Any route news?

[Dave]

Hi everyone,

I'm sorry to have spent so little time on this board over the last 12 months. A new job consumed a lot of my time, and walks to Jerusalem and on the Via Podiensis (the latter just finished, with a group of high schoolers) ate up the rest. Now, though, I'm excited to start focusing on the Norte and Primitivo again. Laura and I are starting to compile updates for The Northern Caminos, and then we'll plan to re-walk all of the routes in the book come next summer.

Have you used The Northern Caminos on your pilgrimage on the Camino del Norte, Camino Primitivo, or Camino Inglés? Did you run into any problems that need attention? Do you have any updates that we should integrate? We'd love to hear from you. In lieu of re-walking, the only way that we can make the book better for other pilgrims is through input from readers.

Feel free to post here or message me. We'd be grateful for your assistance.

Thanks,
Dave

 

[Kanga]

We used it extensively Dave (and did the usual, tore pages out as we went along - sorry). We also had it on my iPhone but it was easier to use the book. Found it very reliable for non-albergue accommodation.

 

[Marc S.]

Hello Dave,

I walked the Camino del Norte in August-September 2014 and used your guide extensively. In general I found it to be very helpfull and I certainly did not run into any major problems. (Well, I did get lost on my first day, walking out of Irun I ended walking in circles through and around Irun for some hours. I dont know what happened, as the desription in your guide seemed clear enough - and maybe I should have read it better).

Accidently, I made notes in my book when some information seemed to be outdated or not fully correct. I hope these notes can be of use for you now. I include them here below, referring to the page numbers in the 2013 edition.

Maybe I am a bit fuzzy about certain issues sometimes. Nevertheless I hope this input is usefull. Please let me know if something is unclear.

All the best! Marc.

In general.

- The book is a bit heavy and the same amount of information could be included on a shorter number of pages, when a different layout would be used (for example like the German Rotier guides) But I guess you have to follow publishers regulations here.
- The introductionary paragraph for each stage does not really seem to be necessary, as it does not seem to add much additional information to the stage desriptions.

p.57 The albergue in Deba is no longer located near the top of the first elevator, but is now located in the railway station.

p. 83 I got lost walking the coastal route from Miono into Castro Urdiales. (no disaster, I got there anyway) I am not sure how and why this happened, but maybe you have to re check the description.

p.88 You mention that the albergue in Guriezo is not reviewed favorably by most pilgrims. I have not stayed here, so I can not judge. However, this comment seems a little fact free to me (why is it not reviewed favourably ? and who are ‘most pilgrims”?) I think this is a little unfair, because reviews can be outdated, and can be based on an experience with a hospitalero who might not even be there anymore. In general I think that guidebooks should try to be neutral and fact based in their judgment of albergues and only give facts (for example: no hot water, no showers, that can kind of thing). Sorry to elaborate on this, but I feel strongly about this because passing judgments in guidebooks can have serious consequences for the albergues concerned.

Connected to this. The albergue in Pobena is called comfortable (p.75) and the albergue in Aviles excellent (p.144). Dont get me wrong, these albergues are fine for me, as they offer all I need (a bed and a shower) but they are – in my opinion - not really above average either.

p.90 Please note that the albergue Casa de la Trinidad in Lareido is in a seminario, and offers a communal meal (well , the nuns provide some food and pilgrims are encouraged to bring and share their food). I was pleasantly surprised to stay here, it was bit more special than just a private albergue.

p.95 I think there is an albergue now in San Miguel de Meruelo.

p.97 There were no cookies when I arrived in Guemes albergue.... But this is a minor issue.

p. 105 You may want to include a little more caution on walking along the railway line between Boo and Mogro. I remember Padre Ernestio warning people not to do this, as apparently there was recently a pilgrim who did it and got overwhelmed by fear while on the middle of the bridge. The police had to come and rescue her… So, this option is probably not for the faint of heart.

p. 121 There is no need anymore to walk on the highway from La Franca to Buena / Pendueles as there is a new off road route along the coastline. Well, you will see when you rewalk it (there are yellow arrows).

p. 127 I followed a different route walking out of Llanes to Celorio, not along the road but more along the coastline, it was very nice. If I remember well, I was just following yellow arrows, so I guess they made a new route here.

p. 129 You mention Casa Belen in Cuerres. It is a very lovely place, I stayed there. You may want to check with Manfred and Brigitta if they actually want to be included in your guidebook / any guidebook. They do not really want to be a 'normal' albergue if I remember well.

