'll jump ahead a couple of days, rather than rush.

My goal will be to finish... by being sensible and enjoying the journey.

 

[Peter Aulbury]

Hi Robo -
Best wishes for your pre-Camino weight loss programme - it's a good time to cut down for all of us in Australia with the hot weather having us wanting to eat lighter foods - salads etc.
Once you have your final pack list sorted, would you be able to post it on the Forum? It would be great to see what your final choices are. Around 5kgs is fantastic - well done.
Cheers - Jenny

Yes please...I would like to know the list for the 5kg pack weight. I plan to walk Frances again (after cycling last year) in 2016 and I'm concerned to "get my pack right"...so a pack list would be appreciated please.

 

[Peter Aulbury]

The last thing I want to do is to try to do too much too early. I really want to give myself the best chance of getting to SdC. So I have allowed extra time (45 days) and intend to start slow, gradually building up as a get used to the walking. And I have got my pack as light as possible.

For example, at the risk of upsetting the 'purists', my Day 1 will only be to Orrison, then back to SJPDP with Caroline of Express Bourricot. Even if I feel like going on, I won't. SJPDP Hotels are booked.

Day 2 Caroline will drop me back to my Orrison start point, on her regular baggage run. I'll probably send a small bag ahead with her, containing items I don't need that day. So day 2 will be to Roncesvalles.

Day 3 I'll see how I feel, but likely not try for Zubiri, maybe Viskarret. I'm conscious of the advice here on how tough the first days can be.

So my aim is to build up slowly. As many forum members have advised.

If it looks midway that I might not have time to reach SdC. Maybe I'll jump ahead a couple of days, rather than rush.

My goal will be to finish... by being sensible and enjoying the journey.

Robbo...sounds like a plan...I love that you have thought ahead so much...I reckon the weather from SJPdP on days 1 and 2 will be critical in my decision as to where to bed down for the night. I'm not sure yet when I will leave, or if I will go solo, but right now...I feel a ned to don my new pack, put on my Merrell boots and go for a walk

 

[Peter Aulbury]

The last thing I want to do is to try to do too much too early. I really want to give myself the best chance of getting to SdC. So I have allowed extra time (45 days) and intend to start slow, gradually building up as a get used to the walking. And I have got my pack as light as possible.

For example, at the risk of upsetting the 'purists', my Day 1 will only be to Orrison, then back to SJPDP with Caroline of Express Bourricot. Even if I feel like going on, I won't. SJPDP Hotels are booked.

Day 2 Caroline will drop me back to my Orrison start point, on her regular baggage run. I'll probably send a small bag ahead with her, containing items I don't need that day. So day 2 will be to Roncesvalles.

Day 3 I'll see how I feel, but likely not try for Zubiri, maybe Viskarret. I'm conscious of the advice here on how tough the first days can be.

So my aim is to build up slowly. As many forum members have advised.

If it looks midway that I might not have time to reach SdC. Maybe I'll jump ahead a couple of days, rather than rush.

My goal will be to finish... by being sensible and enjoying the journey.

Robbo...if you have access to Facebook, a young Aussie guy Andrew Suzuki has a facebook site called "Beyond the Way" and he has recently posted 5 short guides to the Camino on general topics like...Albergues, preparation, and Days 1 and 2 etc. The Days 1 and 2 post is quite interesting in that he implores the watcher to go steady in the early stages of the camino...well worth a watch. Cheers P

 

[JennyH94]

Will do Jenny. A few more smaller items still to get (known weights). And a new pack. (already selected) The one I've been training with is not that great. So some weights might vary slightly once the final items are purchased. By all means tell me what I have missed or won't need! No sleeping bag as I don't plan to use Albergues, but have liner just in case...

Hi Robo - Thanks so much for posting your pack list. I really like the way you've itemised all your gear into separate categories - up there for thinking! I don't think you've missed anything - this is a fantastic list - it has everything to see you through from start to finish (allowing for differing weather conditions) and you've cut back as much as anyone reasonably can.
Thanks again, and cheers -
Jenny

 

[Robo]

Robbo...if you have access to Facebook, a young Aussie guy Andrew Suzuki has a facebook site called "Beyond the Way" and he has recently posted 5 short guides to the Camino on general topics like...Albergues, preparation, and Days 1 and 2 etc. The Days 1 and 2 post is quite interesting in that he implores the watcher to go steady in the early stages of the camino...well worth a watch. Cheers P

Will certainly take a look. Thanks Peter.

