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Hospitaleros sense that.After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want
I don't know if it is possible as a human being to have no expectations of other human beings. Our expectations are formed by our own previous experiences, by what others have told us, and in this case perhaps by a sense of natural justice. And of course, those of us who have shared our experiences of the many wonderful hospitaleros on the camono have helped to raise the expectations of other pilgrims. I find it helps me to remember that my experiences of albergues are inevitably episodic - I am there for one night only. And often the hospitalero is there for only a couple of weeks. But still, when I walk the camino again, I will go back to the places where my needs were filled and avoid the others if I can. I get grumpy, so I will try to accept other's moods when I must.Sounds like you've had a really bad day and I hope you feel better now that you've got all that off your chest. Still, I can't help but think that your expectations of hospitaleros, and albergues too, are a bit on the high side. Expect nothing and you won't be disappointed.
Hi @SF-Pilgrim, an obviously heart-felt post. I probably don't need to remind you, but I will state for the benefit of others, most Hospitaleros are not professionals. They are volunteers.
The only unpleasant hospitaleros I've ever encountered were paid ones: professionals, in theory. Mostly they were in the Galician xunta albergues - three times I've stayed in Ourense's beautiful albergue, and each time the hospitalero was a je m'en foutiste who left a bit of a nasty memory.
Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
For the same reasons as to why there are hostels, hotels, restaurants, shops, etc. which have 5, 4, 3 2, and 1 star ratings, where others fail: education and training. Camino Associations train their hospitalero(a)s before taking up their voluntary work. Private albergues, if not run by their owners, may face inconsistent situations.Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?[...]why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims.
Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
Hola!Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
That's just plain gross and quite rude and immature. The hospitalero went above and beyond on that one.I would love to be a fly (not bedbug) on the wall and hear what Hospitaleros have to say about some pilgrims?? I saw some very questionable behaviour of Pilgrims. Some, shocking in fact. Hospitaleros work extremely hard over long hours - mostly I found a warm and welcoming attitude. Don't remember what Albergue, but one hospitalero was woken up having to clean up the innards of what one drunken pilgrim had left on the floor. Disgusting to say the least. Did the hospitalero complain? No.
My first experience as a hospitalero was a recent solo stint of a week at San Anton. It is a wonderful place to rest a while on a sunny day, or to stay if you are prepared to do without hot water and electricity for one night on your camino. 31 pilgrims stayed while I was there:I would love to be a fly (not bedbug) on the wall and hear what Hospitaleros have to say about some pilgrims??
Not quite. I accepted the challenge of feeding those who arrived later and ensuring everyone was treated equally in that respect. And of course, some might have been responsible for more than one thing.Doug, thanks for checking in to this thread. Reportage from the coal-face puts us all in our places. By my simple maths you had 22 Pilgrims and 9 @rsoles passed through in your week. Thank you for treating them all with grace.
I am betting that we could turn all the hospitaleros into surly grouches by starting sentences with "I want" or "I deserve" or "You should".
..and many come with their own set of expectations and day dreams. Put a bunch of volunteer hospitaleros together in a donativo albergue which doesn't follow 'the Assoc. rules' and watch the see-sawing between hospitaleros as they vie to achieve their personal visions...creativity, freedom, blind passion, petty squabbles, power struggles...Hospitaleros serving the pilgrims and local community, hospitaleros serving themselves. And then there are the pilgrims.......Hospitaleros are just human beings and like all human beings they can become cranky or have an off day..
Grizzled veteran hospitalera (with a huge heart)…..my kind of lady!I am a grizzled veteran hospitalera. I was rather surly with the OP up above. I want to add that 99% of the pilgrims I deal with are really good and decent people, doing something really really demanding. They are not all self-absorbed knuckleheads. They have bad days, and a well-rested and on-the-ball hospi can usually roll with whatever nastiness the pilgrim throws at her/him.
Unless of course the hospi is a self-absorbed knucklehead, or having a bad day.
The pilgrim needs to realize that the hospi, too, is doing something really really demanding.
We all just need to remember to treat one another with respect and dignity. Which is usually how it turns out.
Well, they should be more patient!I am betting that we could turn all the hospitaleros into surly grouches by starting sentences with "I want" or "I deserve" or "You should".