p. 140 I did follow the arrow calling to the right (which the guide adviced me to ignore) and I was actually fine, I can not recall any problems. But I was confused about whether I should have ignored the arrow, as this was adviced in the guide. But maybe I am the kind of person who only follows advice when there are reasons given for it…. I think the problem of conflicting arrows in the descent to Peon has probably been solved, as I do not recall any.

p. 142 I think your description of the arrival in Gyon is a bit harsh. It is walking on suburban pavement, fair enough, but is not that bad, certainly not one of the most frustrating sketches… In the same matter, I did not experience the walk out of Bilbao bleak and forgettable (p. 75); for me it was an enjoyable stroll along the canal. But well, I realize we can discuss for hours whether the industrial parts should be seen as an integral part of the Camino, or as something that could even be skipped….

p. 154 I think there is an albergue in Muros de Nalon (but I did not stay there).

p. 154 There is a possible detour to the really nice fishermans town of Cudillero. Maybe it is not even a detour, because the German guide book includes it in its ‘regular route’ I think. I walked from El Pito to Cudillero, and from Cudidellero this route rejoins the route in the guidebook at the Hotel Marino. It is signposted with yellow arrows all the way. In fairness, it is mostly roadwalking. There is no albergue in Cudillero, but many other options for accomodation, and the little harbour is quite lovely. You may consider walking this stretch and include in the guidebook.

p. 163 There is now a private albergue in Luarca. I stayed there, it is a modern one with all facilities (laundry, kitchen)

p. 167 I was not sure from the description if the old albergue in La Caridad still exists. If it does, I think it is fair to include its details in the guide. (You never know, maybe the owners put a lot of effort in running this albergue).

 

[Dave]

This is fantastic, thank you Marc! I really appreciate all of the specific feedback. We definitely need to carefully re-walk the Norte following Gijón, as there has been a lot of construction in that zone over the last few years. Glad to hear that things are shaking out.

Thanks too, Kanga, for the feedback on non-albergue accommodation. Given that we're typically in albergues when we walk, it's good to know that the other info is on point.

Dave

 

[spursfan]

Hi everyone,

I'm sorry to have spent so little time on this board over the last 12 months. A new job consumed a lot of my time, and walks to Jerusalem and on the Via Podiensis (the latter just finished, with a group of high schoolers) ate up the rest. Now, though, I'm excited to start focusing on the Norte and Primitivo again. Laura and I are starting to compile updates for The Northern Caminos, and then we'll plan to re-walk all of the routes in the book come next summer.

Have you used The Northern Caminos on your pilgrimage on the Camino del Norte, Camino Primitivo, or Camino Inglés? Did you run into any problems that need attention? Do you have any updates that we should integrate? We'd love to hear from you. In lieu of re-walking, the only way that we can make the book better for other pilgrims is through input from readers.

Feel free to post here or message me. We'd be grateful for your assistance.

Thanks,
Dave

Dave

Walked the Norte clasping your book in one hand and the CSJ guide in the other

The main improvement would be to update some of the maps, particularly those where the A8 now appears (between Hervedosas & Bao y Barayo and before Brul are two examples where I was worried for some time)

There's construction between Colombres and La Franca - and the Hotel San Angel was padlocked and almost certainly closed when I passed

Between Persues and Unquera the path briefly runs alongside the railway and then keeps to the left

Past Berbes the "abrupt accent and descent" shortly after you leave the road is now replaced by a more level path to the left of the abrupt ascent

I would still recommend the short-cut across the railway bridge between Boo and Mogro - there is plenty of room to walk alongside and below the tracks as you cross the bridge - the interval between trains in each direction is some 30 minutes

The best path up in the hills beyond Deba is the one that has the yellow arrows crossed out in black by a local landowner

The "often muddy trail" down from Priesca was diabolical this May - best to get your feet wet at the beginning and stride through rather than thinking you can find a dry way through - the downside of allowing cyclists to share it

Not sure about the path between Lousada and A Xesta follows the one given on your map - I think you go to the left of your marked path and come up closer to the intersection of the N632 and A8 - but I could be wrong - you might also give more of a description of where your waymark is in Lousada

Into Baamonde you can keep on the N634 - no need to detour left and right

You should also warn that lots of supermarkets and grocery shops might well be closed on Sundays - Santander and Bilbao are prime examples - and mention for example locations of OpenCOR in Bilbao and Gijon that will be open

All shops might also be closed for local fiestas - and there are few drinking fountains available when needed most

And walking along the highway (especially when the A8 is alongside) can provide an alternative - though you should always walk against the traffic and keep your wits about you

Mike

 

[Jena]

I also used and appreciated the book this summer when I walked the Norte. Overall very accurate.

