I'm looking for understandable detailed online map or tables of Camino Francés

[Umi]

[Moderator changed the title from referring to "Napoleon route" to "Camino Francès)]

Hello, I would like to know your recommendation of online map or tables of the napoleon route that is shown detailed information especially distance between each town and albergues that is understandable.Though I know there are already several nice apps for pilgrimage(The way these apps show distances and each points is often confusing me.), is there any website or app that can give me an overview of the entire pilgrimage route and also give information on the distance between towns?

 

[jpflavin1]

Gronze.com has an outline of all the camino's. Maps, topography, accommodations, distances between towns etc.

 

[Tincatinker]

Hello, I would like to know your recommendation of online map or tables of the napoleon route that is shown detailed information especially distance between each town and albergues that is understandable.Though I know there are already several nice apps for pilgrimage(The way these apps show distances and each points is often confusing me.), is there any website or app that can give me an overview of the entire pilgrimage route and also give information on the distance between towns?

Route Napoléon - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[chinacat]

Hello!

Have you looked at this?
(It’s on this site.)

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/profile-maps-of-all-34-stages-of-the-camino-frances.12/

And this for the albergues:

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/all-albergues-on-the-camino-frances-in-one-pdf.10/

I imagine you’re referring to the Camino Francés.
The Napoleon route is the first, or first and second, stage(s) of the Camino Francés. It will get you over the Pyrenees. Some pilgrims spend the first night at Orisson or Borda, in order to shorten the first stage.

You might find your search becomes easier if you search for the Camino Francés, instead of the Route Napoleon.

Buen Camino!

 

[chinacat]

Route Napoléon - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I see you are in a playful frame of mind

Hope you’re feeling somewhat better

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

I hope these elevation profiles and comments are helpful:

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/camino-photos/elevation-profiles-of-the-tracks-from-st-jean-pied-de-port-to-roncevalles.8856/

 

[JabbaPapa]

Hello, I would like to know your recommendation of online map or tables of the napoleon route that is shown detailed information especially distance between each town and albergues that is understandable.Though I know there are already several nice apps for pilgrimage(The way these apps show distances and each points is often confusing me.), is there any website or app that can give me an overview of the entire pilgrimage route and also give information on the distance between towns?

Truth is, we argue about the validity of distances provided here or there non-stop -- though it does seem that, for the recent 2021-2022 double Holy Year, the Authorities in Galicia and to a degree in Castilla y León, made a significant effort to more accurately depict the distances on the Camino milestones ; I don't think that this work has trickled down, yet, to the kind of online website detail info that you're interested in, though most websites giving distances are at least roughly accurate.

 

[trecile]

@Umi The profile diagrams that @chinacat has kindly provided make the elevations of the Napoleon Route look far more extreme than they are. I don't know the technical term but maybe it's to do with the relationship between the vertical and horizontal axes. They make the path look more like mountain climbing, which it is not. The elevations on Gronze are far more realistic in my experience.

But I can attest the the first stage out of Irun on the Norte looks exactly like this elevation graph on the Buen Camino app!

 

[chinacat]

Did you use stepladders?

 

[JabbaPapa]

But I can attest the the first stage out of Irun on the Norte looks exactly like this elevation graph on the Buen Camino app!

View attachment 160427

Only Tom Cruise and Chuck Norris have ever completed the Norte !!

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

But I can attest the the first stage out of Irun on the Norte looks exactly like this elevation graph on the Buen Camino app!

Only Tom Cruise and Chuck Norris have ever completed the Norte !!

Not true!

 

[alexwalker]

I walked the Alpinsite Way (aka Purgatoria) for the 4th time this past September.

And you survived the Purgatoria???!!! A first...

 

[Tincatinker]

I see you are in a playful frame of mind

Hope you’re feeling somewhat better

I was trying to be helpful . I remain puzzled that the diversion route between St Jean and Roncesvalles ever came to be named as the Route Napoleon. Neither Napoleon nor his armies ever passed that way. If it was called the “If only Roland had had more sense route” that might make some sense. Meanwhile I remain puzzled why anyone, other perhaps than Roland and his poor bloody foot soldiers, would want to climb a completely unnecessary hill in the first place.

