Then and Now, First and Last

VNwalking · Dec 10, 2018

I've been going through my photos from various caminos and was surprised to find the first photo from my first camino and one of the last from my most recent one were both of mojones (not that I take so many photos of them, it was just coincidence):

They're a study in contrasts, in so many ways.
And I have to say I like the scruffy and weathered one so much more.
I say too much here but I'm hardly an old-timer. But even in 5 caminos, change is palpable.
These mojones - they're mute witnesses and good metaphors, don't you think?

Bradypus · Dec 10, 2018

@VNwalking I agree - there is something more appealing and atmospheric about the older and more worn markers. Reading your post I was reminded of a very back-handed compliment in a song from "The Mikado" - a great favourite of mine:

"There's a fascination frantic
In a ruin that's romantic;
Do you think you are sufficiently decayed? "

LTfit · Dec 10, 2018

Oh yes I definitely agree - old and a bit worn like some of us. Luckily they are still around, along with many other older variations.

Camino Chrissy · Dec 10, 2018

Here's a favorite of mine seen after leaving Ponferrada....not a mojone, but I like it anyway!

VNwalking · Dec 10, 2018

Maybe we can all post our favorite pics of beat up oldies...
Or like Chris, photos of favorite oddities that are out there too, marking the way.

Bradypus · Dec 10, 2018

VNwalking said:
Maybe we can all post our favorite pics of beat up oldies...
Or like Chris, photos of favorite oddities that are out there too, marking the way.

Here is an oddity I spotted last month. Walking back into Fisterra from the lighthouse I happened to look back and saw this cloud formation over the cape. With the Camino very much in mind I couldn't help seeing something of the scallop shell in the pattern. Perhaps the opposite of your original image of something old and enduring - a very transient image absolutely of that moment.

Turga · Dec 10, 2018

A couple of the more humble types:

Camino Chrissy · Dec 10, 2018

I love all these! I'm going to go through my many photos and look to see if I can find others to contribute!

Camino Chrissy · Dec 10, 2018

@Bradypus, that cloud formation reminds me of a camino shell pointing the way...it qualifies!

VNwalking · Dec 10, 2018

Bradypus said:
Perhaps the opposite of your original image of something old and enduring - a very transient image absolutely of that moment.

Wonderful, @Bradypus.
It is a perfect celestial waymarker.

@stgcph , that wooden waymarker rings a vague memory bell. It was there, after coming off an overpass and turning left. But I can't remember where 'there' is. Oh, wait...passing a winery and going up a hill right before that. Somewhere before Cacabelos.
I just looked and yes, I have a pic of that too, looking less marked up:

Does anyone know the verse on it?

Purky · Dec 10, 2018

VNwalking said:
photos of favorite oddities that are out there too

I'm still fond of the picture I took on the Vézelay route. I saw the text ("Dangerous zone - Landslide - Attention, moving soil") and immediately thought "Sure, moving soil, that's all well and good, but what about the moving trees!".

Turga · Dec 10, 2018

VNwalking said:
Somewhere before Cacabelos.

Yes I believe that's about right, somewhere between Molineseca and Cacabelos; as I remember just before you get to some strange small 'swamp' with birch trees. I can't really dechiper the text.

Former member 49149 · Dec 10, 2018

stgcph said:
Yes I believe that's about right, somewhere between Molineseca and Cacabelos; as I remember just before you get to some strange small 'swamp' with birch trees. I can't really dechiper the text.

A very rough translation: Show me Lord how best to use the time you have given me. Show me how to learn from my mistakes and not be worn down by scruples. (More or less...)

VNwalking · Dec 10, 2018

Thank you, @kirkie !
I was more wondering where it came from - you can barely read at the bottom where it says 12th C monastic prayer...
It still applies, even more so than maybe it did 900 years ago. We have many more potential distractions.

Turga · Dec 10, 2018

Yes, I got something like this:

Enseñame, señor
A utilizar bien el tiempo que me das para...
Y a emplearla bien sin desperdiciarlo para...
Enseñarme a sacar partido de los errores pasados
Sin caer en los escrúpolos que carcomen..

Teach me, sir
To use well the time you give me to ...
And to use it well without wasting it for ...
Teach me how to take advantage of past mistakes
Without falling into the scruples that gnaw

OTH86 · Dec 10, 2018

Thank you @kirkie that's wonderful!

