A Way now too travelled?

[andarilho]

Did a 320km stretch of the Camino a few years ago, beginning of June, unforgettable! fantastic! Was so looking forward to going back when I can. Speaking with a good friend who I met on the Camino then, who is back doing another stretch right now, she started in St Jean end May. Too crowded, too many people from every corner of the globe, very large groups, very noisy groups, no room in the albergues, arguments about accommodation, etc, etc, etc. Sounds awful! Has the Camino now been over-commercialised and ruined? Too many tour operators cashing in on the mystique of 'The Camino'? Unfortunately I'm starting to think so - maybe time to search something else out? Thoughts?

 

[Ian Afloat]

Enjoy what you do instead.

 

[MTtoCamino]

If the crowds have you worried walk in the early spring as it was wonderful

 

[Deleted member 3000]

It is likely that the number of compostelas this year will be greater than in the last Holy Year in 2010. In a Holy Year, extra accommodations are set up to accommodate the crowds. That will not happen this year. There is no telling what next year will do!

 

[Deleted member 22638]

Surely the logical point would be the busier the Camino, the more, not less, successful it has become - and in direct relation, those who value solitude and lower numbers will have moved on

 

[whariwharangi]

Perhaps the bones of St James need to be scattered. A shrine containing a foot or an arm at Pamplona, Burgos, Leon, and Ponferrada for example. Then you could get a compostela at any of 1/2 a dozen points along the camino. That would cause the crowds to spread out a bit too.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Maybe more albergue should be like Gaucelmo in Rabanal: schlept your stuff or else You get turned away from the Inn. Christian don't you think?

Actually, I struggled with this when I got to Melide after the Primitivo a week ago. It was a shock to see groups and groups of pilgrims. I ran to hide in the fist albergue I found only to come back out after being showered and having had a nap. But the nextday I started cringing again: 20 people in front of me practically all the time, and another 10 behind. Percentage of those schleping their backpack? 20% perhaps. Who wpuld have ever thought that one day I would look at bicygrinos as "the good guys"

I saw so many people being dropped out of taxis, wthout packs, at the top of hills, I was getting upset, thinking all sorts of bad thoughts about these tourigrinos. Then I started having visions of undercover Camino police who would cancel the credenciales of those getting put of taxis

Then I remembered some Bouddhist readings about observing feelings and not falling in that rriver, about the impermanence of things. And I realises that maybe this Camino might be about learning to dig deeper, to find solutions witjin me and not in my environment, in those around me. I don't like something, like these crowds of touriginos, then it is up to me to find a way not to let it affect me.

Perhaps spirituality on the CF is no longer going to be offered to any and all on a silver platter like it has been, at least for me, in the past. Now, because of the distractions, perhaps I will simply need to look deaper inside me to find what the Camino has had to offer, and still has to offer.

 

[Mark Lee]

I'll freely admit, I kinda shake my head at the tour groups of pilgrims, and the ones that ship their stuff ahead as well as the throngs of bicyclists riding the Camino. As well as the tourist pilgrims with no backpack at all and simply ship ahead suitcases. It's hard not to shake your head a bit when you are walking the whole way with a pack. I certainly don't put myself on a higher pedestal than the others. I guess I just look it as sort of why would you want to do it any other way? But I suppose, it's just an example of different strokes for different folks.
I wouldn't let the prospect of an increased popularity of it prevent me from doing it.

 

[Bajaracer]

Maybe more albergue should be like Gaucelmo in Rabanal: schlept your stuff or else You get turned away from the Inn. Christian don't you think?

Albergue Gaucelmo is like that because it's a donativo albergue, local politics is the reason why they refuse to accept packs that have been transported, it wouldn't be fair to the rest of the albergues in town.

 

[Angelo]

Another option for the OP to consider, is to start from the less busy Caminos. CF is the busiest but there certainly are other options that will still give a pilgrim life changing experiences (or not).

My opinion about the crowds as one gets near Santiago de Compostela is to think of them as having their own journey. They sure have valid reasons for doing the trek, short distances or otherwise. It calms me when I tell myself that the group of "noisy" pilgrims who start in Sarria or Tui may only have 7 days to spare in their own busy lives. Or someone may not be fit enough to go the distance or carry their backpacks but still is doing his/her short Camino to find oneself or to dedicate it for a sick loved one. It's all to be taken in perspective.

Busy Albergues in the CF is the norm. When faced with this situation, I just find another suitable accommodation that I can afford to spare me from the "inconvenience". We all have our reasons for doing the Camino. So I cannot judge.

Il vaut mieux suivre le bon chemin en boitant
que le mauvais d'un pas ferme..
St. Augustin

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

Did a 320km stretch of the Camino a few years ago, beginning of June, unforgettable! fantastic! Was so looking forward to going back when I can. Speaking with a good friend who I met on the Camino then, who is back doing another stretch right now, she started in St Jean end May. Too crowded, too many people from every corner of the globe, very large groups, very noisy groups, no room in the albergues, arguments about accommodation, etc, etc, etc. Sounds awful! Has the Camino now been over-commercialised and ruined? Too many tour operators cashing in on the mystique of 'The Camino'? Unfortunately I'm starting to think so - maybe time to search something else out? Thoughts?

Hi, I walked from the 18th of April till the 24th of May this year . I had no problem with finding a bed. Wish you well and a Buen Camino, Peter.

 

[Urban Trekker]

When it comes to walking the Camino, different strokes for different folks. Is the Camino getting more popular, yes it is. Every year more and more people walk the Caminos. They go home and tell their friends what a great time they had and next year their friends walk the Caminos and go home a tell their friends. Get the picture. Is it being loved to death, I don't think so not yet at least, maybe some day. Until that day we need to take good care of the Caminos. Pick up our trash, stay on the existing trails, stop the graffiti, and remember we're guests in a foreign county.

 

[Kerstinh47]

I walked during a (presumably) busy time last year - mid May through June. Just one day, I couldn't get a bed at an albergue, and I walked for 43 days to reach Santiago. My preference was to walk alone, and I did most of the time. Your camino is safe, I think. We can journey with the need for solitude or with the need to find a 'camino family'. my opinion is that you find what you're looking for, and you will
Buen Camino

 

[MTtoCamino]

This has turned into a very good topic! For those of us blessed to have walked it in the past when you could go for long distance & not run into anyone, was a blessing, yet could be very lonely at times. The same is true as I refused to ever set foot in or on any vehicle until I reached my end point carrying my pack. I realized I could not or should not judge as who am I?
The best thing is to simply lead by example of how best we can show respect to the countless who walked before us. The rewards are astounding.

 

[Robo]

I'll freely admit, I kinda shake my head at the tour groups of pilgrims, and the ones that ship their stuff ahead as well as the throngs of bicyclists riding the Camino. As well as the tourist pilgrims with no backpack at all and simply ship ahead suitcases. It's hard not to shake your head a bit when you are walking the whole way with a pack. I certainly don't put myself on a higher pedestal than the others. I guess I just look it as sort of why would you want to do it any other way? But I suppose, it's just an example of different strokes for different folks.
I wouldn't let the prospect of an increased popularity of it prevent me from doing it.

Having just completed my first Camino from St Jean, i was somewhat anxious about what the last 100 kms in particular would be like. Up until then it did not feel crowded at all. ...

One of the lessons I learnt in the final 100 kms is that everyone walks their own camino in whatever way they see fit. We shouldn't try to impose a 'proper' way of walking it when no such thing exists.

I reflected a lot on this on my blog.

I noticed a curious thing. Correct me if I'm wrong.

On all those statues and images of Saint James as a Pilgrim, I couldn't see a single one where he carried a large backpack

And maybe for those of us who started in St Jean, we are thought of as 'short walkers' by those who started hundreds of kms before us?

I made a point of talking to some of the 'tourigrinos' in the last 100 kms. One guy in particular was recovering from extensive surgery and was almost blind.

He had started in St Jean. Guided over the pyrenees by his wife.