The Brigands of Valcarlos have long since retired. The only hazards on that route these days is the menu at Benta Ardandegia

 

[syug]

Hi, I suggest you Forwalk webpage with all the information on the different stages, distance, walking time, maps and a list of accommodations https://app.forwalk.org/2/1/en-us/19/#-4.9/42.7/6/180

 

[dougfitz]

@Umi The profile diagrams that @chinacat has kindly provided make the elevations of the Napoleon Route look far more extreme than they are. I don't know the technical term but maybe it's to do with the relationship between the vertical and horizontal axes.

The term you are searching for is 'vertical exaggeration'. Some level of vertical exaggeration is required to reveal the details of a climb that would otherwise disappear if the vertical and horizontal scales were the same.

They make the path look more like mountain climbing, which it is not.

Actually, it is. You will climb many mountains along the Camino Frances. What you won't need to do is scale cliffs or scramble over rocky outcrops. There are many mountains in the world where the summit can be reached by walkers without technical climbing skills.

The elevations on Gronze are far more realistic in my experience.

The elevations are exactly the same!! It's their depiction that has changed, not the heights of the terrain. Using a Gronze sourced diagram of the terrain won't make it any easier to walk than using any of the other resources with greater vertical exaggeration. The slopes, climbs and distances are what they are. How you draw them might make a difference about how you perceive them, but will make no difference in what it will be like to walk them.

 

[Tincatinker]

From my house, at 45ft above sea level it’s a 3 mile walk to Truleigh Hill at 702ft. It’s an excellent training walk with a full pack and I try and keep my time sub 1 hour. If me and little dog walk to the Shepherd and Dog for a pint we get to climb it twice and like to keep our time under 3 hours (including the pint). The inclination of the north scarp of the downs is thrice that of our outward stroll to the top but we make it just the same.

I rarely look at profiles on Gronze or any other resource. My current height above sea level (hsl) and the hsl of my destination or any intrusive bumps in the way while useful in some circumstances ( bad weather or nighttime navigation) are not otherwise an issue. If I’m walking from Erehwon to Llareggub that’s where I’m going

 

[Former member 104756]

@Umi I wish you all the best for your camino. I think thé post from @Rick of Rick and Peg - post #6 - is excellent for a drawing of the elevation profile of the Napoleon Route. And many people find Gronze a valuable resource for distances, elevations, towns, villages and accommodations for the Camino Frances and other paths. Buen camino

Camino Francés | Gronze.com

El Camino Francés es el Camino de Santiago en el que confluyen la mayoría de las vías medievales de peregrinación europeas, siendo por tanto el camino de mayor relevancia histórica y el más seguido por los peregrinos. Su punto de inicio, hoy en día, tanto puede considerarse Roncesvalles como...

www.gronze.com

 

[henrythedog]

From my house, at 45ft above sea level it’s a 3 mile walk to Truleigh Hill at 702ft. It’s an excellent training walk with a full pack and I try and keep my time sub 1 hour. If me and little dog walk to the Shepherd and Dog for a pint we get to climb it twice and like to keep our time under 3 hours (including the pint). The inclination of the north scarp of the downs is thrice that of our outward stroll to the top but we make it just the same.

I rarely look at profiles on Gronze or any other resource. My current height above sea level (hsl) and the hsl of my destination or any intrusive bumps in the way while useful in some circumstances ( bad weather or nighttime navigation) are not otherwise an issue. If I’m walking from Erehwon to Llareggub that’s where I’m going

Nice to see a bit of Thomas from
time to time, just to maintain standards.

 

[DoughnutANZ]

From my house, at 45ft above sea level it’s a 3 mile walk to Truleigh Hill at 702ft. It’s an excellent training walk with a full pack and I try and keep my time sub 1 hour. If me and little dog walk to the Shepherd and Dog for a pint we get to climb it twice and like to keep our time under 3 hours (including the pint). The inclination of the north scarp of the downs is thrice that of our outward stroll to the top but we make it just the same.

I rarely look at profiles on Gronze or any other resource. My current height above sea level (hsl) and the hsl of my destination or any intrusive bumps in the way while useful in some circumstances ( bad weather or nighttime navigation) are not otherwise an issue. If I’m walking from Erehwon to Llareggub that’s where I’m going

Ms M A P Google has difficulty providing walking directions from Erewhon to Llareggub because she thinks that most people don't wish to walk across the ocean floor, see screenshot.