Waymarks are not great getting into and out of most of the larger cities, but you covered that quite well.

A few other things:

Great albergues (all with meals): Güemes, Santa Cruz de Bezana, Pendueles, Cuerres (more of a private home), Maariz (ditto). I think you mentioned all of these already.

Also, most of the public albergues listed as "donativo" actually require a particular amount. This includes Piñera and San Xusto for sure -- I can't remember what the deal was in Tapia or Soto de Luiña.

On the days both before and after Soto de Luiña (stages 20 and 21): the marked camino is dirt roads, and while beautiful, there is a LOT of up and down. Highway is an alternative that nobody mentions if the elevation gain and loss is too painful. Worth a note.

The albergue in Piñera is absolutely disgusting. There was a really colossal ant nest underneath the albergue and the bathrooms were just kind of ... icky.

In Tapia, the road is washed out right before the albergue. There's an atrociously marked detour that leads you through someone's yard (and then to hop over a construction gate!), and I can't imagine we'd have known where to go if we hadn't asked the person in that house. (They were doing "emergency cliff stabilization work" when we were there, but who knows how long that will take?)

The monastery in Sobrado dos Monxes, while beautiful, can be very noisy, and if there are big groups the bathrooms can be really impossible. (It wasn't full when we were there, but there were several scout troops camping outside and using the bathrooms...)

If I can help in any other way, please feel free to message me.

Jena

 

[Dave]

Mike and Jena--thanks to both of you as well! I really appreciate the help.

Jena's and Marc's posts illustrate one of the challenges for us in putting together a guidebook. Do we provide critical feedback on the albergues, or do we limit the content to the most objective facts possible? It's a tough call, in large part because the albergue experience is fraught with volatility. An albergue with rotating hospitaleros can go from outstanding to subpar in two weeks. It's also possible for an otherwise great hospitalero/a to just have a tough day. If an albergue municipal is cleaned once per week, your view is going to be overwhelmingly influenced by which day in the week you happened to arrive. Taking it a step farther, it's entirely common for pilgrims to have an unusually good or bad day, and for that to color their view of an albergue.

We've tried to take a fairly conservative approach, highlighting the quality of care offered by established, highly-regarded albergues with year-round hospitaleros (for example, Guemes and Bodenaya), and also noting places with long-standing concern over maintenance (for example, Borres, though it sounds improved over the last year). We play most of the others down the middle. I don't know if this is the "right" approach or not, but it's largely dependent on the view that no source should be your only source. I'd always hope that people are supplementing the info from their primary guide with forums like this and elsewhere. I definitely do!

If anyone else out there has feedback, please let us know as soon as you can. We aim to submit our updates to Cicerone over the next week.

Regards,
Dave

 

[spursfan]

Dave

A few more comments

p44 - Santuario de Guadelupe - might be better to say "up a short but very steep ascent" - and maybe even caution against the Alpine route if wet and slippery

p78 - Portugalete - I thought that the moving sidewalks were before the centre of town not afterwards

p86 - getting enough liquid can be a problem between Castro-Urdiales and Laredo

p96 - new private albergue, in San Miguel de Meruelo - also sold some food and drinks

p116-117 Santa Ana (not Santa Marina) should be in red on the map

p120 - unfair to the large supermercado in Unquera - much better than the yiny one that I spotted in Colombres

p126 - I think that the path now veers to the right (not left) of the highway near Poo

p140 - Alto de la Cruz - I think the ascent is better described as steady rather than long

p142 - Gijon - you infer that the railway station is close to the Iglesia de San Jose - but there is a new "provisional" station close to the Palacio de Justica

Mike

 

[Kanga]

@Dave the section between Santoña and Noja almost brought me to grief and the guide could give a warning. The difficulty was the climb up from the beach (Playa de Berria?) over the headland and down to other beaches before Noja. It's only a short section but it's steep and, when we walked, slippery and quite dangerous going up. We heard later of another pilgrim, a German guy, who had to be rescued when he overbalanced and hurt himself.

 

[mikevasey]

p78 - Portugalete - I thought that the moving sidewalks were before the centre of town not afterwards


Mike

Hi hope you don't mind me jumping in, but I remember the moving sidewalks after the town centre after crossing the river on the gondolier bridge.

Mike

Or it could be that I thought the riverside area was the centre?