He would walk as much as he could each day and then his brother would pick him up by car. An amazing guy!

One thing that disappointed me a bit re the crowds, was that whilst I was walking a 'pilgrimage' on a pilgrimage 'route', many people seemed to be just on a hiking or cycling holiday......

Are they merely taking up resources such as beds that pilgrims could be using?

Just to stay on topic.... I finished last week and could always walk alone when I wanted to. Except the last 100. ....

 

[naplesdon]

There are many good alternative routes, some are on the Grande Randonnees which are mostly in France. I just walked from Oloron-Sainte Marie to Logrono for 2 weeks and for the better part of my journey there were very few people with whom I was sharing the route and the albergues.

 

[kelleymac]

Did a 320km stretch of the Camino a few years ago, beginning of June, unforgettable! fantastic! Was so looking forward to going back when I can. Speaking with a good friend who I met on the Camino then, who is back doing another stretch right now, she started in St Jean end May. Too crowded, too many people from every corner of the globe, very large groups, very noisy groups, no room in the albergues, arguments about accommodation, etc, etc, etc. Sounds awful! Has the Camino now been over-commercialised and ruined? Too many tour operators cashing in on the mystique of 'The Camino'? Unfortunately I'm starting to think so - maybe time to search something else out? Thoughts?

My 14 year old son and I walked from Leon to Santiago this Spring. We started walking on March 23, and walked for about 2 weeks. Hours went by when we were alone... sometimes most of the day. The albergues were about half full and welcoming. The weather was unexpectedly sunny the whole time. -- It did get more commercial when we passed the 100km mark of Sarria. Suddenly there were walkers with no packs, just getting their first (only?) blisters, and there were women wearing make-up! The muni-albergues seemed more streamlined, few had working kitchens, forcing us into restaurants nearby. And there were those awful cartoons of peregrinos. But it was a great time of year for us to go. The downsides were that many parochial albergues opened after Easter and some museums were closed too.

 

[NoQ]

This is an interesting thread.

On my first Camino (during the height of Summer), I too was surprised by the numbers and percentage of pilgrims not interested in a religious / spiritual experience. I was surprised by the lack of backpacks, the groups, the noise, the drunken parties... At first it all got to me

However, I then began to take it with a more relaxed attitude and was pleased to see people enjoying their Camino in their own way. I changed my plans too by deciding to book ahead private rooms rather than either compete for albergue space / sports hall space or spend a night under the starts (or rain clouds). As a result, I found I enjoyed my Camino even more and could relax knowing there was no need to rush, no need to be disturbed by group parties when I wanted some quieter times. I also gained an insight into cycling the Camino and seeing their side (constantly having to negotiate spread out walking pilgrims tired of moving for cyclist and ringing the bell all day is tiring for them too), as often the other people in hotels / hostales were cyclists.

This July I will be on my third summer Camino Frances and I am really looking forward to the last 5++ days (in summer it's actually really busy from Ponferrada) when I'll be walking with thousands of people from all walks of life, but all with the same destination.

 

[Charrito]

If you want to escape from the crowds, turn left at Ponferrada and go for the Camino de Invierno.

Marvellous! Incredible scenery, and you'll be on your own most of the time.

 

[andarilho]

If the crowds have you worried walk in the early spring as it was wonderful

Yes, I think that is one answer! thank you.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Albergue Gaucelmo is like that because it's a donativo albergue, local politics is the reason why they refuse to accept packs that have been transported, it wouldn't be fair to the rest of the albergues in town.

I remember seeing a sign on their door about the virtues of behing a non-helped pilgrim unless you had a medical note justifying the help. And I have never seen such a sign on any other donativo albergue. This was 4 years ago, and I don't have a picture of the sign, but I interpretated as being a way to honour those who chose the harder route.

 

[andarilho]

There are many good alternative routes, some are on the Grande Randonnees which are mostly in France. I just walked from Oloron-Sainte Marie to Logrono for 2 weeks and for the better part of my journey there were very few people with whom I was sharing the route and the albergues.

That's great information, thank you, certainly a real option!

 

[andarilho]

Enjoy what you do instead.

Thank you, I do!

 

[peregrinolincoln]

I went on the Camino in January of this year for three weeks. It was very tranquil and just what I needed. In the winter, a pilgrim needs to be more flexible - I had to turn back at Rabanal to go back to Astorga because the road and the path were closed because of snow. However, as a busy Catholic priest who needed the Camino as a time of retreat, I got what I needed. And for me, January is the closest thing to down time I have as a priest, getting back to my parish in Mississippi just before Ash Wednesday and the start of Lent. Some nights it was just me and another pilgrim in the albergue, one night I was by myself. I will be going back again this January - starting in Pamplona and walking for three week. I can't wait to get back. You might think of going in the winter.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

seeing their side (constantly having to negotiate spread out walking pilgrims tired of moving for cyclist and ringing the bell all day is tiring for them too)

That is why there are roads!

 

[andarilho]

If you want to escape from the crowds, turn left at Ponferrada and go for the Camino de Invierno.

Marvellous! Incredible scenery, and you'll be on your own most of the time.

Great information, thank you!

 

[Anniesantiago]

Things have definitely changed.
When I walked the first time, there were plenty of opportunities to be alone.
Now, you just have to plan to walk the shoulder season - NOT June, July, or August,
and you have to learn to walk "between Brierley's stages" and "between the wave" of pilgrims.
It's still possible - you just have to be smart.

As far as those walking without a pack, on my first Camino I remember being horrified at the busigrinos and tourigrinos getting off at the top of the hill between Orisson and Roncesvalles and literally RUNNING down the track while the rest of us were crying each painful step. At Gonzar, I was OUTRAGED with the groups I saw carrying wee tiny packs. How DARE they walk so unencumbered and enjoy their Camino!?!

Now I lead groups of 8 on the Camino and guess what?
We use pack transport!
We also book lodging ahead.

Do I feel guilty?
Nope.
Why?
1) I've paid my dues. I've walked more than once carrying my pack (and I'm not saying everyone must, either)
2) There are many people who are not able, physically, to carry a pack - would you tell them they can't walk? There are others who CHOOSE not to carry a pack. So what?! If they can afford bag transport, they're contributing to the economy of the people living along The Way.
3) I do not stay in municipal albergues, but book private lodging, which, by the way, the numbers of which have greatly increased since I first began walking.
4) Since the Camino began, people have ridden horses, taken wagons, and had their luggage transported on the Camino - it's nothing new
and finally...

5) The ONLY rule to getting your Compostela is that you must WALK the LAST 100 KILOMETERS.
There is NO RULE about carrying or not carrying packs, and certainly none along the rest of the route.

If you choose to carry your pack, and if you are able, go for it!
But please don't judge others.

As to the many groups, yes it can be frustrating, even to me. Lodging is booked up a year ahead by groups. I have to begin making my lodging reservations at least that far ahead of time.
This leads to wonderful rules like those made at Guacelmo where they insist you must walk in carrying your own pack (and of which another group of pilgrims complain).

You can't please everyone.
And it's not our job to be the world's police.

Just go.
Give yourself enough time to logically make the trip, then let the Camino guide you.
There are still plenty of beds...

 

[t2andreo]

The Camino Frances has a maximum "carrying capacity." This can be easily expressed as the number of bed spaces in albergues and other lodgings in a given stopping point. Because the Brierely Guide has become the defacto, but not sole, guide to the Camino Frances, we can use his daily stopping points as loose data points for our evaluation. Thus, the Camino cannot handle more people daily than the number of sleeping spaces available at these daily destinations.

Yes, I am aware that there are places to stay just before, just after, or slightly off the Camino proper. However, they are a fraction of the total bed space available nightly. Once these beds are fully subscribed, the Camino is saturated.

If you look at this over the calendar year, patterns can be readily seen. The "load" on the Camino is approximately a classic "Bell curve." There is a peak season, accompanied on either side by two "hip seasons." The hip seasons can be loosely classified as mild weather hip season, and seasonal weather hip season.

