Being locked in a hostal or albergue

[peregrina2000]

On another thread about a new Hostal in Torres del Rio, the person who stayed there described how they were locked into the place and had to wait to be let out in the morning by the owners. Others then added similar experiences.

I have been in this situation on various occasions -- being totally locked inside, no way out, till the owner shows up.

I wrote to a friend of mine in Madrid who is a law professor, and he responded immediately -- this is totally illegal, for two reasons, one more theoretical, one practical:

1. It would be deemed a restriction on the fundamental human right of liberty (Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution)

2. Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws that require owners to facilitate free exit and entry at all times for the guests.

So, if this happens to anyone on the Camino, you should not accept it. I know that pilgrims don't have time to file a law suit, but you can let the owner know you know the law and insist on being able to get in and out, with a key or whatever it takes. This is a huge safety issue, I think, in addition to being able to come and go as you please.

Buen camino, Laurie

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws

And many of those regulations exempt albergues. New albergues are built to new codes, but the old ones have been grandfathered exemptions to health and safety regulations. Remember, the refugio concept began with bed space on the floor and an outhouse. That floor space could block a fire exit, and no one blinked. I cannot imagine that Granon conforms to current regulations, but I would hate to see it closed down.

 

[Con Palos]

On another thread about a new Hostal in Torres del Rio, the person who stayed there described how they were locked into the place and had to wait to be let out in the morning by the owners. Others then added similar experiences.

I have been in this situation on various occasions -- being totally locked inside, no way out, till the owner shows up.

I wrote to a friend of mine in Madrid who is a law professor, and he responded immediately -- this is totally illegal, for two reasons, one more theoretical, one practical:

1. It would be deemed a restriction on the fundamental human right of liberty (Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution)

2. Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws that require owners to facilitate free exit and entry at all times for the guests.

So, if this happens to anyone on the Camino, you should not accept it. I know that pilgrims don't have time to file a law suit, but you can let the owner know you know the law and insist on being able to get in and out, with a key or whatever it takes. This is a huge safety issue, I think, in addition to being able to come and go as you please.

Buen camino, Laurie

Yes it happen a few times to me over my two caminos, often wandered about fire and consequence of being locked in
Another worry was a few private albergues/hostels kept our passports?? for security they said

It's all good, have to be firmer I guess and question more

 

[yolanda Mejia]

On another thread about a new Hostal in Torres del Rio, the person who stayed there described how they were locked into the place and had to wait to be let out in the morning by the owners. Others then added similar experiences.

I have been in this situation on various occasions -- being totally locked inside, no way out, till the owner shows up.

I wrote to a friend of mine in Madrid who is a law professor, and he responded immediately -- this is totally illegal, for two reasons, one more theoretical, one practical:

1. It would be deemed a restriction on the fundamental human right of liberty (Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution)

2. Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws that require owners to facilitate free exit and entry at all times for the guests.

So, if this happens to anyone on the Camino, you should not accept it. I know that pilgrims don't have time to file a law suit, but you can let the owner know you know the law and insist on being able to get in and out, with a key or whatever it takes. This is a huge safety issue, I think, in addition to being able to come and go as you please.

Buen camino, Laurie

ARTICLE 17 in the Spanish constitution, I will keep that in mind, I'm claustrophobic. I can see them kinking me out of every place
Just imagine a fire!, I'm panicking now!

 

[Chacharm]

I never had it happen but I would have kicked up a mighty fuss if it had. It is a fire hazard, number one. The very idea of locking adult strangers in together is insane - what if someone was violent? What if someone had a heart attack? How could EMTs get in to them?
Also - no one gets my passport. That is buggy.

 

[wayfarer]

We were locked in in a new Hostal in Logoso on the way to Finisterre in 2012 but did not realise it until we decided to leave the next morning. This is an extract from my notes for that day.