I believe as one comes out of camponayara, one crosses on a bridge over a highway, turning left-ish, then thru vineyards (where I saw a WHITE RAINBOW!) and down into the small swamp-like area, then further on, almost to Cacabelos there is a small winery. Is it there or back by the swampish area?

carolhayes · Dec 10, 2018

Bradypus said:
Here is an oddity I spotted last month. Walking back into Fisterra from the lighthouse I happened to look back and saw this cloud formation over the cape. With the Camino very much in mind I couldn't help seeing something of the scallop shell in the pattern. Perhaps the opposite of your original image of something old and enduring - a very transient image absolutely of that moment.

View attachment 49762

Beautiful and amazing! smile

Jomas · Dec 10, 2018

very interesting these photo contributions!
it is not really a mojones but a "work" done by a private person (at least I think). When I saw him he gave me a good energy and a sense of closeness to people))) it was great.

Former member 49149 · Dec 10, 2018

mute witnesses and good metaphors...
.

this one was so bizarre: no discernible street within sight.

this one: indeed, the witness par excellence!

Tvsteve · Dec 10, 2018

Here’s another........

forwardwego · Dec 10, 2018

Bradypus said:
Here is an oddity I spotted last month. Walking back into Fisterra from the lighthouse I happened to look back and saw this cloud formation over the cape. With the Camino very much in mind I couldn't help seeing something of the scallop shell in the pattern. Perhaps the opposite of your original image of something old and enduring - a very transient image absolutely of that moment.

View attachment 49762

fantastic/beautiful! Thank you for posting this.

Felice · Dec 10, 2018

How about this arrow?

Kiwi-family · Dec 10, 2018

While I like the oldies we can remember even they were new once - and similarly these new ones will one day be old.

Tincatinker · Dec 10, 2018

These stones mark no significance that I could discern though they stand, emphatic, in their place. I got the feeling they'd been guide-stones for many an eon. I was grateful to the way-markers of the Camino Verde that they felt no need to tag this one.

hel&scott · Dec 10, 2018

After 6 caminos I can confirm my heart lifts at the sight of a yellow flash and I am prone to following the trusty arrow even when not on a Camino. As the concrete bollards / mojones appear towards the end of the route it evokes a mixed emotion, I am both pleased that the end is near and saddened by it.

Jeff Crawley · Dec 10, 2018

The last 100 miles

KinkyOne · Dec 10, 2018

kirkie said:
mute witnesses and good metaphors...
.View attachment 49770 this one was so bizarre: no discernible street within sight.

View attachment 49769this one: indeed, the witness par excellence!

Definitely THE ONE AND ONLY

Peter Fransiscus · Dec 10, 2018

Jeff Crawley said:
The last 100 miles

Love those old stones.

Thank you for sharing.

nycwalking · Dec 10, 2018

Kiwi-family said:
While I like the oldies we can remember even they were new once - and similarly these new ones will one day be old.

As will we all!

Deleted member 73526 · Dec 10, 2018

A few of my favourites. Sadly, the second one was destroyed (completely obliterated) by a vandal a couple of months ago.

Camino Chrissy · Dec 10, 2018

Here's a few more of my favorites.

Bumpa · Dec 11, 2018

VNwalking said:
Maybe we can all post our favorite pics of beat up oldies...
Or like Chris, photos of favorite oddities that are out there too, marking the way.

Are we speaking of people or things?

VNwalking · Dec 11, 2018

@Raggy where is that armchair??

Bumpa said:
Are we speaking of people or things?

If you want to take the thread off on that tangent, @Bumpa...well...sure, why not?
Bonus points for oldies standing next to oldies.

Thank you everyone. It's fun to see all your photos.
The snowy ones show how important a little height and color can be.
Here's one from just outside of Roncesvalles, early in the morning before it was fully light. The marker was a welcome sight!

And here are the very old route markers on the Baztanes at the crossing of Belate - fortunately there are no idiots with sharpies here, either.
View media item 6958

Camino Chrissy · Dec 11, 2018

I can't help myself. Here's a couple more! ☺

Karl Oz · Dec 11, 2018

Raggy said:
A few of my favourites. Sadly, the second one was destroyed (completely obliterated) by a vandal a couple of months ago.

That armchair is a cracker!

Geoff Shepherd · Dec 11, 2018

Not an old one - and not even on the way. But I made this last week from a Hebel block and tiles from SdC for my driveway. Great CF memories every day. Cooee

David Tallan · Dec 11, 2018

This was one of my favourites:

VNwalking · Dec 11, 2018

David Tallan said:
This was one of my favourites:

I can totally see why.