 

[spursfan]

I also remember that short, sharp climb before the main beach into Noja - I let a couple of guys in running gear ahead of me, little realising that the rest of their army training squad were close behind and followed me up the narrow path to the top apart from a couple of them that managed to overtake me

 

[spursfan]

I actually took the small boat across from the Las Arenas side of the river - and the moving sidewalks were the second street after that, I think - and that there was a lot of Portugalete still to go - it depends on where you call the town centre - it was mainly a call for more information and clarity - I would also appreciate knowing when to turn away from the river with a landmark rather than only a street name

 

[Dave]

Thanks again, Mike. Definitely seems like a semantic issue involving "town center" in Portugalete, but that's not to discount it. We'll aim to describe it more effectively.

Kanga, I received an email from another reader on the same hill. We'll add a warning and a reference to the (much longer) way that walkers on that route can circumvent it.

This is admittedly one of the challenges that comes with having hiking with teenagers as one's primary frames of reference. When we do this route with high schoolers, they fly into that hill, scramble through the sand, hoot and holler up top, and then bound back down into the beach below. It's good to have young knees.

 

[Marc S.]

Dave, in addition to my previous post (and I just realized through a post on another thread in this forum): the albergue in San Vicente de la Barquera (p. 118) no longer offers dinner. By the way, thanks for pointing out the dilemmas about qualifying albergues earlier. The albergue in San Vicente is actually one of the saddest albergues I ever stayed in, I would find it hard to decide how to describe it in a guidebook.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

@Dave the section between Santoña and Noja almost brought me to grief and the guide could give a warning. The difficulty was the climb up from the beach (Playa de Berria?) over the headland and down to other beaches before Noja. It's only a short section but it's steep and, when we walked, slippery and quite dangerous going up. We heard later of another pilgrim, a German guy, who had to be rescued when he overbalanced and hurt himself.

Could not agree more. Going over El Brusco, that is the name of that hill, is simply dangerous. Glad I don't have a fear of heights. All guides should include the alternative which is to go around, and what the local tourism office recomends.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Hi hope you don't mind me jumping in, but I remember the moving sidewalks after the town centre after crossing the river on the gondolier bridge.

Mike

Or it could be that I thought the riverside area was the centre?

The moving side walks are lower in town then the metro station exit if that helps, but definately on the other side of the moving bridge.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Here are some notes I took in your guide as I walked the Primitivo in May and June of this year. Hope it helps.

P. 207, there is no mention of the post office locate at the pilgrim's office, in a little room just off where pilgrims line up. Very convinient. Mind you, since the Pilgrims' office is moving perhaps not relevant.

P. 206, Labacolla - "wash scrotum" or "wash toochy". I have always heard the derriere being refere to as the cola, and since cola means tail it would make more sense, no?

P. 219, there is a new albergue in Oviedo, on calle Covadonga no. 8

P.223, the Esclampero albergue now has 26 beds. The bar also rents rooms. Bar closes on Wednesdays.

P. 224, the bar in Premunio closed a couple of years ago. Now you have to walk 1km further to Valduno to bar Dylsia. This means that you no longer turn right to take the foot path but keep going on the road. You can the turn right and walk on the Roman road to Paladin.

There is no mention od the embalse de Valduno. This can be confusing as one may think they are not on he right path when walking by it, parallel to the road. Very dark and iso,ated 150 m. before joining road again and arriving at the Penaflor bar.

P. 225. San Juan de Villapnada albergue has a washer, no dryer. It also has an oven, frige and microwave.

P. 228, albergue La Campa also has a private room with double bed- ok, it's a hide-a-bed, but it works!

P. 226, Bar Ca Pacita closed on Thurdays.

P. 231' in La Milariega there is a new shelter with tables, chairs vending machines and toilet built by local farmer, Sra Raquel Banes.

P. 232, the hotel Palacio de Meras in Tineo also has an albergue section, super modern and quality.

Also, the locals laugh at the distances our guides show for Salas to Tineo, and I would tend to agree with them: it's longer than the guides claim.

P. 235, the bar in Borres opens at 7:30, not 6. And the albergue is not any more basic than Esclampero and Portugalete. It's even cleaner than San Vicente de la Barquera.

P. 238, bar in Lago is no more. Also, Casa Marques rents rooms.

P. 241, Hotel de Salime has a singles room for 25 euros, 35 for double.

P 243, in Cereixeira there are 2 shops/bars, la parilla and one by Valdero.