From all my reading, speaking to other pilgrims and after three personal Caminos, I submit the following "rule of thumb" to the "seasons of the Camino (Frances):

Early "seasonal" hip season - Early March through late April (until Easter). Weather conditions are more variable during this period and many albergues are not open until Easter.

Late (spring) hip season - From Easter until schools let out for the summer break. This differs internationally, but by mid-June, just about everyone involved in secondary or higher education is free of that responsibility. Also, our European friends start to take their more liberal holiday periods and many choose to walk the Camino.

Peak season - From mid-June through mid-September - this follows the educational schedule and many European vacation / holiday periods in July and August. This is simply when the greatest number of people are available to do pilgrimage. This is when there is the greatest competition for the available bed space, and other Camino resources.

Early (fall) hip season - from mid-September until the end of November. Towards the end of this period, albergues start to close for the season. But all the academic related, and most of the European holiday pilgrims are back to there work or classes. Also, the weather gets cooler and wetter as the days progress.

Off Season - from December through March - the fewest number of pilgrims are on the Camino during this time. However, so to are the number of albergues and some other pilgrim-related support services available. The weather can get very adverse too. Careful planning is essential.

We can differ on the dates, but I think this model is approximately correct.

The point of this is that if you think the Frances is "too crowded," do it at another time. If you cannot do it at another time, then consider doing a different route, that is less crowded.

FYI - I did the Porto - Santiago route this year, and I can tell you it is far less traveled than the Frances. The first two days, I saw only ONE pilgrim each day. On the third day, I saw a handful. It was not until the second week, in Spain (after Tui) that I started seeing pilgrims more or less regularly, but still at a far lower frequency than the Frances.

I hope this helps the dialog.

 

[MTtoCamino]

Things have definitely changed.
When I walked the first time, there were plenty of opportunities to be alone.
Now, you just have to plan to walk the shoulder season - NOT June, July, or August,
and you have to learn to walk "between Brierley's stages" and "between the wave" of pilgrims.
It's still possible - you just have to be smart.

As far as those walking without a pack, on my first Camino I remember being horrified at the busigrinos and tourigrinos getting off at the top of the hill between Orisson and Roncesvalles and literally RUNNING down the track while the rest of us were crying each painful step. At Gonzar, I was OUTRAGED with the groups I saw carrying wee tiny packs. How DARE they walk so unencumbered and enjoy their Camino!?!

Now I lead groups of 8 on the Camino and guess what?
We use pack transport!
We also book lodging ahead.

Do I feel guilty?
Nope.
Why?
1) I've paid my dues. I've walked more than once carrying my pack (and I'm not saying everyone must, either)
2) There are many people who are not able, physically, to carry a pack - would you tell them they can't walk? There are others who CHOOSE not to carry a pack. So what?! If they can afford bag transport, they're contributing to the economy of the people living along The Way.
3) I do not stay in municipal albergues, but book private lodging, which, by the way, the numbers of which have greatly increased since I first began walking.
4) Since the Camino began, people have ridden horses, taken wagons, and had their luggage transported on the Camino - it's nothing new
and finally...

5) The ONLY rule to getting your Compostela is that you must WALK the LAST 100 KILOMETERS.
There is NO RULE about carrying or not carrying packs, and certainly none along the rest of the route.

If you choose to carry your pack, and if you are able, go for it!
But please don't judge others.

As to the many groups, yes it can be frustrating, even to me. Lodging is booked up a year ahead by groups. I have to begin making my lodging reservations at least that far ahead of time.
This leads to wonderful rules like those made at Guacelmo where they insist you must walk in carrying your own pack (and of which another group of pilgrims complain).

You can't please everyone.
And it's not our job to be the world's police.

Just go.
Give yourself enough time to logically make the trip, then let the Camino guide you.
There are still plenty of beds...

Annie this is not being critical, as you have found a way to make the Camino a part of your life. I am assuming you have turned this into a business unless you just take folks who are interested.
If you didn't come up making a business doing this someone else will/has. But I know when you have walked this alone you get the respect aspect of those who had little to nothing when making the journey. I think all of us worry that this ribbon of wonder will become a commercialized circus. Then the bad will follow, this probably has been a discussion for centuries. But it is one worth having.
Keith

 

[Scott Sweeney]

I've been saying this for the best part of two years. Say what you want but it has become a fad thanks in large part to "that movie".
We chose the Portuges way because of the over crowding on the CF. I was and have been shocked at the rudeness and attitudes that have crept into the steps of the Camino de Santiago.

 

[CphYogini]

I have no comparisons this being my first one.
I'm walking right now started on the 29th of May - and I have had no problems finding time alone, sometimes so alone and for such extended periods I started to wonder if I'd taken a wrong turn.
This of course might change the closer I get to Santiago and the popular last 100k.
Is the Camino more popular now than just 10-20y ago - sure. But I take comfort in that many of the quaint, little villages on route are still there because of the Camino, we have fountains, cafés, accessible tracks, Albergues and the likes which would not be there without the perigrinos (no matters their mode of transport and carry-weight).
In this day and age no one thing can stay hidden for the few - and one day another thing will take over as the popular destination.

In short: turigrinos, bicigrinos or perigrinos no matter the number - walking the Camino still is bringing me closer to space - space of body, mind and soul.
To me it is about a state of mind.
I find friendly faces and open arms when needed and plenty of time for quiet reflections.

 

[Jeff Crawley]

Yes, it's more commercialised than when I first did it in 2001. Yes there are more people every year. Rough, stoney paths have been smoothed out and concreted over (Castrojeriz) and there are a lot of "cheaters" who walk a few clicks each day and swear they walked the whole way BUT it's still wonderous thing to do.
Go for it!

 

[Anna Machial]

I carried my pack along the Primitivo and then used transport for 3 times on the Francis. I loved the feel of carrying a pack with all my belongings. But due to arthritis in a knee, I couldn't do that and get to Santiago in time to catch my flight. I also used the bus and taxi on days my knee needed a break. For all but two nights I used private accommodation. If I do another camino I will use bag transfer. My conclusion on the pack hauling is that we can't judge what others are doing - we don't know their story. If you knew all of mine you would find that I did a true pilgrimage despite the bus, taxi, and bag transfer.
After meeting the warm caring people of Spain I am glad that there is an economic boom for them along the Francis. Hopefully, news of other routes will spread the crowds out a bit.

Also, in the middle of May we had no problem finding private accommodation the 2 days before Santiago and in Santiago despite lots of pilgrims.

 

[Coleen Clark]

Of all the problems in our world, too many people seeking the Truth in a Peaceful loving environment while drinking wine and listening to each others stories is not a problem. Sure, we may have to share too much of our personal space at a buffet table, but I am willing to add more water to the soup and invite one more person to the meal. This phenomenon is exactly what we have been praying for, that all men and women take the time while they live to find that individual seed of goodness locked inside by years and years of mundane struggle in an environment full of misinformation and radical irrationality. Rather than Jihad or Crusades or country invading country, I support inviting as many people as possible to walk, eat pinchos, drink wine and LISTEN to each other. I would sleep on a floor if we could convince the powerful people to do what we few do. Actually, I'd rather share the bunk...(with a very skinny person, please). (who doesn't snore please).

 

[Jeff Crawley]

Maybe more albergue should be like Gaucelmo in Rabanal: schlept your stuff or else You get turned away from the Inn. Christian don't you think?

Mmmm when I worked at Rabanal I took a day off to go into Astorga. I took my back pack with me as we needed supplies not available at Angela's shop. Waiting for the bus back I got chatting to an American woman who was "doing" the Camino. She assumed I was a pilgrim and I didn't disabuse her about that.
When we got to Rabanal I slipped into Gaucelmo via the back way and arrived in time to hear her declare "oh yes, I walked all the way from Astorga!"
Christian? I think not as others were still to arrive who HAD walked the whole way in 40 degree heat!

 

[simply B]

@Coleen Clark -

What you said!

True, useful...and Beautiful!