Deleted member 73526 · Dec 12, 2018

VNwalking said:
@Raggy where is that armchair??

Karl Oz said:
That armchair is a cracker!

It's on the Via de la Plata, between El Cubo de Tierra del Vino and Zamora. It's on the "San Marcial bypass," so if you want to visit the bar in San Marcial, you'll miss it.

Shortly before the sofa is an imitation Roman miliario with a huge, metal, Santiago walking staff and gourd. Unfortunately, the area is littered with these things and other stones with "happy clappy," messages in pink. Someone pointed out to me that the messages were a form of historical revisionism - glossing over the forced migration of peoples along the route by describing it in benign terms (akin to describing the slave trade in terms of "immigration to a land of dreams," but I digress). I don't often complain about way-markers because I usually want as many as possible - but I feel that these constitute a worse form of pollution than that jauntily fly-tipped sofa. (As I walked this stretch, I was singing about being alone in the new pollution). Doubtless someone will intervene to tell me why the stones with the messages in pink and the ones with the ornaments are the best things on the entire Camino ... I guess it's a question of taste. If you feel that way, I question your taste. ;-)

Shortly after the sofa is the yeller arra, which very nearly made it into my previous post. As far as I know, it's a unique folk art objet. It's certainly a favourite of some other members of this forum. I love it. If you disagree with me, that's fine ... see above.

caminka · Dec 12, 2018

love all those old waymarkers. some of those I encountered.
on via tolosana before auch.

on the descent from the somport pass.

in santa cilia de jaca on the aragonés.

in rocaforte on the aragonés (one of my fav favs). this looks really old indeed.

caminka · Dec 12, 2018

and my favourite sunrise I've had on any camino. scallop-shaped so I guess it counts? it was a whole 'process' from the first pink rays on fluffy clouds to this glory. just amazing.

Kathar1na · Dec 12, 2018

VNwalking said:
Here's one from just outside of Roncesvalles

Saw this today in the FB group of the Roncesvalles albergue and also of the SJPP pilgrims office: brand new signs on the old marker stones near Roncesvalles.

VNwalking · Dec 12, 2018

Wonderful photos of oldies, @caminka! And that sunrise is gorgeous.
(I 'liked' the last post without really liking it. I see the point, but think it's ugly.)
And...what do trees have against signs?

Kathar1na · Dec 12, 2018

VNwalking said:
I 'liked' the last post without really liking it. I see the point, but think it's ugly.

Do you mean the photo with the new yellow arrow in addition to the shell? I don't need it, you don't need it, but I bet it's reassuring to see for the many first-timers who walk without map and without much of a sense of direction ... I remember aesthetically pleasing - imo at least - waymarkers along one stretch of the voie de Tours, locally sourced stone, craftmen's work, with shells on them and placed in such a way that it's obvious where the path goes; not everything that's new is bad. And yet some people felt it necessary to scratch totally not skilful looking arrows onto most of them. I concluded that some people just can't find their way without arrows ...

caminka · Dec 13, 2018

VNwalking said:
And...what do trees have against signs?

I would have something against signs if someone affixed one into my skin, I'm sure.
when I encounter a sign 'built' into a tree, my first thought is often something like 'oh, how lovely!' and then I remember that the tree is a living being and that the sign is an intrusion and I go 'oh, man, I'm so sorry, tree, that someone drilled a hole into you to put up this sign'.

VNwalking · Dec 13, 2018

Kathar1na said:
Do you mean the photo with the new yellow arrow in addition to the shell?

Yes, exactly.
But there will always be someone who will need that arrow.

caminka said:
I would have something against signs if someone affixed one into my skin, I'm sure.

Indeed. My comment was definitely tongue in cheek.
We're lucky trees move as slowly as they do or we'd be in trouble given what we do to them.

caminka · Dec 13, 2018

VNwalking said:
We're lucky trees move as slowly as they do or we'd be in trouble given what we do to them.

indeed indeed.

Michael-FL · Dec 13, 2018

VNwalking said:
Maybe we can all post our favorite pics of beat up oldies...
Or like Chris, photos of favorite oddities that are out there too, marking the way.

OK, I know it’s not one of the mojones, but I loved this on the last stretch of the Camino Portugues south of Santiago.

Emia · Dec 13, 2018

Ten years ago I made one myself.
It was damaged, restored, and damaged again, but when I come home, it always makes me smile

Camino Chrissy · Dec 13, 2018

caminka said:
and my favourite sunrise I've had on any camino. scallop-shaped so I guess it counts? it was a whole 'process' from the first pink rays on fluffy clouds to this glory. just amazing.