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

Thanks Doug. I feel compelled to add a few things though.

The term you are searching for is 'vertical exaggeration'. Some level of vertical exaggeration is required to reveal the details of a climb that would otherwise disappear if the vertical and horizontal scales were the same.

The screen on my phone is 1080x2400. In landscape mode the 800 km of the CF can be shown at a scale of 3 pixels per km. Using the same scale I would only need 5 of the 1080 pixels to display the elevation changes.

There are many mountains in the world where the summit can be reached by walkers without technical climbing skills.

Aconcagua, in the Andes and the highest mountain outside of Asia, can be summited by hikers in excellent condition as long as they have determination and good weather. About 30% make it. Technical gear and expertise can help at the very top but are not required.

I first learned of this when I met a chubby hiker with a backpack on a local walk. He was in training for an attempt to summit Aconcagua in about six months time. He'd have a better chance in 18 months.

 

[JulieandPeter]

I have found this site very useful for planning: https://godesalco.com/plan/frances I don't think it has been mentioned yet.

 

[Monasp]

Hello!

Have you looked at this?
(It’s on this site.)

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/profile-maps-of-all-34-stages-of-the-camino-frances.12/

And this for the albergues:

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/all-albergues-on-the-camino-frances-in-one-pdf.10/

I imagine you’re referring to the Camino Francés.
The Napoleon route is the first, or first and second, stage(s) of the Camino Francés. It will get you over the Pyrenees. Some pilgrims spend the first night at Orisson or Borda, in order to shorten the first stage.

You might find your search becomes easier if you search for the Camino Francés, instead of the Route Napoleon.

Buen Camino!

These documents are obsolete

 

[markie6]

From my house, at 45ft above sea level it’s a 3 mile walk to Truleigh Hill at 702ft. It’s an excellent training walk with a full pack and I try and keep my time sub 1 hour. If me and little dog walk to the Shepherd and Dog for a pint we get to climb it twice and like to keep our time under 3 hours (including the pint). The inclination of the north scarp of the downs is thrice that of our outward stroll to the top but we make it just the same.

I rarely look at profiles on Gronze or any other resource. My current height above sea level (hsl) and the hsl of my destination or any intrusive bumps in the way while useful in some circumstances ( bad weather or nighttime navigation) are not otherwise an issue. If I’m walking from Erehwon to Llareggub that’s where I’m going

Thats the Fulking Escarpment for you. Think you are down hill of me

I used forwalk and the stuff from Brierleys guides were ok for me

 

[dougfitz]

These documents are obsolete

I can understand the albergue list becoming outdated, but I'm not sure how profile maps become obsolete. Has the path alignment changed so much that they no longer reflect the elevation changes on the ground? Or is there another reason for this assessment?

 

[henrythedog]

Thats the Fulking Escarpment for you. Think you are down hill of me

I used forwalk and the stuff from Brierleys guides were ok for me

There’s a Fulking escarpment? Excellent. If I ever keep my long-standing commitment to have a pint with Tincatinker on home-turf it’s another photo to add to my extensive collection which includes the road sign to Twatt on Orkney (with me stood at the business end of the ‘Twatt, this way’ arrow) and another of me obscuring the latter half of the ‘welcome to’ sign for the Yorkshire village of Penistone.

HtD aged 58, going on 13.

 

[CWBuff]

I can understand the albergue list becoming outdated, but I'm not sure how profile maps become obsolete. Has the path alignment changed so much that they no longer reflect the elevation changes on the ground? Or is there another reason for this assessment?

Agreed. The albergue list aside I used the profile maps one during my Summer 2022 Camino and thought them to be very helpful.
Not to take anything from OP's question but it totally mattered not to me how 'detailed' information is/was. All I knwe is that for the Stage-du-jour that I set for myself I had to get from Point A to Point B. If I thought that the distance was supposed to be say 20 km based on the info I I was basing it on (be it profile map, Camino Ap, Google or any combo of) and it turned out to be 18 or 22 - at the end that variation was negligible and non-important. Making sure I had plenty of water was!