"27/05/12. Day 38. Vilaserio - Logoso . 24Km

It was really wet today, as wet as any day we spent on the Camino and then some. We were quickly soaked inside and out but we had no choice but to keep going.
After seeing an advertisement for a new hostal posted along the trail I rang ahead and booked a double room for us, this was about 3 kms further on from Olveiroa where we had planned to stay.
All was well when we arrived, the girl asked us if we minded sharing a bathroom with the next room, no problem. Then everything went pear shaped, four German pilgrims arrived and after a conversation with the girl, they spoke very good Spanish, she told us someone had double booked and our room was going to the Germans.
There was then a major argument between the girl, her father and his wife, the upshot being they prepared a room for us in the unfinished section of the hostal, there was still sawdust on the floors and no shower curtains but at this stage we didn't care. They still charged full price though.
Dinner was OK but the service was slow and sullen, the girl told us that this was a new venture for the family but she and her mother were left to do all the work while the father talked to the guests who could speak Spanish and the son just drank with his friends in the bar. I wonder how long that venture will last. We were told breakfast would be at 07.00 sharp.
We were up and dressed in our damp clothes by 07.00. We headed down for breakfast only to find the place in darkness and the kitchen locked, after waiting about fifteen minutes or so we decided to leave and have breakfast on the road. This plan came adrift when we found the front door also locked, the family obviously lived elsewhere. This is a completely crazy thing to do if there was a fire or any other emergency during the night. The son arrived at about 07.30 to open up and was not a bit put out when we let him know that we were not happy about being locked in as well as him being late for breakfast.
They really have a lot to learn about running a business.
We walked another 3kms to Hospital and had a great breakfast there with a lovely woman who ran the only café we could find. She told us that this was the last place to eat or drink for the next 15 kms so we packed the grub in."

 

[yolanda Mejia]

I never had it happen but I would have kicked up a mighty fuss if it had. It is a fire hazard, number one. The very idea of locking adult strangers in together is insane - what if someone was violent? What if someone had a heart attack? How could EMTs get in to them?
Also - no one gets my passport. That is buggy.

I agree with you, there are some occurrences, that makes me wonder what the heck am I doing planning that trip!!! so it did n0t happens to you? CharCharm. Please send me the name of the Albergues you used. I CAN"T BE LOCK UP!

 

[naplesdon]

And many of those regulations exempt albergues. New albergues are built to new codes, but the old ones have been grandfathered exemptions to health and safety regulations. Remember, the refugio concept began with bed space on the floor and an outhouse. That floor space could block a fire exit, and no one blinked. I cannot imagine that Granon conforms to current regulations, but I would hate to see it closed down.

I never had it happen but I would have kicked up a mighty fuss if it had. It is a fire hazard, number one. The very idea of locking adult strangers in together is insane - what if someone was violent? What if someone had a heart attack? How could EMTs get in to them?
Also - no one gets my passport. That is buggy.

At least Granon has two ways out if you know where the secret room is and besides the windows are only about 4 meters from the courtyard. Samos is not like that!
The passport taking issue has been an issue for ages. You hand it over when you check in and several hours later you start wondering where the hell is that person I gave it to.

 

[yolanda Mejia]

We were locked in in a new Hostal in Logoso on the way to Finisterre in 2012 but did not realise it until we decided to leave the next morning. This is an extract from my notes for that day.