View attachment 49860

This photo reminds me of what I envision it will look like when the Lord returns in the clouds one day (for those who believe in the Bible). ☺

FamPed · Dec 13, 2018

Geoff Shepherd said:
Not an old one - and not even on the way. But I made this last week from a Hebel block and tiles from SdC for my driveway. Great CF memories every day. Cooee

Great work, I love it!

Former member 49149 · Dec 13, 2018

For camino Chris:
And why not? As a child, when references were generally flat, ie one word meant one thing, I envisioned the final roll call: there was Jesus in his nice off white woollen robe, and the apostles fussing around him. St Peter of course had the account book. There was definitely a passing of judgment based on the score each one had achieved. Then it was up or down. The roll call was in a place I knew, where people waited their turn for a medical appointment, semi circular, with levels like in a theatre. What on earth gave me that vision!!!
And now? No account book. I decide my own movement. It is based on a lifetime of choices made... I can't pass the responsibility on to anyone else! If there is an up or down. And here I stop, as this is not a place for this kind of discussion!

Camino Chrissy · Dec 13, 2018

Three more...I guess I have too much time on my hands! Ok, no more from me. ☺

VNwalking · Dec 14, 2018

Why stop, Chris?
And...there were waymarkers )and other markers) long before our yellow arrows and they're often the ones that last.

And there were roads long before going Santiago was a thing. Am I the only one who thinks it bizarre that they would plop a mojone down right in the middle of one of the last remaining bits roman road on the Frances? Whose idea was that?

Peter Fransiscus · Dec 14, 2018

VNwalking said:
And...there were waymarkers )and other markers) long before our yellow arrows and they're often the ones that last.

And most of the old markers are not ruined with Grafity . Just saying.

VNwalking · Dec 14, 2018

That pillar, BTW, is not a waymarker, but a 16th C pillar that marks a territorial or jurisdictional boundary.

Turga · Dec 14, 2018

Scattered along the Camino is yet another category of markers, which always make me stop and reflect for a while. As they usually have names on them, I will only post this one, which is anonymous and which is found not long before O´Cebreiro.

Kathar1na · Dec 14, 2018

stgcph said:
Scattered along the Camino is yet another category of markers, which always make me stop and reflect for a while. As they usually have names on them, I will only post this one, which is anonymous and which is found not long before O´Cebreiro.

I suppose you refer to crosses and other memorials that have been erected in memory of someone who died? The cross on the photo is not one of them. And it's not anonymous as it says Peregrinos Identes 1991. This refers to a group who belong to the "Idente Missionaries" and who wanted to put a cross somewhere on the way to Santiago.

I think, just like elsewhere in Europe, crosses without a name and without dates on them, other than the year when they were put in place, have been erected for other reasons and other purposes than the one you are thinking of.

PS: The Idente Missionaries apparently organise a group pilgrimage to Santiago every year. See for example https://www.idente.org/mensaje-del-...la-ruta-jacobea-idente-en-su-30o-aniversario/

Turga · Dec 14, 2018

Thank you for the clarification – I am glad that the message came through even if the example was not well chosen.

Kathar1na · Dec 14, 2018

Peregrinos Identes

There's another such cross just outside of Astorga, photographed by @Seabird, it's from 1988. More about all this in an earlier thread.

1988 ... does this count as now or as then?

Former member 49149 · Dec 14, 2018

One of the ‘different’ crosses was at Ligonde. My photo is not all that clear, but if you look for michaelspilgrimage on wordpress, stage 33, you will find really good photos.

VNwalking · Dec 15, 2018

Kathar1na said:
1988 ... does this count as now or as then?

Then, certainly!
Though I guess we each have our own ideas of when 'the good old days' are.

E V Waight · Dec 15, 2018

Bradypus said:
Here is an oddity I spotted last month. Walking back into Fisterra from the lighthouse I happened to look back and saw this cloud formation over the cape. With the Camino very much in mind I couldn't help seeing something of the scallop shell in the pattern. Perhaps the opposite of your original image of something old and enduring - a very transient image absolutely of that moment.

View attachment 49762

Proof positive that El Camino does have miracles.