B

 

[Anniesantiago]

Annie this is not being critical, as you have found a way to make the Camino a part of your life. I am assuming you have turned this into a business unless you just take folks who are interested.
If you didn't come up making a business doing this someone else will/has. But I know when you have walked this alone you get the respect aspect of those who had little to nothing when making the journey. I think all of us worry that this ribbon of wonder will become a commercialized circus. Then the bad will follow, this probably has been a discussion for centuries. But it is one worth having.
Keith

For me, it is a way to walk each year.

When I was diagnosed with MCS, my specialist gave me two options: 1) chemical chelation or 2) long distance walking.

Since (for me) the Camino is the one long distance walking trek where I feel safest as a single woman walking, combined with my love for Spain and the Spanish people, I choose to walk the Camino.
But there is no way I could afford to go every year on my meager income.
And so I take just enough people to pay my own expenses - including paying myself for the time it takes to set it all up.

I do worry - I do - and the bad does seem to be following.
But the one thing in life we can count on is change... and just about the time we get used to things being one way, they go the other.
Right?
So instead of worrying, I'm putting on my rose-colored glasses and I'm going to make the Camino as many more times as my health will allow... and take a group along with me.
In my group's defense, we do book private lodging and do not take up space in the albergues and I school them heavily on proper Camino etiquette, so I hope they are well-mannered pilgrims.

 

[rometimed]

I am in Palas de Rei right now about 68 kms from Santiago and I will note some things:

1. Yes there are many many more Pilgrims than before Sarria and I watched many leave for their first day as I strolled through Sarria. The only ones I didn't particularly think much of were a group of Irish women (late 40s probably) stopping everywhere to drink bottles of wine then walk on inebreiated. I drink
beer sometimes on the way and after I'm done... but I find it strange to want to use the Camino like a cheap party... just seems strange.

2. Today I walked 35 kms and was never out of site of at least 6 other pilgrims EXCEPT when me and my friend went up then highway from Portomarin which is apparently not the right way... but we went faster and saw no one and reconnected to the Camino up then highway. He also said after in passed him he stopped a few times and was alone for big stretches.

3. my albergue here I am in a room of 8 bunks and only half have people now at lights out. But none of them started further away than Leon (besides me)

4. Those of us who have walked straight on from Saint Jean (and further) don't (usually) mind the other pilgrims too much other than of Albergues get full or they complain but I think it is just a human reaction to a comparison that is quite outrageously different. Even the people who do the Camino in stages year after year until finished... I can't imagine that as being anywhere near the same as my experience walking it in one big stretch.... the challenge, the friendships long and short... those you lose along the way... those you gain... people filling out their personality... the pain, desire, heartache, longing, love, kindness, sadness, laughter, fun, dismay, etc... can't imagine trying to do it in stages or just the end... would be very very odd having done this much.

 

[KatefromOz]

Perhaps the bones of St James need to be scattered. A shrine containing a foot or an arm at Pamplona, Burgos, Leon, and Ponferrada for example. Then you could get a compostela at any of 1/2 a dozen points along the camino. That would cause the crowds to spread out a bit too.

I ain't just doing it for his bones, I am doing it for these old bones.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

This leads to wonderful rules like those made at Guacelmo where they insist you must walk in carrying your own pack (and of which another group of pilgrims complain).

Annie, does this mean I was not mistaken when I said Gaucelmo does things differently than others, including donativos?

 

[hsabs]

As Pilgrims and Christians just let people get on and do it their own way, whether they are doing it for religious reasons or not. We are not here to criticise or pass judgement but to ejoy our own journey. Yes it is busier from Sarria but many people do not have the privilege of lengthy periods away from home or family to go for longer than that and I met Pilgrims going fron SJPDP who had bags carried - each to their own. I did not hear anything about lack of beds etc in that stretch!

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Please, for the love of the CF, can we please learn its name. FanCES. Not like the Pope's new name but as if French, as people were coming to it from France, and the same reason there are so many "Villafracas" along it.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

This phenomenon is exactly what we have been praying for, that all men and women take the time while they live to find that individual seed of goodness locked inside by years and years of mundane struggle in an environment full of misinformation and radical irrationality.

Colleen, if only this was why so many are walking it. But alas not the case. Nights being woken by drunken "pilgrims" as they try to find their bunk, only to see them at 8 am the next day starting their day with a beer, of people from the "NJ Fun & Fit Club" riding their bicycles for shorter distances than the slowest of us walks. And making shopping decisions based on the penny, instaead of being generous and undertstanding everyone needs to make a living on this route (hence why you buy something at a bar when using the loo). The picture you paint is beautiful, and for some true, and hopefully some of the those hoping for the most inexpensive holiday of their lives will encounter what you write about. Truth is, the Fun & Fit group may make the Camino impossible in the future for those you write about.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Hence why I love their policy. Those who have a physical need not to carry are still allowed in, so @Anna Machial would be allowed in. By "Very Christian" I was refering to the Inn in the birth of Jesus ;0)

 

[Anemone del Camino]

As Pilgrims and Christians

????

 

[Anniesantiago]

Annie, does this mean I was not mistaken when I said Gaucelmo does things differently than others, including donativos?

All I know about Guacelmo is that in the past, they have first taken pilgrims who carry their own pack. Each private Albergue is free to make their own rules as far as I know v

 

[MTtoCamino]

For me, it is a way to walk each year.

When I was diagnosed with MCS, my specialist gave me two options: 1) chemical chelation or 2) long distance walking.

Since (for me) the Camino is the one long distance walking trek where I feel safest as a single woman walking, combined with my love for Spain and the Spanish people, I choose to walk the Camino.
But there is no way I could afford to go every year on my meager income.
And so I take just enough people to pay my own expenses - including paying myself for the time it takes to set it all up.

I do worry - I do - and the bad does seem to be following.
But the one thing in life we can count on is change... and just about the time we get used to things being one way, they go the other.
Right?
So instead of worrying, I'm putting on my rose-colored glasses and I'm going to make the Camino as many more times as my health will allow... and take a group along with me.
In my group's defense, we do book private lodging and do not take up space in the albergues and I school them heavily on proper Camino etiquette, so I hope they are well-mannered pilgrims.

Right! You are in many ways in the position to lead by example, after my last comment I realized it really makes no difference how much we discuss this topic on this forum as the decisions are for the Spanish to decide, we can voice our opinions but in reality, unless we know the structure of how the decisions are put into place we are just flapping our lips. That is why I started another topic.
Bottom line we care maybe too much, in the end if the procession that grows too large & too rude it will simply stop folks from using that section. The one thing that I know is true is simply things always just seem to work out on the Camino's. It certainly has existed a long time before I rolled thru. God bless you for sharing this with others, like St. James it seems important enough to spread the knowledge.
Keith

 

[Anemone del Camino]

All I know about Guacelmo is that in the past, they have first taken pilgrims who carry their own pack. Each private Albergue is free to make their own rules as far as I know v

Maybe there can be a "Red de Albergues", not based on basic comforts but in Camino Spirit. What ever happend to the "Red, does anyone know? I know that the albergue in Molinaseca has come up for sale, so ...

 

[Scott Sweeney]

It is different now (Camino Frances) because of the tourists, the "this sounds like a great thing to tell my friends I did it" groups, the hey I liked that movie groups....its not to much of a stretch to say that a lot of the reason of the Camino has now been lost and replaced. It's sad but it has happened. And I will add myself to the list whose faith was put back stage to gratification.

 

[waveprof]

ecause the Brierely Guide has become the defacto, but not sole, guide to the Camino Frances,

The Brierly is only the #1 guide for pilgrims who speak English as their first language. Given that 49% of pilgrims are Spanish, that might put your Brierely assertion into some perspective. And as someone whose walking mate (my wife) is fluent in Spanish and French, I can tell you that there are FAR better books than the Brierely. More importantly, they often don't suggest the same stopping points. And few continental Europeans know who Brierely is.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

For me, it is a way to walk each year. When I was diagnosed with MCS, my specialist gave me two options: 1) chemical chelation or 2) long distance walking.