"27/05/12. Day 38. Vilaserio - Logoso . 24Km

It was really wet today, as wet as any day we spent on the Camino and then some. We were quickly soaked inside and out but we had no choice but to keep going.
After seeing an advertisement for a new hostal posted along the trail I rang ahead and booked a double room for us, this was about 3 kms further on from Olveiroa where we had planned to stay.
All was well when we arrived, the girl asked us if we minded sharing a bathroom with the next room, no problem. Then everything went pear shaped, four German pilgrims arrived and after a conversation with the girl, they spoke very good Spanish, she told us someone had double booked and our room was going to the Germans.
There was then a major argument between the girl, her father and his wife, the upshot being they prepared a room for us in the unfinished section of the hostal, there was still sawdust on the floors and no shower curtains but at this stage we didn't care. They still charged full price though.
Dinner was OK but the service was slow and sullen, the girl told us that this was a new venture for the family but she and her mother were left to do all the work while the father talked to the guests who could speak Spanish and the son just drank with his friends in the bar. I wonder how long that venture will last. We were told breakfast would be at 07.00 sharp.
We were up and dressed in our damp clothes by 07.00. We headed down for breakfast only to find the place in darkness and the kitchen locked, after waiting about fifteen minutes or so we decided to leave and have breakfast on the road. This plan came adrift when we found the front door also locked, the family obviously lived elsewhere. This is a completely crazy thing to do if there was a fire or any other emergency during the night. The son arrived at about 07.30 to open up and was not a bit put out when we let him know that we were not happy about being locked in as well as him being late for breakfast.
They really have a lot to learn about running a business.
We walked another 3kms to Hospital and had a great breakfast there with a lovely woman who ran the only café we could find. She told us that this was the last place to eat or drink for the next 15 kms so we packed the grub in."

Wow!

 

[yolanda Mejia]

At least Granon has two ways out if you know where the secret room is and besides the windows are only about 4 meters from the courtyard. Samos is not like that!
The passport taking issue has been an issue for ages. You hand it over when you check in and several hours later you start wondering where the hell is that person I gave it to.

I already wrote the name of that albergue, at list I could get out through the window!

 

[Mark Lee]

ARTICLE 17 in the Spanish constitution, I will keep that in mind, I'm claustrophobic. I can see them kinking me out of every place
Just imagine a fire!, I'm panicking now!

calma, calma.....
I never stayed in any albergue that locked me in for the night. Ones that locked from the inside and you couldn't get back in, but none that locked me in like an inmate in a prison and believe me if one did and I wanted to leave something's gonna give.
There are plenty of good albergues on the Camino. Like anything, and like any consumer, choose wisely. Remember the old saying of "let the buyer beware".
As far as passports go, yeah some places ask to see them and record the information in the guest logbook. Not all of them did that, and when one did, I patiently sat there until they finished up and handed me back the passport. I never leave my passport with anybody and never out of my sight.
It's all good. Nothing to fear on the Camino. Just remember FDR's old sayin about it.....

 

[yolanda Mejia]

calma, calma.....
I never stayed in any albergue that locked me in for the night. Ones that locked from the inside and you couldn't get back in, but none that locked me in like an inmate in a prison and believe me if one did and I wanted to leave something's gonna give.
There are plenty of good albergues on the Camino. Like anything, and like any consumer, choose wisely. Remember the old saying of "let the buyer beware".
As far as passports go, yeah some places ask to see them and record the information in the guest logbook. Not all of them did that, and when one did, I patiently sat there until they finished up and handed me back the passport. I never leave my passport with anybody and never out of my sight.
It's all good. Nothing to fear on the Camino. Just remember FDR's old sayin about it.....

Mark please,please send me the name of the latest albergues that you used.

 

[Mark Lee]

Mark please,please send me the name of the latest albergues that you used.

Two Caminos and stayed in different towns in both. That's a lot of albergues! ha ha
Do you know which towns for sure you definitely want to stay in? I can recommend some albergues that were memorable to me as being good and a good experience. Of course don't lock yourself in any plan as part of the beauty of walking the Camino is having no locked in plan.

 

[Mark Lee]

Mark please,please send me the name of the latest albergues that you used.

I'll send you a PM with a list of albergues that I thought were really nice, and scored points for cleanliness, etc.

 

[yolanda Mejia]

Two Caminos and stayed in different towns in both. That's a lot of albergues! ha ha
Do you know which towns for sure you definitely want to stay in? I can recommend some albergues that were memorable to me as being good and a good experience. Of course don't lock yourself in any plan as part of the beauty of walking the Camino is having no locked in plan.

I rather be locked in a plan path, than in a place. or albergue. all I know is that I'm doing the French path.

 

[yolanda Mejia]

I'll send you a PM with a list of albergues that I thought were really nice, and scored points for cleanliness, etc.