Canche · Dec 16, 2018

I like the scruffy one bet

VNwalking said:
I've been going through my photos from various caminos and was surprised to find the first photo from my first camino and one of the last from my most recent one were both of mojones (not that I take so many photos of them, it was just coincidence):

View attachment 49759 View attachment 49760

They're a study in contrasts, in so many ways.
And I have to say I like the scruffy and weathered one so much more.
I say too much here but I'm hardly an old-timer. But even in 5 caminos, change is palpable.
These mojones - they're mute witnesses and good metaphors, don't you think?

ter too

Trevor Batley · Dec 16, 2018

And some not so permanent ones....

Kanga · Dec 16, 2018

I liked walking past the miliariums on the Via de la Plata. A constant reminder that we walk an ancient road.

View attachment 49942

caminka · Dec 17, 2018

VNwalking said:
And there were roads long before going Santiago was a thing. Am I the only one who thinks it bizarre that they would plop a mojone down right in the middle of one of the last remaining bits roman road on the Frances? Whose idea was that?
View attachment 49899

perhaps he/she was an uncle/aunt of those who are 'improving' old routes in galicia?

Kathar1na · Dec 17, 2018

VNwalking said:
Am I the only one who thinks it bizarre that they would plop a mojone down right in the middle of one of the last remaining bits roman road on the Frances? Whose idea was that?

Up to some point "then" it WAS the road. Until someone perhaps, luckily in my opinion, decided to fence it off and save it from being trampled upon by thousands and thousands of feet and hundreds of bicycle tyres and worse, and built a new road next to it. Even Roman roads did not last forever, they, too, needed repairing if traffic was high or for other reasons.

I don't know whether it's the same mojon but here's a photo and some comments from 2003 or so:

Danpelo · Dec 19, 2018

Bradypus said:
Here is an oddity I spotted last month. Walking back into Fisterra from the lighthouse I happened to look back and saw this cloud formation over the cape. With the Camino very much in mind I couldn't help seeing something of the scallop shell in the pattern. Perhaps the opposite of your original image of something old and enduring - a very transient image absolutely of that moment.

View attachment 49762

... and here is a view of the sky taken on September 13, 2016, just a few km west of Cirueña (between Logrono and Burgos). Taken by my buddy Jacques. I thought it was inspiring, if only pointing in the wrong direction...

Bradypus · Dec 19, 2018

Danpelo said:
. Taken by my buddy Jacques. I thought it was inspiring, if only pointing in the wrong direction...

On my most recent Camino Frances I walked at sunrise one morning with a young Hungarian man. He pointed up ahead at the pink glow on some clouds and said "Look! The sun is rising over there." I said that I didn't know Hungary that well but where I came from the sun normally rises in the east The sun was actually behind us and what we saw in front was its light projected onto clouds acting like a cinema screen.

VNwalking · Dec 19, 2018

And then there are the contrails that seem also to be going roughly in the right direction.
Magi followed stars...we follow jet planes.

Back to mojones, and memorials - sometimes they're one and the same.
Buen onward camino , wherever it leads.

Rainey · Jan 1, 2019

All lovely reminders of various routes. They are beautiful in many ways .. treasures from the past, directional markers and confirmation of you path. I too saw vandalized markers which were trying to send us back the way we came?? Why?? We were not confused luckily and continued on our route from Leon to Oviedo (San Salvador)

MethaV · Jan 1, 2019

VNwalking said:
I've been going through my photos from various caminos and was surprised to find the first photo from my first camino and one of the last from my most recent one were both of mojones (not that I take so many photos of them, it was just coincidence):

View attachment 49759 View attachment 49760

They're a study in contrasts, in so many ways.
And I have to say I like the scruffy and weathered one so much more.
I say too much here but I'm hardly an old-timer. But even in 5 caminos, change is palpable.
These mojones - they're mute witnesses and good metaphors, don't you think?

Pilgrim humor ;-)

psalmone1 · Sunday at 1:40 AM

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JustJack · Wednesday at 12:45 PM

When you stop at a bar for a beer, wine, coffee or bite to eat, and sit at a table, is it expected that you will return your dirty dishes up to the bar before you leave? I alway do, as it seems...

steve392 · Monday at 2:17 AM

Hey all. I haven't been on the forum for quite sometime (years probably). I walked the Camino Frances in 2016 and to say it was life changing for me is an understatement. On day 3, at the café at...

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Peterexpatkiwi · Tuesday at 12:42 PM

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A promotion started here right now. A step-counting sweater from Wolkswagen records how far you walk, and if you walk 613 km (which is the range of the latest model) before 16th June, you can win...

Then and Now, First and Last

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