Though I know there are already several nice apps for pilgrimage(The way these apps show distances and each points is often confusing me.),

I also do not understand the above statement. How are the apps' and profile maps' (oops.... apostrophes.... see the ongoing thread on that! ) confusing? Most are in KMs and are quite detailed. The fact that some dont take into account 5 small tiny villages you pass on the way; well so be it. You still need to get from Point A to Point B at the end of the day....

 

[AlwynWellington]

Neither Napoleon nor his armies ever passed that way.

Oh, yes they did, advancing from Saint-Jean-pied-de-port for the Battle of Roncesvalles on or about 25 July 1813.

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Battle_of_Roncesvalles_(1813)

 

[AlwynWellington]

I hope these elevation profiles and comments are helpful:

Thanks, Rick and very helpful.

I have read, in these pages, of the claim and counterclaim of whether the D428 high road or the D933/N135 low road is best.

The discussion includes whether to have the steep bits first (D428) or last (N135).
Either way, the steeps bits (from your chart) are similarly steep and are of similar length.

The romantic in me would take the opportunity to take in the spectacular sights on the high road versus the opportunity to have at least two more coffees in the villages along the low road.

Kia kaha (take care, be strong)

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

Oh, yes they did, advancing from Saint-Jean-pied-de-port for the Battle of Roncesvalles on or about 25 July 1813.

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Battle_of_Roncesvalles_(1813)

The article mentions that

The French attacked from Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port advancing in two columns either side of the pass. Clausel on the Altobiscar and Reille on the Linduz. At around 06:00 the two armies met.​

The map accompaning the article shows British and Spanish troops occupying Altobiscar while
OpenStreetMap.com shows the peak of Astobizkar (located at 43.0343604,-1.2976835) about 500 meters west of the Camino Francés and 100 meters above it. I would say the French took the Route Napoleon even if Napoleon didn't.

BTW, Wellesley didn't become Wellington until the following year.

Edit: I wrote the bit about Wellington above because the article (not Alwyn) said

After the decisive victory of Allied forces under Arthur Wellesley, 1st Duke of Wellington over French forces under King Joseph Bonaparte at the Battle of Vitoria, ...​

I knew Wellesley was not a duke at the time of the battle but I didn't know he had his other Wellington titles that Alwyn posted below. I also originally made an arithmetic error. Another error I made was knowingly posting during my brain shutdown period.

 

[AlwynWellington]

BTW, Wellesley didn't become Wellington until the following year.

He remained Arthur Wellesley till the day he died.

Along the way he was promoted and enobled, with elevations as time and events unfolded.

1802, 29 Apr: posted Major-General for military exploits in India
1806, Jan: elected member of Parliament of the United Kingdom
1807: appointed Privy Councillor
1808, 25 Apr: posted Lieutenant-General
1809, 26 Aug: after victory at Talavera, enobled as Viscount Wellington of Talavera and of Wellington, in the County of Somerset.
1811, 31 Jul: posted General
1812, 22 Feb: elevated as Earl of Wellington of ...
1812, 18 Aug: elevated as Marquess of Wellington ...
1813, 21 Jun: posted Field Marshall
1814, 03 May: elevated as Duke of Wellington ...

My source is Wikipedia and, of course, errors from my transcription and typing may have crept in.

My detailed interest, Rick, springs have been born in the city and province of Wellington (where I still live) and with slightly more than a casual interest in the two institutions that bear his surname.

Thank you for piquing my interest.

Kia kaha (take care, be strong)

 

[AlwynWellington]

Ms M A P Google has difficulty providing walking directions from Erewhon to Llareggub

Maybe Ms Google had one too many pints somewhere along the way.

Or, possibly, @Tincatinker hasn't read Samuel Butler.

Or did Samuel Butler have too many pints when he wrote his "novel"

Or ... pints ...

Whatever, kia kaha.

 

[kdespot]

Are you familiar with the app and website called AllTrails? The website has the craziest feature where you can follow a blue dot on a 3-D trip along the exact route (actual landscape). As it goes along, you get a moment-by-moment update of the mileage and elevation change. Just enter the info about any trail or location (in this case, Camino de Santiago) then choose your route preference and click on "Preview trail" and sit back and enjoy. You'll need to create an account to access this but that's easy and they don't sell your info. Well worth plugging through these few steps!