Where do I look for the personal message?

 

[Mark Lee]

Where do I look for the personal message?

on your profile page.....you will see it when I send it

 

[frasert]

I'm the same absolutely claustrophobic. Had two panic attacks at Zubri and Los Arcos. Not locked in but the places were absolute fire traps . Ended up sleeping in common areas just to be close to exits.

 

[yolanda Mejia]

I'm the same absolutely claustrophobic. Had two panic attacks at Zubri and Los Arcos. Not locked in but the places were absolute fire traps . Ended up sleeping in common areas just to be close to exits.

Those panic attacks are not a good thing, no,no I need to surrender to our Lord.

 

[Rajy62]

1. It would be deemed a restriction on the fundamental human right of liberty (Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution)

2. Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws that require owners to facilitate free exit and entry at all times for the guests.

Laurie

I never experienced "locked in". To be able to do that one must have all electronic locking mechanism without any possibility to unlock manually from inside.
I did experience "Locked out" at one alberque on the norte. There were signs everywhere that doors will be locked by 11 PM. And some pilgrims attempted to come back in, very drunk, after the curphew, 3 am. They were locked out for hours. They kept ringing the door bell and waking everyone up. They were Spanish speaking and the pilgrims inside didn't recognize them to let them in. Finally, police were called in to sort out the situation.

Laurie, what does the Spanish constitution say about locking someone out.

 

[Chacharm]

calma, calma.....
I never stayed in any albergue that locked me in for the night. Ones that locked from the inside and you couldn't get back in, but none that locked me in like an inmate in a prison and believe me if one did and I wanted to leave something's gonna give.
There are plenty of good albergues on the Camino. Like anything, and like any consumer, choose wisely. Remember the old saying of "let the buyer beware".
As far as passports go, yeah some places ask to see them and record the information in the guest logbook. Not all of them did that, and when one did, I patiently sat there until they finished up and handed me back the passport. I never leave my passport with anybody and never out of my sight.
It's all good. Nothing to fear on the Camino. Just remember FDR's old sayin about it.....

Well said.

 

[NoQ]

There are a few albergues that don't open the doors till a given time and leaving before is not possible, though I'm sure they have exits in the event of fire. The main one in Burgos and the big one in Ponferrada spring to mind (though there's a huge outdoor patio area with the latter so no worries about fire, of course).

 

[yolanda Mejia]

I never experienced "locked in". To be able to do that one must have all electronic locking mechanism without any possibility to unlock manually from inside.
I did experience "Locked out" at one alberque on the norte. There were signs everywhere that doors will be locked by 11 PM. And some pilgrims attempted to come back in, very drunk, after the curphew, 3 am. They were locked out for hours. They kept ringing the door bell and waking everyone up. They were Spanish speaking and the pilgrims inside didn't recognize them to let them in. Finally, police were called in to sort out the situation.

Laurie, what does the Spanish constitution say about locking someone out.

Thank you for the reassurance!

 

[jumpingin2014]

This is something I saw happen to a group of other pilgrims. I can't remember the name of the town and they were quite angry when we ran into them along the Way afterwards where they told us about it. I suspect "locking in" may be more common then we realize as there was always someone there when we left in the morning so we never really encountered a circumstance where there was not a staff person there. During the night it could very well have been locked. Having said that I am quite confident I can get out of a building if it is on fire or for an emergency. I just can't guarantee what the "new exit" is going to look like and I could care a less.

 

[peregrina2000]

I never experienced "locked in". To be able to do that one must have all electronic locking mechanism without any possibility to unlock manually from inside.

I have been locked in a number of times, I wouldn't say it's common but it is not totally unheard of. And these were places with no way out other than the locked door. There were no fire exits.

Laurie, what does the Spanish constitution say about locking someone out.

Here is Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution.

Toda persona tiene derecho a la libertad y a la seguridad. Nadie puede ser privado de su libertad, sino con la observancia de lo establecido en este artículo y en los casos y en la forma previstos en la ley.