45 replies later and the OP has nothing to say about the answers he got to his question(s). Looking at his posting historial, I can see the same happened with the other 2 threads he opened to ask questions. He got 35 replies in one of them and 8 in the other one but he didn't provide any feedback (no reply, no likes, no thank you, nothing). Could we be in front of a you can see a mote in another's eye but can't see a beam in your own (eye) case?
Anway, I would like to thank everyone who contributed to this interesting thread.
Here here, Albertagirl! Sometimes I find it easier to just keep quiet and sign out every once in awhile for just that reason. So many wonderful, kind and helpful souls here who gently explain and inform, but those other few...It seems to me that there was a lot of negative response to the original post. In that situation, I would probably have run away, or decided that no one was really listening to my point of view. Frankly, I have been reluctant to express support for this point of view for fear that I would get dumped on too. I apologize for cowardice.
I am also 2 days from Santiago and started from SJPDP on 8 April. Hola!Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
I am unaware of your camino experiences, so not quite sure of "where you are coming from". However I think your comments are most unappreciative of our OP position. At a donativo alberque the "expect nothing ... won't be disappointed" might apply. But if I (or any pilgrim) pays 8-10-12 Euros for accommodation then yes you would expect the hospitaleros to at least have a smile (it costs nothing).Sounds like you've had a really bad day and I hope you feel better now that you've got all that off your chest. Still, I can't help but think that your expectations of hospitaleros, and albergues too, are a bit on the high side. Expect nothing and you won't be disappointed.
If I had to work - serving all those carefree (and sometimes demanding) souls on extended holidays heading to Santiago - day after day after day after day, with no end in sight, I'd be disgruntled too.
I'm not quite sure why you have singled me out to say "your comments are most unappreciative of our OP position." Without re-reading the entire thread, I believe most of the other posts were along the same lines. (Quite frankly, I get tired of reading posts from people who seem to want to be coddled while on camino.)I am unaware of your camino experiences, so not quite sure of "where you are coming from". However I think your comments are most unappreciative of our OP position. At a donativo alberque the "expect nothing ... won't be disappointed" might apply. But if I (or any pilgrim) pays 8-10-12 Euros for accommodation then yes you would expect the hospitaleros to at least have a smile (it costs nothing).
Oh. The big bucks accommodations.But if I (or any pilgrim) pays 8-10-12 Euros for accommodation then yes you would expect...
There's not a lot can be done about poor manners. Most hospitaleros are wonderful in my experience. As for the lack of hot water, might I suggest that it was other peregrinos who used all the hot water due to taking extra long showers. I knocked on the door of a shower in one albergue (80 beds) as the shower occupant had it running for 10 minutes! If we all did that the shower would have been running constantly for half a day. Many a small hotels' water systems would have trouble keeping up with that kind of demand.Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
Doug, I guess I was luckier than you when I was there last year. No thieves that I know of, luckily I was not a sole hospitalero because I had Ollie to train me, our biggest problem was explaining to earlier risers that a depart before sunrise rendered them no water, food or cafe until Itero de Vega, yeah and what's wrong with a candle light breakfast. You are now dubbed Saint Doug.My first experience as a hospitalero was a recent solo stint of a week at San Anton. It is a wonderful place to rest a while on a sunny day, or to stay if you are prepared to do without hot water and electricity for one night on your camino. 31 pilgrims stayed while I was there:
And the rest were simply wonderful, and made up for most of the bad behaviour. I would rather not have had the thieves, but the rest got chalked up to the vagaries of human nature.
- two were thieves - donation money disappeared on the first night and a blanket on the last. I am not sure who steals from a donativo alburgue staffed by volunteers, but it certainly made me pretty low that such people abused the privilege of staying.
- four arrived just as the communal dinner was being served, and expected to be served. They were, but all seemed oblivious to the effort that entailed when the sole hospitalero is also the cook.
- one gave me a lecture about how I was ruining his camino by insisting he leave in the morning - it was after 8.30 before he was gone, along with my opportunity to get to the mass at Santa Clara Convent before it was over.
- two felt that the simple candle lighting of breakfast was inadequate, and flooded the kitchen with their headlamps with the same level of control as their nation's blanket bombing of parts of SE Asia.
That's great. And you can pay the visit to our Fourm meeting place in Cafe Tertulia.I am also 2 days from Santiago and started from SJPDP on 8 April. Hola!
I have experienced disgruntled hospitaleros and cafe staff also. Very unwelcoming and upsetting at times. I don't know what to make of it. Spain is Spain. The Spanish are quite serious people, straight faced and direct. Yet many have been outstanding in their service also.