Annie, let me ask you, have you seen a difference in the people who reach out to you to join you on your walk?

In Buddhist retreats people have to bend over backwards to proove they belong there. Perhaps one day that will happen here? Perhaps that is the model to look to?

 

[Mark Lee]

Things have definitely changed.
When I walked the first time, there were plenty of opportunities to be alone.
Now, you just have to plan to walk the shoulder season - NOT June, July, or August,
and you have to learn to walk "between Brierley's stages" and "between the wave" of pilgrims.
It's still possible - you just have to be smart.

As far as those walking without a pack, on my first Camino I remember being horrified at the busigrinos and tourigrinos getting off at the top of the hill between Orisson and Roncesvalles and literally RUNNING down the track while the rest of us were crying each painful step. At Gonzar, I was OUTRAGED with the groups I saw carrying wee tiny packs. How DARE they walk so unencumbered and enjoy their Camino!?!

Now I lead groups of 8 on the Camino and guess what?
We use pack transport!
We also book lodging ahead.

Do I feel guilty?
Nope.
Why?
1) I've paid my dues. I've walked more than once carrying my pack (and I'm not saying everyone must, either)
2) There are many people who are not able, physically, to carry a pack - would you tell them they can't walk? There are others who CHOOSE not to carry a pack. So what?! If they can afford bag transport, they're contributing to the economy of the people living along The Way.
3) I do not stay in municipal albergues, but book private lodging, which, by the way, the numbers of which have greatly increased since I first began walking.
4) Since the Camino began, people have ridden horses, taken wagons, and had their luggage transported on the Camino - it's nothing new
and finally...

5) The ONLY rule to getting your Compostela is that you must WALK the LAST 100 KILOMETERS.
There is NO RULE about carrying or not carrying packs, and certainly none along the rest of the route.

If you choose to carry your pack, and if you are able, go for it!
But please don't judge others.

As to the many groups, yes it can be frustrating, even to me. Lodging is booked up a year ahead by groups. I have to begin making my lodging reservations at least that far ahead of time.
This leads to wonderful rules like those made at Guacelmo where they insist you must walk in carrying your own pack (and of which another group of pilgrims complain).

You can't please everyone.
And it's not our job to be the world's police.

Just go.
Give yourself enough time to logically make the trip, then let the Camino guide you.
There are still plenty of beds...

Ummm, no offense, but I would think that would be because you make money from it. A business. Who would feel guilty because they make a profit after opening a business?

 

[Anniesantiago]

Ummm, no offense, but I would think that would be because you make money from it. A business. Who would feel guilty because they make a profit after opening a business?

Well you are entitled to your opinion. My reasons for not feeling guilty about using pack transport are as stated.

 

[Anniesantiago]

Annie, let me ask you, have you seen a difference in the people who reach out to you to join you on your walk?

In Buddhist retreats people have to bend over backwards to proove they belong there. Perhaps one day that will happen here? Perhaps that is the model to look to?

No. There is always a wide range of people, from those who are deeply devout to those who are simply walking for the joy of walking.

 

[Anniesantiago]

Ummm, no offense, but I would think that would be because you make money from it. A business. Who would feel guilty because they make a profit after opening a business?

And if I paid myself for the hours it takes to set up such a trip for a group, I would be making less than $2 per hour. So though I get a 'trade out' for my time, I certainly do not 'make money.' In other words, if you want to do what I do, don't quit your day job.

 

[Anna Machial]

Please, for the love of the CF, can we please learn its name. FanCES. Not like the Pope's new name but as if French, as people were coming to it from France, and the same reason there are so many "Villafracas" along it.

Thank you. I stand corrected. Frances it is then, as in 'coming from France.'

 

[Anniesantiago]

I enjoy doing it.
It is my medical treatment first.
Second, it brings me joy to help others who might not be able to go on their own, whatever their reasons may be.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I enjoy doing it.
It is my medical treatment first.
Second, it brings me joy to help others who might not be able to go on their own, whatever their reasons may be.

So, are must of your lot not 'able', or do they just think they are not?

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Maybe there can be a "Red de Albergues", not based on basic comforts but in Camino Spirit. What ever happend to the "Red, does anyone know? I know that the albergue in Molinaseca has come up for sale, so ...

There is one (red means network):
http://redalberguessantiago.com/index.php/asociacion/conocenos

They formed over a decade ago to bring some standards to private albergues. Member albergues come and go.

 

[Anniesantiago]

So, are must of your lot not 'able', or do they just think they are not?

Some are not able.
Some think they are not.
Some are afraid because of the language issue.
Some just feel safer in a group.
Some like the idea of having their lodging booked for them and transportation taken care of.
All have their own reasons.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Some are not able.
Some think they are not.
Some are afraid because of the language issue.
Some just feel safer in a group.
Some like the idea of having their lodging booked for them and transportation taken care of.
All have their own reasons.

OK, so how many are not able? ABLE!

 

[Anemone del Camino]

There is one (red means network):
http://redalberguessantiago.com/index.php/asociacion/conocenos

They formed over a decade ago to bring some standards to private albergues. Member albergues come and go.

Yes, that is exactly my point. That 'red' was reated based on basic facilitities. I did not come up with that name. But what about having "pilgrim spirit one' where you pay twice the price, 50% up the cost, or what have you, and wher those in REAL need can stay for free, or what have you? And party goers get the boot! ;0)

 

[CaminoCruiser]

Please, for the love of the CF, can we please learn its name. FanCES. Not like the Pope's new name but as if French, as people were coming to it from France, and the same reason there are so many "Villafracas" along it.

If we are going to be pedantic it's actually FRances and VillafraNca.

 

[Anniesantiago]

OK, so how many are not able? ABLE!

I don't make them take a test.
It doesn't matter to me.

 

[simply B]

Annie, let me ask you, have you seen a difference in the people who reach out to you to join you on your walk?

In Buddhist retreats people have to bend over backwards to prove they belong there. Perhaps one day that will happen here? Perhaps that is the model to look to?

Well, I reckon that if there is ever a "purity test" for the Camino we can expect numbers to drop precipitously. I mean, I'd be all in favor of getting rid of those "sinners", "cheaters" and "fakes" out there if, IF, I could just be assured that my own shortcomings were not on the screening list. I mean, after all, I have carried my own bag for 2,000 km so I should have some special recognition and rights, no?

Okay - - sarcasm off.

Let's remember that James and his brother were pretty insistent about being given places of honor in Heaven. Maybe some of that is being infused into us lesser mortals, lo these many years on. (Regrettably.)

Just another ordinary, fallen human,

B

 

[jpflavin1]

Did a 320km stretch of the Camino a few years ago, beginning of June, unforgettable! fantastic! Was so looking forward to going back when I can. Speaking with a good friend who I met on the Camino then, who is back doing another stretch right now, she started in St Jean end May. Too crowded, too many people from every corner of the globe, very large groups, very noisy groups, no room in the albergues, arguments about accommodation, etc, etc, etc. Sounds awful! Has the Camino now been over-commercialised and ruined? Too many tour operators cashing in on the mystique of 'The Camino'? Unfortunately I'm starting to think so - maybe time to search something else out? Thoughts?

There is more than one Camino. Walk the VdlP, Levante, Portuguese etc.

Ultreya,
Joe

 

[julie]

During my first pilgrimage in 2005, the thought crossed my mind that, if everyone walked the Camino, the world would be a better place. Now I wonder whether it's in danger of imploding.

I have met many pilgrims who were walking in a different fashion to myself because they were struggling with health issues. I am fortunate that I am able to carry my backpack with relative ease and am grateful for that rather than judgemental for those who are unable to do so. Similarly, lots of people (particularly women) feel daunted by the prospect of setting out on pilgrimage without a support structure. Should they be denied the possibility of exploring the spirituality of the Camino? A service such as that provided by Anniesantiago is invaluable for those people. I very much doubt that groups such as hers are upsetting other pilgrims by partying their way across Spain.