My translation: Everyone has a right to liberty and security. No one can be deprived of liberty without adherence to the provisions of this article and in the cases and form as described in laws. (The Constitution then proceeds to detail the ways in which people can be locked up and deprived of liberty -- with probable cause for a crime, etc.)

So, I think the argument is that being locked in a hotel or an albergue is what in the US we'd call "false imprisonment." A hostal owner can't make a prisoner of you, yet that is what he/she does when you are locked in and can't get out.

buen camino, Laurie

 

[peregrina2000]

And many of those regulations exempt albergues. New albergues are built to new codes, but the old ones have been grandfathered exemptions to health and safety regulations. Remember, the refugio concept began with bed space on the floor and an outhouse. That floor space could block a fire exit, and no one blinked. I cannot imagine that Granon conforms to current regulations, but I would hate to see it closed down.

Falcon, it's one thing to say that old albergues and refugios don't have to live up to modern codes, but are you saying that they are allowed to have dangerous conditions like locking people inside the building?

 

[Deleted member 3000]

A locked door is just one among many unsafe actions! Several times I have left albergues early when it was clear the way was barred. It just took some creativity and a flashlight to escape. One of the reasons I am a fan of the private albergues is that they have been built recently to modern building codes -- locked doors that still open to the outside among them. When there is an old fashioned key lock on the door, it is either locked or unlocked. Both have risks at night. In an emergency it can be unlocked for egress. This thread was spawned from another one that told a tale of a hostal, one of the newest on the Camino. I would have to see what the locking arrangement is. I cannot imagine that it was not built to current codes, and a door that won't open in an emergency would not be to code.

 

[naplesdon]

calma, calma.....
I never stayed in any albergue that locked me in for the night. Ones that locked from the inside and you couldn't get back in, but none that locked me in like an inmate in a prison and believe me if one did and I wanted to leave something's gonna give.
There are plenty of good albergues on the Camino. Like anything, and like any consumer, choose wisely. Remember the old saying of "let the buyer beware".
As far as passports go, yeah some places ask to see them and record the information in the guest logbook. Not all of them did that, and when one did, I patiently sat there until they finished up and handed me back the passport. I never leave my passport with anybody and never out of my sight.
It's all good. Nothing to fear on the Camino. Just remember FDR's old sayin about it.....

Mark, I almost always agree with you but in the case of being locked in, it does happen. There are a few places where the hospitaleros are enforcing a 6am curfew for departures and sleep in other parts of the dormitory and lock the doors at 11pm and then you never see then again until 6am. In the case of Granon, I suspect the major risk someone was voicing is the very tiny circular stairway that everyone is forced to use as the only exit.
After the many years I have traveled the passport protocol has changed for the better but there are times and countries where I have been asked to leave my passport and come back later. The early check-in process can be very busy and after all you may have a greater need for a shower or claim your lower bunk than standing there stuffing up the line, no worries! Huh, then you go back to the collect your passport and the person you gave it to 30 minutes ago is no longer there. I agree with your suggestion about never letting it get out of your sight but I am also a very trusting person as you know.
Did you mean FDR or Winston Churchill about fear....?

 

[Rebekah Scott]

They do this to keep the people inside from letting their friends in later on, to stay for free.
They're not allowed to do it, but they do it anyway.
When I was hospi at such a place, I left the key in the door lock before I went to bed, so people could get out.

 

[Mark Lee]

Mark, I almost always agree with you but in the case of being locked in, it does happen. There are a few places where the hospitaleros are enforcing a 6am curfew for departures and sleep in other parts of the dormitory and lock the doors at 11pm and then you never see then again until 6am. In the case of Granon, I suspect the major risk someone was voicing is the very tiny circular stairway that everyone is forced to use as the only exit.
After the many years I have traveled the passport protocol has changed for the better but there are times and countries where I have been asked to leave my passport and come back later. The early check-in process can be very busy and after all you may have a greater need for a shower or claim your lower bunk than standing there stuffing up the line, no worries! Huh, then you go back to the collect your passport and the person you gave it to 30 minutes ago is no longer there. I agree with your suggestion about never letting it get out of your sight but I am also a very trusting person as you know.
Did you mean FDR or Winston Churchill about fear....?