See you in Santiago... buen Camino!
- one gave me a lecture about how I was ruining his camino by insisting he leave in the morning - it was after 8.30 before he was gone, along with my opportunity to get to the mass at Santa Clara Convent before it was over.
- .
How every true! Your comment and most of those above started me thinking, maybe one of the more experienced hospitaleros could post a summary of an "average day" (that is if there is an "average day"). This might help me and out OP understand them, although I might add that I think I only had one albergue where (imho) the hospitalero "could have done better". Cheers... I think about it this way, a hospitalero has a window of less than five hours (8:00am to 1:00pm) to get the albergue cleaned up, laundry of all the sheets, (worse if you have no washing machine) maintenance, repairs, errands such as buying food, cooking gas. Even when it's 10:00pm lights out, the hospitalero still has the books to take care of and see how much cash is on hand to fund the next days group of pilgrims that arrive.
Now imagine if there was only a sole hospitalero that has to do all of this.
...that would be tricky, indeed. An average day on which Camino and in which season? Almost anything might be the 'norm' in some places. Consider the albergues, there is such variety:How every true! Your comment and most of those above started me thinking, maybe one of the more experienced hospitaleros could post a summary of an "average day" (that is if there is an "average day"). This might help me and out OP understand them, although I might add that I think I only had one albergue where (imho) the hospitalero "could have done better". Cheers
They have it easyIn my experience:
5 a.m., wake up and tell the people bashing on the doors and crashing around the kitchen that you'll open the doors at 6, as posted everywhere. Meantime, they need to shut the hell up. Try to go back to sleep while they complain and moan about your awful, un-spiritual attitude.
6 a.m., open the doors, start the coffee and tea, and put out the bread for breakfast. Re-set the table the early risers have trashed. Put the donativo box somewhere in pilgrims' line of sight, so it's not so easily "forgotten."
7.30 a.m., make the dormitory rounds, wake up people who can sleep through the racket. Hope none of them is ill, or worse.
Until 8 a.m., help pilgrims find lost things, replace toilet paper rolls, keep bread and jam on the table. Be sunny and nice to everyone. Grab some coffee and bread for your own breakfast.
8 a.m., say goodbye to the final pilg. Depending on size of albergue, season, weather, traffic, and whether there's a partner serving with you, you can:
Open all the windows.
Scan the dorm for items left behind, trash on the floors, spilled liquids, etc. Check beds for spots, smears, other signs of unpleasantness. Change sheets or bedcovers as needed. Start laundry. Hose down the shower stalls, swab the toilets, wipe spotty walls and fixtures, check for burned-out bulbs and leaks. Get a shower of your own while everything is neat and clean.
Clean up the kitchen. Put away everything. Perhaps start on a soup for lunch.
Sweep all the floors. Mop all the floors. Check levels on the propane bottles. Call the gas man if needed. Hang out the laundry.
10 a.m., make up a grocery list. Go into town to shop, being sure to shop at a different store each day. Go to Mass, if that's an option. Sit by the river and relax, if that's an option. Have a coffee in the local bar, catch up on the gossip.
12 noon, back to the albergue, send the other hospitalero out for some air. Bring in the laundry. Take a nap, or write a note home. Tell the people banging on the door that you don't open til 2 p.m., as clearly posted.
1:30 p.m., grab some lunch. Make sure there's toilet paper in all the stalls. Set out the sello, book, and donativo box.
2 p.m., open the doors. Be cheerful and welcoming. Register everyone. Scan each pilgrim for damage. Be sure there are lower bunks for injured, ill, or infirm people. Offer seats to the tired, drinks to the thirsty, bandages to the injured. Start organizing the communal dinner, if there is one. Have volunteers do shopping, chopping, table-setting, etc. Include the shy and retiring in the activity. Try to keep peace in the dormitory. Once the place is full, hang a "completo" sign on the door. Call cabs and other albergues for those unable/unwilling to do it for themselves. Put a "Averiada/Broken" sign on the toilet stall that's forever malfunctioning, and pray it doesn't overflow again. Call the &^%% plumber again. (This is about the moment the gas cylinder delivery arrives.)
6 p.m., listen to the screams of anguish when the wifi goes down.