There is so much angst around the issue of crowding on the last 100km. Is this too short a distance to gain a Compostela? Anyway, why do we need a piece of paper to prove that we have completed a spiritual journey? Surely the gains are intrinsic. The power of the Camino experience continues to work on us for a considerable period of time and it is the change within that is more important to show to friends and family than a piece of paper no matter how pretty.

All through its history, interest in the Camino has had great peaks and it does seem to have become a bit of a fad in recent years. However, it has always been promoted as a spiritual journey and I believe that it is becoming more popular because a great many people are seeking something more meaningful. Surely this has to be a good thing.

 

[NoQ]

There is more than one Camino. Walk the VdlP, Levante, Portuguese etc.

Ultreya,
Joe

This makes perfect sense. The other Camino routes still offer peace and tranquility. When I walked the Ingles, which of course is the equivalent of walking from Sarria, the contrasts were huge. I saw hardly any pilgrims all day.

 

[MTtoCamino]

During my first pilgrimage in 2005, the thought crossed my mind that, if everyone walked the Camino, the world would be a better place. Now I wonder whether it's in danger of imploding.

I have met many pilgrims who were walking in a different fashion to myself because they were struggling with health issues. I am fortunate that I am able to carry my backpack with relative ease and am grateful for that rather than judgemental for those who are unable to do so. Similarly, lots of people (particularly women) feel daunted by the prospect of setting out on pilgrimage without a support structure. Should they be denied the possibility of exploring the spirituality of the Camino? A service such as that provided by Anniesantiago is invaluable for those people. I very much doubt that groups such as hers are upsetting other pilgrims by partying their way across Spain.

There is so much angst around the issue of crowding on the last 100km. Is this too short a distance to gain a Compostela? Anyway, why do we need a piece of paper to prove that we have completed a spiritual journey? Surely the gains are intrinsic. The power of the Camino experience continues to work on us for a considerable period of time and it is the change within that is more important to show to friends and family than a piece of paper no matter how pretty.

All through its history, interest in the Camino has had great peaks and it does seem to have become a bit of a fad in recent years. However, it has always been promoted as a spiritual journey and I believe that it is becoming more popular because a great many people are seeking something more meaningful. Surely this has to be a good thing.

Yes Annisantiago does not strike me as a party animal Someday I do hope to meet my neighbors here in the North West, so far everyone of them I would be honored to walk with. Thank you for showing a soft heart!

 

[SabsP]

This makes perfect sense. The other Camino routes still offer peace and tranquility. When I walked the Ingles, which of course is the equivalent of walking from Sarria, the contrasts were huge. I saw hardly any pilgrims all day.

April/May 2011 : Camino Frances : still a relatively quiet walk for me , stopping in the " in between " Brierley stages.
April/May 2013 : Part of Camino del Ebro ( very lonely ) and then further on the Frances ( still doable but yes an increase on pilgrims who like to start drinking alcohol at nine in the morning ? and lots of prebooked groups but like annie said most of them take hostales).
April 2014 : Camino Ingles : Saw in total five pilgrims on the way..
Plan for August/September 2015 : Portugues from Porto. I expect more pilgrims than normally on this route seeing it is summerholidays but hope it will be bearable.

 

[naplesdon]

And making shopping decisions based on the penny, instaead of being generous and undertstanding everyone needs to make a living on this route (hence why you buy something at a bar when using the loo.

I saw an example of this last week in Villamayor de Monjardin. A young girl bought a bottle of wine at the tiendra and carried it to the only bar in town and had the gall to ask the owner for a cork screw and 3 wine glasses so she could share it with her friends. He's a nice, generous guy and he was willing to accommodate her request. Her next move was high fiving her friends about her boldness. I'd chalk it up as being petty and rude.

 

[roberbolo]

Hi you all!
I have both walked/biked the way up to 12 times and this summer will do again twice.
I have known the french one, the primitive, Northern, Sanabres, plata, Fisterra & Muxia, Levante... and this is the first year that the idea of leaving the camino has popped up in my mind.
It is quite normal to have some peaks from time to time but these days it is crazy, I don´t know if it is due to certain movie but being so busy, (IMHO) the Camino is loosing his esence.
There are more and more business around the Camino, everyone seems to be willing to make money from the pilgrims, we are now hearing about disappeared people and "dangerous areas along the Camino", corporations that "organice" your Camino, taxis and buses everywhere, cars transporting backpaks and also people, "pilgrims" running legs to get a bed in the Albergues, or, what I consider rude and selfish, getting out a bus or car at the border of the village pretending they have walked the leg. It has changed a lot from my first Camino in 1999.
I hope this situation will be reverted in few years, the Camino will die from success just like a rock star and will have again our loved pilgrims from all around the world, and less people avid for money trying to change the Camino into their own business.
My 2 cents

 

[William Garza]

Being the spot of the moment
The Spiritual journey du jour
It was simply faaabulous daahhling...

Poo.
Julie said it,there have been ups and downs.once the cachet,the,exclusivity of a place is gone,the rest move on to the next quick fix for spiritual,religious,bucket listy type things to do...
And the people left behind of tbis boom and bust cycle are left to hold the bag.
And the core will still turn
A certain ...gravity will still tug at some from across the world...
And the Camino will go on,,,

 

[naplesdon]

Hi you all!
I have both walked/biked the way up to 12 times and this summer will do again twice.
I have known the french one, the primitive, Northern, Sanabres, plata, Fisterra & Muxia, Levante... and this is the first year that the idea of leaving the camino has popped up in my mind.
It is quite normal to have some peaks from time to time but these days it is crazy, I don´t know if it is due to certain movie but being so busy, (IMHO) the Camino is loosing his esence.
There are more and more business around the Camino, everyone seems to be willing to make money from the pilgrims, we are now hearing about disappeared people and "dangerous areas along the Camino", corporations that "organice" your Camino, taxis and buses everywhere, cars transporting backpaks and also people, "pilgrims" running legs to get a bed in the Albergues, or, what I consider rude and selfish, getting out a bus or car at the border of the village pretending they have walked the leg. It has changed a lot from my first Camino in 1999.
I hope this situation will be reverted in few years, the Camino will die from success just like a rock star and will have again our loved pilgrims from all around the world, and less people avid for money trying to change the Camino into their own business.
My 2 cents

I am ready to join you. I certainly have less experience than you have, I did the first 8 stages of the CF in 2011 and since then completed the CF twice and the CP once. Looking for alternatives this year I have just completed the Aragones from Oloron to Logrono and totally enjoyed the route until I ran into the "march of the pilgrims" in Puenta la Reina. I am working as a hospitelero in San Anton next month and in August joining friends from last year to walk from Burgos to Astorga where I plan to take the train to Ferrol and walk what I hope will a less crowded route on the CI.
IMHO after five years of walking I have seen a major change in the attitudes and behavior of my fellow travelers and that is very sad.
The commercialism does not bother me with shops and albergues popping up all over is good for the Spanish economy but the fakery of some pilgrims pretending to be serious about getting to their next stop is an amazing thing to observe.

 

[roberbolo]

I am ready to join you. I certainly have less experience than you have, I did the first 8 stages of the CF in 2011 and since then completed the CF twice and the CP once. Looking for alternatives this year I have just completed the Aragones from Oloron to Logrono and totally enjoyed the route until I ran into the "march of the pilgrims" in Puenta la Reina. I am working as a hospitelero in San Anton next month and in August joining friends from last year to walk from Burgos to Astorga where I plan to take the train to Ferrol and walk what I hope will a less crowded route on the CI.
IMHO in my short five years of walking I have seen a major change in the attitudes and behavior of my fellow travelers and that is very sad.
The commercialism does not bother me with shops and albergues popping up all over is good for the Spanish economy but the fakery of some pilgrims pretending to be serious about getting to their next stop is an amazing thing to observe.