 

[Robo]

Hi Robo - Thanks so much for posting your pack list. I really like the way you've itemised all your gear into separate categories - up there for thinking! I don't think you've missed anything - this is a fantastic list - it has everything to see you through from start to finish (allowing for differing weather conditions) and you've cut back as much as anyone reasonably can.
Thanks again, and cheers -
Jenny

Thanks for the feedback Jenny. Probably a couple of small things still to go in. And I'll keep looking for stuff to take out. One small item still to go in, weighing in at 91g is 'Mr Bean'. Mr Bean is a small brown Teddy Bear (very like Mr Bean's teddy bear) who has travelled with us (my wife Pat and I) over the last few years. He has been given permission to come with me So I think he needs to.

 

[Peter Aulbury]

Will do Jenny. A few more smaller items still to get (known weights). And a new pack. (already selected) The one I've been training with is not that great. So some weights might vary slightly once the final items are purchased. By all means tell me what I have missed or won't need! No sleeping bag as I don't plan to use Albergues, but have liner just in case...

thanks Robo

 

[David]

Hey, really nice packing list! I can see that an awful lot of work has gone into it.

I notice that you write 'pants' and also 'trousers' - meaning the same thing? I don't see shorts - have you thought of taking a pair of zip-off trousers so that you can have shorts or trousers? Or is 'pants' shorts?
I see that you treble up on socks. As they are light I guess you are thinking of only washing them every few days? You could, were you to want to, reduce it to one spare pair and wash a pair every evening.
You are going in May? You most likely won't need gloves (though you never know!) - socks can be used as mitts, they work very well.
I don't think you will need the puri-tabs, water is good in Spain. Though I see you are only taking a few - just in case?
You will need some inner bags so that you can separate items into separate bags for waterproofing, means you only need to open one bag at any one time, rather than the whole 'open the inner and reveal everything at once' scheme you have going. It is odd about rucksacks and rain ... even with an outer cover and an inner stuff can still get wet - why? how? no idea!
Will you wash your clothing with your hand soap? Or will you take a tube of travellers' laundry liquid?
You don't seem to have any tissues or a handkerchief!
Do you really need a woolly hat? Some on here would say that a Buff is a better item to take.

A few items I would add
- nappy pins (diaper pins, the locking safety pins) so that you can hang laundry on your pack and refugio clothes lines.
- a universal sink plug - you won't believe how many sinks you will come across that don't have plugs!
- a pocket knife (with a corkscrew) - how will you cut your cheese and tomatoes and sausage? Though you can use your debit card!
- a small spoon - only if you are a soft food/yoghurt eater!
- a small tube of superglue - instant repairs to footwear and clothing
- a linen napkin - no, really! wonderful for laying out to put your lunch on when sat out on the Camino, elegant and useful at any evening meal. When it is hot and you are flagging you can soak it and cool yourself down. As in - if you come to a town towards the end of the day don't just walk in all hot and weary and not paying attention. Stop outside and take a break before you go in. Soak your napkin and cool yourself down. Then you enter the town refreshed and alert.

 

[Robo]

Hey, really nice packing list! I can see that an awful lot of work has gone into it.

Great feedback David, many thanks. Love the Napkin. A silver napkin ring might just set it off

Pants/Trousers. I've lived in Australia 20 years and still use both terms!
Re shorts, I prefer not to wear them. I burn easily in the sun. Plus I have tried a pair of zip offs and the zip (because I am short) falls right across the knee and is really irritating. As I have 2 walking pants I might end up cutting one off above the knees if it's warm.
Socks. I'd like the option of changing into a new pair through the day. Hence extra.
Gloves. Very light weight. Probably leave behind. Just really for the first two days. Same with Beanie. I tend to run hot anyway.
Puri tabs were just a couple for emergency, in case I need to fill up from a stream etc.

Today I added a mozzie net for the head. Worn over the hat. After reading about the flies! I tried one last week when practice walking around my sisters farm in Victoria. Flies everywhere and it worked really well. Very 'Camino like' gravel tracks around the farm. Sorry I shouldn't refer to the local public roads as 'tracks'!

Don't know what it is but I am a magnet for any biting insects within 10 miles. Then come up in great lumps. The mozzies in our garden love me!
So might need to add a bottle of Aerogard.... (repellent)

 

[Al the optimist]

Ah! The new year! The time for the pack weight agonising to intensify again! Love it! Love it! Love it! Nice to have been there, worn the T-shirt (technical lightweight obviously). Actually my obsession has resulted in all the decisions to have been made already and weight established. So all I have left for the next 142 days )) is get this pesky heel to behave.

 

[Kathy F.]

I'm only planning to learn 'a bit' of Spanish

Enough to book a room, order a meal, ask where the pharmacy is. It's actually only a few dozen words.... I think it's worthwhile when spending a bit of time in a country to do that, and it's really not that hard.

A few lessons online with Marcus Santamaria would seem to do it. I bought his course (quite cheap) a while ago. In fact I put the audios on my phone and listen to them walking to work each day.