P. 243, dinner and breakfast at juvenil in Castro is 9 euros.

P. 245, the bar at El Acebo does have food: empanada, tortilla, bocadillos.

P. 250, the hill near A Lastra is one of the most difficult stretches. Might be worth mentioning.

p. 255, there is a new albergue in Lugo,called Lugodos.,

P. 259, confusion on directins after the bridge. You can actually to by the river or hike up the steep hill.

P. 259, O,Candido serves lovley food. Theremis no bar in San Roman.

P. 260, the casa rural also offers bocadillos, coffee, etc.

P. 261, Casa Gorinos is only a restaurant, no,rooms available, something about permits. And bar only opens at 8am.

P. 264, the bar is a good 500 m after the village of Vilamor.

P.264, lots,of new albergues including O Cruceiro.,

P 265, Boente now has albergues, 1 maybe 2.

P. 266, there is now a large restaurant just behind the muni in Ribadiso.

I am one of those who like guides to make notes in them but I agree with has been said before, format is not ideal: too heavy, too many pages, not enough material per page. I take pics,of pages with iphone for when I walk and it would have taken too many,mso for this I used the Editorial Buen Camino Guide.

 

[Kanga]

Good job @Anemone del Camino , very specific information!

 

[spursfan]

Dave

Just a few points on the section from Baamonde to Santiago

p191 - Fork left not right onto a dirt track

p193 - There is a new bar at the top of Miraz - accomodation to follow soonish

p195 - Both supermarkets closed between 2-4.30 in Sobrado so good idea to carry spare liquid

p196 - Took the road (AC-934) after O Meson - relatively little traffic

p199 - Albergue in Boimorto is nearly new, lovely and spacious dorm rooms (4x8 beds each) - though 15 min walk to supermercado in Gandara

p200 - I look the short-cut road route from Gandara - well worth the saving of 7km and again little traffic - consists of 10km along the DP-0603, a left turn, then 400m along a main road, then a right turn onto unmarked road (signed Oins as well as A Santiago scratched underneath) - then another 7.5km or so until you hit the N-547, 3.5km before Santa Irene; though the new A-54 road is taking shape shortly before your reach the N-547 on the short-cut

p207 - the entrance to the albergue at Monte de Gozo is now up at the monument - and the AP9 motorway is some 1.1km away

p207 - the route into Santiago stays on the left-hand side pavement - frequent signs on the lamposts as well as brass shells cut into the pavements

p207 - with the renovation of the cathedral, side entrances are now most relevant - though bags will be searched

p208 - the airport bus now starts from Plaza de Galicia, goes south to the railway station then back north to the bus station before running to the airport - typical time now 45 mins to Labacolla

Mike

 

[jesben1]

Hi everyone,

I'm sorry to have spent so little time on this board over the last 12 months. A new job consumed a lot of my time, and walks to Jerusalem and on the Via Podiensis (the latter just finished, with a group of high schoolers) ate up the rest. Now, though, I'm excited to start focusing on the Norte and Primitivo again. Laura and I are starting to compile updates for The Northern Caminos, and then we'll plan to re-walk all of the routes in the book come next summer.

Have you used The Northern Caminos on your pilgrimage on the Camino del Norte, Camino Primitivo, or Camino Inglés? Did you run into any problems that need attention? Do you have any updates that we should integrate? We'd love to hear from you. In lieu of re-walking, the only way that we can make the book better for other pilgrims is through input from readers.

Feel free to post here or message me. We'd be grateful for your assistance.

Thanks,
Dave

First, I will say in general the book is great, so very helpful. There were some days where we thought, how could we have done this without this book?! It was very well used, I had to tape up the binding a few times. There were times when waymarks were a little hidden and easy to miss, and the directions you provided gave us enough direction to get back on track. The main outdated thing I noticed, was the prices listed for the albergues. Some only varied by 1 or 2 euro, some by 5+, I assume prices just go up periodically. Not a huge deal, but worth a few phone calls maybe to get updated prices. Also "La villa Luz" in Zumaia has shut down about a year ago, we waited outside for it to open, and eventually asked some locals, and they said last they heard it was sold and never re-opened.

I look forward to using future updates on future Caminos

 

[Thornley]

Hi hope you don't mind me jumping in, but I remember the moving sidewalks after the town centre after crossing the river on the gondolier bridge.

Mike

Or it could be that I thought the riverside area was the centre?

Hi Mike ,
Good to see your writings,
Can you remember the name of the sleezy bar/hotel on the beach when you walked the Norte.
We ended up there but have lost notes , going back this year keping a few company and will try to stop in different towns the whole way.
Will then do Primitivo before Salamanca to SDC,
Thanks David