Here's a link, but you might have to go through the steps above to get there:

https://www.alltrails.com/explore/trail/france/pyrenees-atlantiques/camino-de-santiago-en-28-jours-de-saint-jean-pied-de-port-a-santiago-de-?mobileMap=false&ref=sidebar-static-map&initFlyover=true&u=i

 

[CWBuff]

@kdespot With All Respect Due I found AllTrails to be somewhat 'cumbersome'. But, no matter - everyone has their likes and dislikes. What I would point out to is this - any apps running "live" as we know sap the battery from the phone, some are rather fast. My initial thought of having playing my Playlist(s), running FindPenguins and any other map-direction like app went up in smoke rather fast.
So unless you are prepared to walk with a battery pack or something similar - this will be not of too much help 'live'.
Unless of course what you meant is that the feature can be followed at any time; if so - yes it absolutely could be useful tool in preparation (I still content that knowing possible elevation ascend\descend number before hand will mean quite little during the actual walk)

 

[Smash123]

@kdespot With All Respect Due I found AllTrails to be somewhat 'cumbersome'. But, no matter - everyone has their likes and dislikes. What I would point out to is this - any apps running "live" as we know sap the battery from the phone, some are rather fast. My initial thought of having playing my Playlist(s), running FindPenguins and any other map-direction like app went up in smoke rather fast.
So unless you are prepared to walk with a battery pack or something similar - this will be not of too much help 'live'.
Unless of course what you meant is that the feature can be followed at any time; if so - yes it absolutely could be useful tool in preparation (I still content that knowing possible elevation ascend\descend number before hand will mean quite little during the actual walk)

I have never found AllTrails to be a battery hog. I used it to map each stage of my Via Podiensis. Well, AllTrails or Hiiker. I didn't use a playlist or anything else, just a breadcrumb app, and of course used my phone to take photos. Never had an issue. You could try it IRL before you go, just shut down wifi, stop auto app updates, and turn on "record" for a day's adventure at home - see how much battery you're left with.

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

Are you familiar with the app and website called AllTrails?

I am not the person addressed as you but have used AllTrails before. Typically I used Wikiloc though as I preferred that. I downloaded the AllTrails app on my new phone though for comparison with other GPS apps. It wants $36 a year (a 50% off sale going on now though) so I'm not going to use it. Wikiloc is free but a paid premium version is available.

 

[CWBuff]

I have never found AllTrails to be a battery hog. I used it to map each stage of my Via Podiensis. Well, AllTrails or Hiiker. I didn't use a playlist or anything else, just a breadcrumb app, and of course used my phone to take photos. Never had an issue. You could try it IRL before you go, just shut down wifi, stop auto app updates, and turn on "record" for a day's adventure at home - see how much battery you're left with.

I understand but at the same in my case I was already running FindPenguins which was 'more important' to me.... I think that every one of these apps is a 'breadcrumb' when running alone, perhaps with another one, but when you try for 4-5 and yes the phone was constantly on - taking photos, dealing with WhatsApp and like it or not getting SMS messages from home every-so-often, well....
Again, by all means I am not anti-AllTrails. if it works for someone then kudos to them

 

[Madeleine Jacobs]

[Moderator changed the title from referring to "Napoleon route" to "Camino Francès)]

Hello, I would like to know your recommendation of online map or tables of the napoleon route that is shown detailed information especially distance between each town and albergues that is understandable.Though I know there are already several nice apps for pilgrimage(The way these apps show distances and each points is often confusing me.), is there any website or app that can give me an overview of the entire pilgrimage route and also give information on the distance between towns?

Very old fashioned perhaps, but I love the online GPS map in the Wise Pilgrim Frances application, that always -wherever you are on the Camino, in the stark dark in the morning- shows you whether you are off the path. Click on the little location sign in the right upper corner. The online path is not always up to date with route changes (e.g. out of Ledigos) but in most cases it will bring you right back to the Camino.