7 p.m., Oversee the dinner, if there is one. Scan the dorm, make sure no one is having his dinner on his bed (yes, this happens!). Have something to eat yourself. Have the pilgrims do the dish-washing. Tell the people smoking in the bathroom they've gotta do that outside. Tell the love-struck couple they need to get a hotel room if they want to share a bed. Tell the busted pilgrim to not book a train home yet -- to sleep on his decision to quit. Find someone who can translate a Polish guidebook into Korean. Take a close look at the bedbug found in the dorm, and explain to the hysterical pilgrim that bedbugs have legs and bodies, and this "bedbug" is a bit of lint. Tell the angry pilgrims gathered around they are welcome to sleep somewhere else if they will not share a dormitory with a bit of lint. Show them the "bedbug." Try to remember the German word for "lint."
9 p.m., Many pilgrims will be tucking into bed. Others will be rolling in from the bar. Try to quiet them. Lower the lights in the public areas. Mop up the bathroom floors. Put out more toilet paper. Sweep up outside. Take out the trash. Wipe down the tabletops and counters, put away dishes.
10 p.m., close the doors. Turn off the dormitory lights. Lay the table for breakfast. (One of you may go round the outdoor perimeter and call in any lingering pilgrims.)
11 p.m., finish up the bookkeeping. Sit in the quiet for a little while. Chat a bit with your companion, review the day. Discuss what needs to be done in the morning. Go to bed.
Repeat, with variations, for 14 days.
Steady. There are many more deserving hospitaleros, many I see deal with as many or more people in a day as I did in a week.You are now dubbed Saint Doug.
And humble too.Steady. There are many more deserving hospitaleros, many I see deal with as many or more people in a day as I did in a week.
I agree with Canis Major, except on the "thousands waiting in line to be hospitaleros" part.
I staff only two albergues that are open only part of the year, and I'm beating the bushes for volunteers for the shiny new one!
...commiserations, @biarritzdon... I was going to begin my 6th Camino from Barcelona on 23 May and spend 10 days serving at San Anton in June. However, this week my doctor said, "No way, Jose!"
I will not get into the details because I don't know what they are but understandably I am extremely disappointed.
I thought this was a better thread to announce my change of plans than a "whoa is me" thread.
Ultreia!
Damn, sorry to hear that Don. Here's hoping that changes back to walking #6...Been there, done that; and thanks to Reb's kind urging I've served at San Anton.
She left out one of my major peeves as a hospitalero at San Anton:
Late in the day just after preparing dinner and setting the table for 10 people, 3 people show up to take the remaining 2 beds and want to eat dinner. Kindness, kindness, kindness is truly a blessing to most of us at that moment.
BTW, for those who know me, I was going to begin my 6th Camino from Barcelona on 23 May and spend 10 days serving at San Anton in June. However, this week my doctor said, "No way, Jose!"
I will not get into the details because I don't know what they are but understandably I am extremely disappointed.
I thought this was a better thread to announce my change of plans than a "woe is me" thread.
Ultreia!
Ok. Fine. I'll just say "hugs" to a pilgrim I have not yet met. Be well.Been there, done that; and thanks to Reb's kind urging I've served at San Anton.
She left out one of my major peeves as a hospitalero at San Anton:
Late in the day just after preparing dinner and setting the table for 10 people, 3 people show up to take the remaining 2 beds and want to eat dinner. Kindness, kindness, kindness is truly a blessing to most of us at that moment.
BTW, for those who know me, I was going to begin my 6th Camino from Barcelona on 23 May and spend 10 days serving at San Anton in June. However, this week my doctor said, "No way, Jose!"
I will not get into the details because I don't know what they are but understandably I am extremely disappointed.
I thought this was a better thread to announce my change of plans than a "woe is me" thread.
Ultreia!
...he sounds amazing!Just for the record, Biarritzdon is a great example of what makes a hospitalero great, at least at a laid-back albergue like San Anton: a sense of humor, a real awareness of the need for kindness in all situations; flexibility; no overwhelming regard for order, cleanliness, or social status; ability to laugh at one's self; a tender heart; well-developed personal boundaries; and an appreciation for the absurd.
Oh, and a sense of humor. Did I mention that?
Likewise....commiserations, @biarritzdon
Actually, the owner of Albergue Ferramenteiro, Portomarín is getting rich, and may be the most disliked person in the town. They can tell you all about him if you stop in Vilacha.they are not getting dirty rich out of your money.
Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
I also host foreign exchange. I don't yell at my guests. I find it more effective to slow my speech so they can pick out the words easier. Patience and kindness are not that difficult to muster if you choose to.Wow, you are elders and carrying very large packs and it was a grumpy employee that spoiled your day. And all that grief for €5 a night.
Sorry @Stewarts Wandering I don't intend to mock but are you sure thats how it was? Whenever we have foreign students staying I speak my english more emphatically than I do to the usual riff-raff. I may even shout occasionally "up here!", "this way!", "no sex!". I don't speak many languages so I usually rely on volume and emphasis. And really, in that fabulous building, so recently refurbished and with all its wonderful facilities Mrs Grumpy spoilt your stay?
To me that strikes a better note on the issue here. "Unprofessional" may not be the most accurate term for describing a hospitalero, who may be a volunteer and hence not really a professional at all, providing dirt cheap accommodations to assist someone on a type of optional life-search where hardship should be an expected component. There is an implication in "professional" of owing something to the pilgrim. The Parador owes me service. The hospitalero does not.a grumpy employee that spoiled your day
I agree with Canis Major, except on the "thousands waiting in line to be hospitaleros" part.
I staff only two albergues that are open only part of the year, and I'm beating the bushes for volunteers for the shiny new one!
I respectfully but heartily disagree. I believe that all one is owed is simple politeness, not a smile. I assume you have never worked with the public. A smile can be extremely expensive in terms of emotional energy when it is demanded.But if I (or any pilgrim) pays 8-10-12 Euros for accommodation then yes you would expect the hospitaleros to at least have a smile (it costs nothing).
I respectfully but heartily disagree. I believe that all one is owed is simple politeness, not a smile. I assume you have never worked with the public. A smile can be extremely expensive in terms of emotional energy when it is demanded.
Wow, I'm sorry you took offence. It was not meant the way you seem to have taken it, or maybe you're just having a bad day. I'm glad you try to greet the public with a smile, but I still stand by my statement that a smile can be emotionally expensive when it is demanded. That is very different from "offered." And I agree with many of the posters above that as pilgrims, and, in fact, as humans, we are not entitled to a smile from hardworking volunteer hospitaleros, almost none of whom own the "shop."Well you know what they say about "assume" (it makes an "ass (of) you & me"). So in this case you have made the mistake - I have had over 40 years of working with the public and yes I always "try" to greet my customers/clients/guests with a smile. (There is another saying - from China: "man without smile should not own shop").
Wishing you a happy day. Cheers
This is very true! The Spanish have a tendency to shout and can sound very brusque to our softer useage in Costa Rica. ( still today, I find the also speak fast....and I watch the Spanish national tv every day)!A Spanish speaking South American told me once a ago that she thought a Spanish she knew was always angry/annoyed till she came to Spain and saw everyone spoke (tone, volumen...) like that Spanish. That's known as cultural differences and may mislead us in order to draw conclusions if we don't have them in mind.
The business model in Spain is completely different from that in the U.S. (and many other countries). If a transaction is viewed as having two nodes, the owner and the customer, in Spain it is much more focused on the owner. It is his life work. He has an offering, which he hopes will be what the customer wants. However, he does not change it for the customer. If the customer does not like it, there are other places he can go. Pilgrims are generally only a small part of a business' customer base, so service will be focused on local, repeat, 12-month customers. Pilgrims often will see locals served first. It irks them, but from the owner's viewpoint, the locals are more important. Once he has the pilgrims' money, he knows he will never see them again, so he sincerely does not care if he pleases them. It is all very logical and business-like, but very different from what many have come to expect in their home country. I suggest that no one take it personally. Those who think that they can change it have not paid attention to a quarter of a million transient customers who won't be coming back. New money will always be there to replace the old, and the Spanish small business has no reason to change. They are very comfortable in their niche.I think those of us from "service with a smile" countries sometimes misread situations in other countries
I think your story accentuates how much we need positive human contact on the Camino - we are away from family and friends and we slowly build up a camaraderie with other peregrinos swirling round us. But you are tight the point of contact with the new hospitalero each night can be delightful and supportive, or can hit us badly when we are tired and down.Can someone explain to me why there are hospitalero's with unprofessional attitudes?
I'm currently walking my Camino, starting April 8 in St Jean PdP. I'm now about 2 days from Santiago in Portela. So I've been walking awhile and been to a wide range of facilities. Many very good for what it is and the price I'm paying. A few exceptional places too. And unfortunately a few bad ones. As I look back I think what makes the biggest difference are the hospitalero's.