You will agree that it is not about experience or how many times has anyone walked the way but about feelings and behavior. I do like sharing steps meals and chats with other pilgrims, I do love those after-dinner moments at Albergues and all of those Camino stories but on the other hand, I like more the walk-alone legs, and make stop overs each time I find a pilgrim.
This changes in a dramatic way when I see them sleeping early in the morning and after a let´s say 40-45 kms I see them again in my next albergue (w/o) having seen them in the Camino or not even seeing them sweating .
Due to my job I am so used to walk and sleep over the ground, openfield, and it is not a problem for me if there is not a bed in an Albergue but there may be someone needing that bed more than those non-walking pilgrims.
That´s not fair at all, additionally to this, the Camino can not be permanently monitored to avoid those behaviors and make the hospitaleros life easier, not admitting the non-walking ones.
Fortunately we still have more walk-alone tracks than CF, where we can find the real (and sadly sometimes lost) "Spirit".

About the commercialism, I don´t care if there are lots of shops or private Albergeues, they just make their job ( or play their role) but, what really kills me is some behaviors such as those in Orbenlle (C.Portugues) where people is destroying the official marks and yellow arrows to repaint them bypassing some areas just to make the Camino be drown in front of some bar, making pilgrims walk through an industrial area, instead having the chance of choosing a close-to-a river into the woods one.
I read in another forum ( they uploaded a picture of the bill) that in that particular location, they had to pay 1 euro for having his credencial stamped (what not happened to me in the same bar two months ago, may be because I am Spaniard?). Those are the business I would like to see out from the Camino, those are the behaviors I don´t like to see.

At the end, we are lucky because the Camino finish in our country and that is not the image of my country I want to be shown abroad.

 

[jefferyonthecamino]

Did a 320km stretch of the Camino a few years ago, beginning of June, unforgettable! fantastic! Was so looking forward to going back when I can. Speaking with a good friend who I met on the Camino then, who is back doing another stretch right now, she started in St Jean end May. Too crowded, too many people from every corner of the globe, very large groups, very noisy groups, no room in the albergues, arguments about accommodation, etc, etc, etc. Sounds awful! Has the Camino now been over-commercialised and ruined? Too many tour operators cashing in on the mystique of 'The Camino'? Unfortunately I'm starting to think so - maybe time to search something else out? Thoughts?

go for it!

but since 813 the Camino has drawn hundreds of thousands of pilgrims, they would have been noisy (those kids!), the hospices would have been just as crowded and people in the know would have been making a penny and commercialising as much as possible (gotta love those cathedrals that were built in part with pilgrim cash)

 

[newfydog]

go for it!

but since 813 the Camino has drawn hundreds of thousands of pilgrims, they would have been noisy (those kids!), the hospices would have been just as crowded and people in the know would have been making a penny and commercialising as much as possible (gotta love those cathedrals that were built in part with pilgrim cash)

The accounts of the original Camino are a good reference. Entire towns sprung up just to do business with pilgrims. It was also crowded, littered with thieves, fraudsters, hookers, and various dangers.

The Camino is actually becoming more authentic. In a country with 23 % unemployment (49%) for young people, a bit of crowded tourist industry and commercialism is not a bad thing.

 

[fiona99]

I found the atmosphere and camaraderie did change after sarria....had some pointless negative comments made by some people.....which on their own was not really a problem but did become annoying the more often it happened...

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

I found the atmosphere and camaraderie did change after sarria....had some pointless negative comments made by some people.....which on their own was not really a problem but did become annoying the more often it happened...

Hello , I had some negative comments as well . They where made by small groups of " Camino Tourists " . Wish you well , Peter.

 

[robertt]

For a completely different experience of the exact same Camino Frances, try walking out from Pamplona in February. Worked for me! Other challenges to replace crowds and heat, of course, but you might enjoy what company there is as much as the greater company of warmer months. And the locals have more time as well.

Who knows? Maybe politics and weather might change again and there will be just a few brave stragglers on the Camino...regretting the old boom days of the early 21st century.

So let's just go!

Happy caminos all

Rob

 

[mspath]

Late autumn/winter is a wonderful time to walk with generally sunny cool days and frosty to cold nights. Many albergues are closed but those that are open are welcoming. As long as you are well prepared, know your limits, follow the weather reports and do not take chances you can have a fine pilgrimage in the so-called "off " season. ...How I do hope to walk at this time once again this year.

MM

 

[roberbolo]

For a completely different experience of the exact same Camino Frances, try walking out from Pamplona in February. Worked for me! Other challenges to replace crowds and heat, of course, but you might enjoy what company there is as much as the greater company of warmer months. And the locals have more time as well.

Who knows? Maybe politics and weather might change again and there will be just a few brave stragglers on the Camino...regretting the old boom days of the early 21st century.

So let's just go!

Happy caminos all

Rob

Hi namesakeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee ! I do agree with you, other seasons apart from summer are (IMHO) better to walk the Camino, also different tracks, not only Frances, but as an example ( my favorite one) Primitivo ( my first primitivo was made with snow). As I said before, in my first post, I think that the Camino will die itself due to its own fame, I just hope this day comes soon and we are able to enjoy our Camino deep in our souls, not only suffer it in our bodies and minds (ironic mode on).

Buen Camino!!!

Late autumn/winter is a wonderful time to walk with generally sunny cool days and frosty to cold nights. Many albergues are closed but those that are open are welcoming. As long as you are well prepared, know your limits, follow the weather reports and do not take chances you can have a fine pilgrimage in the so-called "off " season. ...How I do hope to walk at this time once again this year.

MM

MM interesting blog! I do agree with you and strongly recommend your advises about knowing own limits and weather reports, specially if walking along one of those "less known" Caminos.
Being a pilgrim has nothing to do with being a martyr, I mean, our Camino should not in any way risk our life.

Ultreia!!!!

 

[andarilho]

The accounts of the original Camino are a good reference. Entire towns sprung up just to do business with pilgrims. It was also crowded, littered with thieves, fraudsters, hookers, and various dangers.

The Camino is actually becoming more authentic. In a country with 23 % unemployment (49%) for young people, a bit of crowded tourist industry and commercialism is not a bad thing.

Maybe so!

 

[trevorcc]

As I read this thread (am sad as Sept. is nearing and this year I am unable to walk the Camino) I am so sad to hear the complaints yes the CF is crowded but you will find peace and space if you want may I suggest we just all smile at fellow pilgrims as we do not know why they are on the Camino and just be good Pilgrims to all.
It has changed my life and I hope those that walk it are changed for the better.....SMILE and be nice.
As my Grandfather always told me , "It's nice to be nice"
Buen Camino
P.S. try and clean up some rubbish on your walk.

 

[newfydog]

Being a pilgrim has nothing to do with being a martyr, I mean, our Camino should not in any way risk our life.
!!

Traditionally, it certainly did risk your life. Each community along the way designated a small body of Christians, whose duty was to bury the those pilgrims who died within the gates.

 

[naplesdon]

The accounts of the original Camino are a good reference. Entire towns sprung up just to do business with pilgrims. It was also crowded, littered with thieves, fraudsters, hookers, and various dangers.

The Camino is actually becoming more authentic. In a country with 23 % unemployment (49%) for young people, a bit of crowded tourist industry and commercialism is not a bad thing.

Newfydog, I agree with you 100% and in the past 5 years have seen many new cafes, bars and albergues spring up in newly constructed and rehabilitated, neglected properties. That means construction jobs for laborers and craftsmen and it seems that mostly the young people are the ones being employed in these new establishments.
I have experienced the various dangers, thieves and fraudsters; but never once have I seen a hooker. What am I missing?

 

[Charrito]

If you want to escape from the crowds, turn left at Ponferrada and go for the Camino de Invierno.

Marvellous! Incredible scenery, and you'll be on your own most of the time.

If you look on the Camino de Invierno thread, you'll find a marvellously produced guide to this route. There is also an excellent day-by-day account by KinkyOne of his walk last year. I have added my experiences from the last couple of weeks (Setting Out From Ponferrada Next Weekend).