Sounds like you have the right idea. I have to say that some of the unexpected, and most memorable, moments on the Camino were the casual and spontaneous conversations with people along the way - shopkeepers, bar tenders, bus drivers, people USING the buses, etc. My broken Spanish was always forgiven and the joy of sharing thoughts and ideas with them, learning so much more than I could ever have expected, was a Camino blessing for me.
Of course, my Spanish improved immensely from SJPdP to SdC!
Buen Camino

 

[Rebekah Scott]

No matter how much you plan and spend, study, dream and pray up front, the Camino is probably going to kick your ass.
This disillusionment and reality is not always so spoken-of to people still planning their trip, but unless you are an athlete or extremely lucky, that day (or those days) are gonna come. You do well to prepare, but do not be upset or down-hearted when your number comes up.
It's part of the trip. You are not a spring chicken, you are not a saint, you are not an athlete.
Don't worry too much. Your butt will most likely be kicked. You will be part of a huge historic club!

 

[jumpingin2014]

No matter how much you plan and spend, study, dream and pray up front, the Camino is probably going to kick your ass.

I totally agree with this ............. Too often I saw people who had left the Camino dissapointed when I was there because they felt it was not what they had expected. They said "you don't read this part about the Camino anywhere" - well just read this comment and go with the knowledge that while preparation is good - you can't really train to walk 800 kms in month unless you actually do it. If you can plan more then do so .......... and forgive yourself if you struggle with this journey. Well said Rebekah!

 

[bystander]

No matter how much you plan and spend, study, dream and pray up front, the Camino is probably going to kick your ass.
This disillusionment and reality is not always so spoken-of to people still planning their trip, but unless you are an athlete or extremely lucky, that day (or those days) are gonna come. You do well to prepare, but do not be upset or down-hearted when your number comes up.
It's part of the trip. You are not a spring chicken, you are not a saint, you are not an athlete.
Don't worry too much. Your butt will most likely be kicked. You will be part of a huge historic club!

With a little modification, for example substitute "life" for "Camino", this should be read out loud at every child's arrival in the world!

 

[Anemone del Camino]

No matter how much you plan and spend, study, dream and pray up front, the Camino is probably going to kick your ass.

My 4 outings on the Camino were a completely different experience, from what I learned, to the pain in my feet, to the levels of sociability: company makes the days go faster - found a great group of companions - it's cold and rainy and I really don't want company, I'm a Camino veteran - company is nice, and it's also nice to have to depend on it ;0)

But I had always "done well", blister free (loss of only one toe nail), tendonitis free, bedbug free, until my 4th. You would think that by then, with custom made orthodics on top of it, that one would be a breeze. Can you say 'plantar fasciitis'? I certainly learned to, and how to spell it.

The Camino for me has never been about getting to Santiago, which makes me wonder how much a of pilgrim I am, but it has always been about being in the present, with every footstep. So perhaps not being able to "get there" has never been a source of disapointment.

But I know I am able to go back with regularity if I chose to. I can imaging the heartbreak for those who save every penny and every vacation day to do it once in their lifetime.

Maybe that is were Buddhism trumps Catholicism? ;0) Live in the moment, not to get to Santiago?

 

[Robo]

No matter how much you plan and spend, study, dream and pray up front, the Camino is probably going to kick your ass. ............ Don't worry too much. Your butt will most likely be kicked. You will be part of a huge historic club!

Wise words I'm sure.

Sadly for those of us yet to walk our first Camino, all we can do, all we have, until the day comes, is to prepare and plan and read the experience of others who have gone before us. We can't make the time come faster. And those who have already experienced the Camino have to 'put up with us' asking the same questions over and over... It's inevitable that we 'newbies' will form some views and expectations that are unrealistic. We don't know any better. We haven't been there yet.

I have no doubt that some tough challenges will lie ahead. I for one do not expect a 'walk in the park'. It's how we rise to those challenges that matters. Whilst I really hope to make it to Santiago, it is the journey that I'm looking forward to.

I have faced a few challenges in my life. Quite a few in fact. Physical challenges, mental challenges. At times I was tested to the extreme. There were times when I wanted to give up. There were times when 'anything' would have been a better alternative. I recognise that all training and preparation in the World does not compare to the 'real thing'. But it helps. There are challenges that we know we'll face. So we can learn and prepare for those. For the unforseen .....

All I wish for is that when those challenges arise, that I meet them, accept them, learn from them, and handle them appropriately. That for me is my Camino I think. Not arriving at Santiago.

 

[tploomis]

I would say the Camino is a great place for ultra-planners to discover the pleasures of spontaneity and for the ultra-spontaneous to discover the pleasures of planning.