After a long day of walking I'm tired, I want a nice hot (or I'll settle for warm)shower, and a clean place to sleep. I want a place where I can be rejuvenated, refreshed and maybe a little reinspired to continue my journey.
Someone who stands out as a hospitalero who truly loves his job AND understands the meaning of hospitality is Ramon at San Javier in Astorga. He was just amazing. Very welcoming, took care of things, and just let me relax. Now there are many other great hospitalero's like Ramon, but I wish there were a few more Ramon's.
A few weeks ago I was in Santo Domingo. It was a very long, very hard day for me. My feet where in soon much pain. I was very much rethinking the Camino and seriously considering quitting. I ended I'll going to the albergue Casa del Santo. Well right off the bat when I walk in the young man working the front counter was just a jerk. I really felt like I was intruding on his time and was a huge burden to him. Not welcoming at all. At that very moment if I wasn't so tired, I would have found a taxi and gone home. For whatever crazy reason they don't turn the heat on. It was absolutely freezing on the shower room. Not long after I did some laundry. The washers are in a different building which was colder then the albergue, so I went back to the albergue lobby to read my guide book. Well I guess the young guy at the desk didn't like that so he turns off the lights above the sofas. Hmmm?? Why? I asked about the heat and he just blew me off.
So in the past 5 weeks or so I've had a few other less the hospitable hospitalero's. Today I encountered another one. This time I asked for my money back and left.
So to bring my long post to a close, I why are there so many folks in the Camino hospitality industry, including bar/cafe staff, markets, etc, who clearly don't like their jobs or don't like pilgrims. Now I'm not looking for 5star treatment, but I do know bad customer service doesn't fly in other areas, why does it seem to be acceptable on the Camino?
Thanks for your time and thoughts.
When we were on our camino last year, we reserved a place called Sarracin in Vega de Valcarce. BAD CHOICE!!
When we got there the woman who owns the place was out doing yard work in her garden and her son got her for us. When she 'greeted' us, it was with a great scowl on her face, and it appears we interrupted her day. After some confusion, she told us they didn't have blankets but no biggie as we've been schlepping our own, all across Spain. When we asked if she had a pilgrims dinner and what time dinner was, she was extremely curt with us. After making us keep our boots outside in a cabinet and making us walk on her wet lawn in our sock feet, she assigned us a top and bottom bunk in the albergue, even though it was completely empty. The room has about 16 beds in it and are very close together. We decided to take a shower and at first the water was hot, but after a few minutes, the water completely shut off. Okaaaay, so I thought it was on a timer so soaped up and when I turned the water on again, it was freezing cold and went down to a trickle. We know a lot of hotels and albergues use timers for their lights and showers, but honestly, after one walks 25kms, one just wants a hot, 5 minute shower!! I told my fiancé what happened and that was it....we decided to leave the albergue without another word to the owner and didn't even bother to stop for a refund. In fact, we walked right by her as she was sweeping her precious driveway and even though she looked at us, she said nothing to us. We went down the street and checked into a pension, where the owners are warm and friendly. Do not give the owners of Sarracin your business!! We can't understand WHY they own an albergue if they don't want to deal with people. My fiancé wrote her an email and told her to take the twenty euros we paid her and go buy some manners!! Lol
I know part of the camino experience is to step outside of our comfort zone, but there is competition, not to mention the fact that pilgrims pump a lot of $$'s into the Spanish economy so they really should care about their customer service.
You had :
1. A bed.
2. Lukewarm water.
3. The lady was " curt " but there WAS dinner served.
4. The boots were outside in a cabinet : so hygiene was high on the agenda.
I really give up here... When I read your post I feel a sadness coming up and I do not want to feel that.
Hi SabineP. Don't be sad!! Don't get me wrong; we were truly grateful for everything we did have on the camino, no matter how small. This lady was truly mean and did not have a kind bone in her body, yet the proprietors of the pension down the street where we stayed were very kind. All things being equal but having a choice, wouldn't you rather stay where you are treated with kindness??
Kindness is indeed "the cherry on the pie" and of course always appreciated when on the receiving end.
Then again " truly mean " and " being curt " are such subjective perceptions.
And I will repeat what I wrote above and many other people posted here too on different occasions : " A tourist demands, a pilgrim asks ".
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