As I said above, for those of you who have had enough of the overcrowding on the Camino Francés, especially the last stretch from Ponferrada, Cebreiro or Sarria, then this is just the opposite: marvellous stages (some quite long and hard), with fantastic scenery, beautiful towns and villages, great food and drink . . .

I appreciate that many pilgrims still prefer to be surrounded by hundreds and thousands of other walkers. But this route is definitely one that is taking off, even though it is still practically unknown.

There are not too many albergues (A Rúa, Quiroga) until you join up with the Via de la Plata around Lalín, but there are plenty of good cheap hostals and pensions to stop in.

It's absolutely one extreme to the other. If you look at the statistics for May, you will find over 20,000 pilgrims who walked the Camino Francés, while just 21 went for the Invierno.

 

[Angelo]

I have experienced the various dangers, thieves and fraudsters; but never once have I seen a hooker. What am I missing?

I may have missed that, too! But I wasn't looking. I just kept my eyes on the trail.

 

[Hanne]

Did a 320km stretch of the Camino a few years ago, beginning of June, unforgettable! fantastic! Was so looking forward to going back when I can. Speaking with a good friend who I met on the Camino then, who is back doing another stretch right now, she started in St Jean end May. Too crowded, too many people from every corner of the globe, very large groups, very noisy groups, no room in the albergues, arguments about accommodation, etc, etc, etc. Sounds awful! Has the Camino now been over-commercialised and ruined? Too many tour operators cashing in on the mystique of 'The Camino'? Unfortunately I'm starting to think so - maybe time to search something else out? Thoughts?

Try the others spanish caminos instead, like Camino Aragonés, Camino Vasco del Interiór, Camino del Salvador, Camino de Madrid or Camino Inverno, less crowded.
Camino Francés is best to awoid in the summermonths. If I ever should walk Camino Francés again, it would be in the Winter/early Spring or late Fall.

 

[Anniesantiago]

Late autumn/winter is a wonderful time to walk with generally sunny cool days and frosty to cold nights. Many albergues are closed but those that are open are welcoming. As long as you are well prepared, know your limits, follow the weather reports and do not take chances you can have a fine pilgrimage in the so-called "off " season. ...How I do hope to walk at this time once again this year.

MM

Someday I'd like to try a winter Camino!
I will be sure to pick your brains when that happens - I think my biggest concern would be the limited distance I'm able to walk = probably never more than 25-30 k.
But I guess there are always buses and taxis!

 

[volleyjanice]

Of all the problems in our world, too many people seeking the Truth in a Peaceful loving environment while drinking wine and listening to each others stories is not a problem. Sure, we may have to share too much of our personal space at a buffet table, but I am willing to add more water to the soup and invite one more person to the meal. This phenomenon is exactly what we have been praying for, that all men and women take the time while they live to find that individual seed of goodness locked inside by years and years of mundane struggle in an environment full of misinformation and radical irrationality. Rather than Jihad or Crusades or country invading country, I support inviting as many people as possible to walk, eat pinchos, drink wine and LISTEN to each other. I would sleep on a floor if we could convince the powerful people to do what we few do. Actually, I'd rather share the bunk...(with a very skinny person, please). (who doesn't snore please).

.
I am going to save this and endeavour to remind myself of it when we set out from Burgos in August 6th. I am already fretting about how busy it will likely get even though we have already decided that we will bail on the Frances if it is too unbearable and bus to another route to continue walking. It's so easy to get caught up in the logistics and forget that although we would like to complete the Camino France's route that we began in 2013, the whole point is to enjoy the journey! I am also torn by feeling a desire, and (pressure) to carry my pack despite entering month 7 of a neck problem that I can't seeem to get fixed. It's hard enough to let go of my own expectations never mind those of complete strangers...and I am just as guilty of passing judgement on others as the next pilgrim! More work to do on acceptance and letting go... Anyway, as Coleen points out, these are not "problems"!

 

[volleyjanice]

The Brierly is only the #1 guide for pilgrims who speak English as their first language. Given that 49% of pilgrims are Spanish, that might put your Brierely assertion into some perspective. And as someone whose walking mate (my wife) is fluent in Spanish and French, I can tell you that there are FAR better books than the Brierely. More importantly, they often don't suggest the same stopping points. And few continental Europeans know who Brierely is.

When assembling with an international group and comparing books they were indeed VERY different from one another, especially when it came to distances! I did not particularly like the Brierly guide. For some reason I found it a bit difficult to follow and his "reflections" drove me insane! Are you able to recommend another guidebook that is translated into English?

 

[waveprof]

When assembling with an international group and comparing books they were indeed VERY different from one another, especially when it came to distances! I did not particularly like the Brierly guide. For some reason I found it a bit difficult to follow and his "reflections" drove me insane! Are you able to recommend another guidebook that is translated into English?

All of the Anayas guides are pretty good, but I don't think they have English translations yet.

The Confraternity of St James's list of albuergues is a must have, and almost negates the need for a guidebook (other than for maps)....which would allow you to just carry the Brierly map guide (although we found inaccuracies in his maps too, so....).

 

[Angelo]

When assembling with an international group and comparing books they were indeed VERY different from one another, especially when it came to distances! I did not particularly like the Brierly guide. For some reason I found it a bit difficult to follow and his "reflections" drove me insane! Are you able to recommend another guidebook that is translated into English?

I used Rother guide book by Rabe. No waffling and easy to use.

 

[dcorrea951]

There is a quote you may want to consider: "It's your road and yours alone. Others may walk it with you, but no one can walk it for you". I'm confident that what YOU experience will be much different than those pilgrims that ship their bags or take a taxi. The only person they are cheating is themselves. I know you understand what I am saying, and you will reflect upon your experience, as I do, with much love, respect, pain, endurance, understanding, and the feeling of peace that it gives to us. Do not judge them, rather pity them for not doing a true Pilgrimage and not embracing the reason for the Camino.

 

[trevorcc]

Does anyone know of a guide book from Barcelona in English please as I was looking at the Ruta de Elbro in 2016

 

[Angelo]

So what exactly is a" true pilgrimage" and what does it mean to "embrace the reason for the Camino"?
We can't generalise for each and everyone and especially for somebody who can only walk a fair distance for medical reasons or disability. Does someone who started from LePuy feel more entitled to call himself a pilgrim than someone who walked from St.Jean, Pamplona or Sarria?

 

[newfydog]

Does someone who started from LePuy feel more entitled to call himself a pilgrim than someone who walked from St.Jean, Pamplona or Sarria?

Of course they do. They know they shouldn't, but they still do.

 

[Bradypus]

So what exactly is a" true pilgrimage" and what does it mean to "embrace the reason for the Camino"?

Towards the end of a long and very sweaty day somewhere near Leon some years ago I met a bus full of rather elderly Germans on their way to Santiago. Someone asked if I was a pilgrim. I answered "yes". Another lady then asked me what group I was with. I told her that I walked alone. She then scolded me very emphatically and declared that unless - like her and her companions - I was part of an organized group travelling with a priest then it was not a real pilgrimage. For her "pilgrimage" had a very specific shape, form and purpose. I was very angry but far too tired to argue. My own equally dogmatic notion of pilgrimage was pretty much the opposite of hers and I was very dismissive of these "tourists". Several years and far too many km later I am still a little ashamed of my reaction that day. I hope I have acquired enough generosity of spirit now to let others find their own way of being a pilgrim and to wish them joy in it.

 

[Phillypilgrim]

There is a quote you may want to consider: "It's your road and yours alone. Others may walk it with you, but no one can walk it for you". I'm confident that what YOU experience will be much different than those pilgrims that ship their bags or take a taxi. The only person they are cheating is themselves. I know you understand what I am saying, and you will reflect upon your experience, as I do, with much love, respect, pain, endurance, understanding, and the feeling of peace that it gives to us. Do not judge them, rather pity them for not doing a true Pilgrimage and not embracing the reason for the Camino.

I'm speechless.