And in addition, also very old fashioned, I find the Godesalco planner indispensable for planning my trip and days: https://godesalco.com/plan/frances

 

[Smash123]

I understand but at the same in my case I was already running FindPenguins which was 'more important' to me.... I think that every one of these apps is a 'breadcrumb' when running alone, perhaps with another one, but when you try for 4-5 and yes the phone was constantly on - taking photos, dealing with WhatsApp and like it or not getting SMS messages from home every-so-often, well....
Again, by all means I am not anti-AllTrails. if it works for someone then kudos to them

By "breadcrumb" I meant something that maps the path you have taken. A breadcrumb trail - so something that interacts with GPS to geolocate and track in real time. I guess that's what FindPenquins does, but maybe doesn't have trail maps loaded? I also used WhatsApp, my phone to make calls, SMS, etc. No issue with battery life. My phone was on, but I did shut down wifi and bluetooth when I wasn't in a gite, and allow only a few of my apps to use data, generally reducing battery usage. I'm not pushing AllTrails or anything at all, just when someone says they don't have enough battery to track a day's hiking, then I think there may be other issues. And perhaps you have a very old phone, in which case it's worth asking if a new phone is merited, in part for battery life, but also because the newer phones take awesome pictures.

 

[Tincatinker]

I know this is a stupid question (no question is stupid unless you already know the answer) but doesn't anyone use paper maps anymore? What, not even the excellent Michelin of Northern Spain? Te one that lets you relate the path of the Camino Frances with its surrounding landscapes and possibly interesting diversions? Sorry, I've already established that I ask stupid questions.

One exercise early in my training saw me blindfolded, driven in the back of a truck for several hours and dropped off in the middle of the night in the back-end of nowhere. 1 quart of water, 1 ration pack and an Ordnance Survey map were issued along with a grid reference. "24 hours" was the instruction.

All the time you rely on your 'phone to tell you where you are you'll never really know where you are.

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

One exercise early in my training saw me blindfolded, driven in the back of a truck for several hours and dropped off in the middle of the night in the back-end of nowhere.

Something similar happened to Richard Feynman and fellow fraternity pledges but with no map. One was laughing as they walked. He said just follow the telephone poles and turn toward the ones with the most wires.

A navigation tip I hope no one ever needs.

 

[AlwynWellington]

1 quart of water, 1 ration pack and an Ordnance Survey map were issued along with a grid reference. "24 hours" was the instruction

excellent instructions for traversing any camino anywhere - brevity - lightweight - oh for those days to return

 

[kdespot]

Can I just clarify my point in mentioning AllTrails? I've never used the app and generally don't use technology when I hike. But that one particular feature where, in preparation for a walk, on the website (free) you can follow along a 3-D journey through the actual landscape I find to be fascinating. I've never seen that anywhere else. Just wanted to share it with anyone who has never seen it (refer to my earlier post for specifics). Thanks.

 

[CWBuff]

I know this is a stupid question (no question is stupid unless you already know the answer) but doesn't anyone use paper maps anymore? What, not even the excellent Michelin of Northern Spain? Te one that lets you relate the path of the Camino Frances with its surrounding landscapes and possibly interesting diversions? Sorry, I've already established that I ask stupid questions.

One exercise early in my training saw me blindfolded, driven in the back of a truck for several hours and dropped off in the middle of the night in the back-end of nowhere. 1 quart of water, 1 ration pack and an Ordnance Survey map were issued along with a grid reference. "24 hours" was the instruction.

All the time you rely on your 'phone to tell you where you are you'll never really know where you are.

1. There are no stupid questions only stupid answers (case to point...LOL)
2. I hate to venture a guess on some usage of PAPER maps

Seriously I do agree with you. I recently quipped to my wife that I unfortunately became one of the lemmings that totally absent-mindedly plugs a phone into AndroidAuto and follows the selected route completely blindly with 10000% trust. Heck of course I still can look at the map and figure it all out but in reality of every common day life - its gone.
"Those Were The Days, my Friend..."

 

[CWBuff]

Very old fashioned perhaps, but I love the online GPS map in the Wise Pilgrim Frances application, that always -wherever you are on the Camino, in the stark dark in the morning- shows you whether you are off the path. Click on the little location sign in the right upper corner. The online path is not always up to date with route changes (e.g. out of Ledigos) but in most cases it will bring you right back to the Camino.

And in addition, also very old fashioned, I find the Godesalco planner indispensable for planning my trip and days: https://godesalco.com/plan/frances

WOW
If you are where the big blue dot is - you have DEFINITELY gone OFF PATH!

 

[kdespot]

WOW
If you are where the big blue dot is - you have DEFINITELY gone OFF PATH!

If this is true, I'd like to know. Can someone else confirm?

 

[chinacat]

I know this is a stupid question (no question is stupid unless you already know the answer) but doesn't anyone use paper maps anymore? What, not even the excellent Michelin of Northern Spain? Te one that lets you relate the path of the Camino Frances with its surrounding landscapes and possibly interesting diversions? Sorry, I've already established that I ask stupid questions.

One exercise early in my training saw me blindfolded, driven in the back of a truck for several hours and dropped off in the middle of the night in the back-end of nowhere. 1 quart of water, 1 ration pack and an Ordnance Survey map were issued along with a grid reference. "24 hours" was the instruction.

All the time you rely on your 'phone to tell you where you are you'll never really know where you are.

Paper maps are brilliant!
If I have to find a friend’s house for the first time and it’s in a fairly remote location, I have a good look at the map, note things like contour lines, telephone boxes etc. and then rely on my memory to get me there. Even if it looks as though I am driving into a wilderness, I trust my ‘map memory’ and it hasn’t let me down yet.
I’ve also used my understanding of maps to find ‘easier’ routes on Mountain marathons, for instance realising that one doesn’t have to go up and down ‘that’ hill but can find a way around it.

Maps are beautiful and can provide hours of enjoyment. Just studying them can bring to life the visual topography of a landscape, in the imagination.

I still have maps I used in the 60s,70s and 80s.They are scuffed and scruffy but remind me of adventures, both close to home and further afield.
Getting hold of a local map is a priority whenever I am in a new place. This can actually cause problems, depending upon the country! At least those dodgy countries realise the value of a map!
I’ll use a compass if I have to, but it’s the map which holds the secrets.

 

[David Tallan]

I know this is a stupid question (no question is stupid unless you already know the answer) but doesn't anyone use paper maps anymore? What, not even the excellent Michelin of Northern Spain? Te one that lets you relate the path of the Camino Frances with its surrounding landscapes and possibly interesting diversions? Sorry, I've already established that I ask stupid questions.

One exercise early in my training saw me blindfolded, driven in the back of a truck for several hours and dropped off in the middle of the night in the back-end of nowhere. 1 quart of water, 1 ration pack and an Ordnance Survey map were issued along with a grid reference. "24 hours" was the instruction.

All the time you rely on your 'phone to tell you where you are you'll never really know where you are.

I like paper maps. I have paper maps of the Camino. I don't take them on Camino with me. Never mind minimalist packing, I find that online maps are just more useful. Easy to zoom in and out and, more significantly, see where I am at a glance relative to the features on the map. I can use a paper map. But why when there is something better now? I don't carry my water in a gourd, either.

 

[JulieandPeter]

I guess one of the unrealized benefits of simply following the yellow arrows is not being aware of how lost one could be.

 

[Tincatinker]

I guess that if your whole intention is to get to somewhere somewhen: your destination and on time, then getting lost is a fairly scary state of being. I've had some of my best adventures when lost. I always knew where I was: here. I just didn't necessarily know where there was. It didn't really matter at the time.

 

[JulieandPeter]

I guess that if your whole intention is to get to somewhere somewhen: your destination and on time, then getting lost is a fairly scary state of being. I've had some of my best adventures when lost. I always knew where I was: here. I just didn't necessarily know where there was. It didn't really matter at the time.

Yes, getting lost makes for some fun memories most of the time. We thought we were lost on day one, at a fork in the road, no arrow, in the fog and snow, dead phone battery (live and learn) . . . until the fog lifted, and we saw the two roads led to the same place a hundred yards in front of us.

 

[David Tallan]

I guess that if your whole intention is to get to somewhere somewhen: your destination and on time, then getting lost is a fairly scary state of being. I've had some of my best adventures when lost. I always knew where I was: here. I just didn't necessarily know where there was. It didn't really matter at the time.

I'm quite happy to wander off trail, to wander cities without paying too much attention to where I am. It's just that, if (or when) I decide I want to get "there" and am ready to use a tool to get me "there", I see no reason not to use the best one available, especially if it takes occupies space in my backpack and weighs less.