Oh yeah, thinking about it now I'm sure I probably stayed in at least one albergue that locked me in for the night and just didn't know it as by the time I was ready to hit the bricks a hospitalero had arrived. Not a big deal I suppose if there are plenty of doors to kick down or windows to bust out if there was an emergency during the night.
What was Churchill's (another one of my favorite figures from history) quote about fear?

 

[ebrandt]

On another thread about a new Hostal in Torres del Rio, the person who stayed there described how they were locked into the place and had to wait to be let out in the morning by the owners. Others then added similar experiences.

I have been in this situation on various occasions -- being totally locked inside, no way out, till the owner shows up.

I wrote to a friend of mine in Madrid who is a law professor, and he responded immediately -- this is totally illegal, for two reasons, one more theoretical, one practical:

1. It would be deemed a restriction on the fundamental human right of liberty (Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution)

2. Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws that require owners to facilitate free exit and entry at all times for the guests.

So, if this happens to anyone on the Camino, you should not accept it. I know that pilgrims don't have time to file a law suit, but you can let the owner know you know the law and insist on being able to get in and out, with a key or whatever it takes. This is a huge safety issue, I think, in addition to being able to come and go as you please.

Buen camino, Laurie

I am so glad you posted this. I think we were locked in several times. At least once in Burgos at the municipal albergue for sure. It always has impressed me as a fire hazard to say the least! I get the reasoning -- overanxious pilgrims getting up and disrupting the peace in the albergue. But the solution seems unsafe! Thanks. Liz

 

[naplesdon]

Oh yeah, thinking about it now I'm sure I probably stayed in at least one albergue that locked me in for the night and just didn't know it as by the time I was ready to hit the bricks a hospitalero had arrived. Not a big deal I suppose if there are plenty of doors to kick down or windows to bust out if there was an emergency during the night.
What was Churchill's (another one of my favorite figures from history) quote about fear?

You are absolutely correct the quote "All we have to fear is fear itself" was FDR's but my favorite by Churchill is: "Men stumble over the truth from time to time but most pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing happened."

 

[Felipe]

Locking doors, good or bad, is is a more or less standard regulation. You can see in Consumer Eroski, in the description of most albergues (even private ones), the final line "possibility of leaving when it is closed: no"
In Spain, many hostals, even hotels, also lock doors late in the night, but you can ring an employee.
I guess this started as a safety concern -actually not a bad thing in big cities. The idea that everybody can enter by night to the albergue and roam freely by the dorms would give me some uneasiness.
To me, the nightly curfew makes perfect sense. If I would like to be late with my friends, I'd make a reservation in a hotel. But that's me...
I suppose the central point is that somebody be available to open the doors, if the need comes. In well managed albergues, you can see that the hospitalero's dorm is close to the entrance.
If I were staying in a friend's home, I would consider reasonable to find the street door locked. Hospitaleros are not exactly my friends, but public albergues are'nt either commercial establishments.

 

[Mark Lee]

You are absolutely correct the quote "All we have to fear is fear itself" was FDR's but my favorite by Churchill is: "Men stumble over the truth from time to time but most pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing happened."

that's a good one from the British Bulldog.....

 

[SRM]

On another thread about a new Hostal in Torres del Rio, the person who stayed there described how they were locked into the place and had to wait to be let out in the morning by the owners. Others then added similar experiences.

I have been in this situation on various occasions -- being totally locked inside, no way out, till the owner shows up.

I wrote to a friend of mine in Madrid who is a law professor, and he responded immediately -- this is totally illegal, for two reasons, one more theoretical, one practical:

1. It would be deemed a restriction on the fundamental human right of liberty (Article 17 of the Spanish Constitution)

2. Each Comunidad Autonoma (regional governments like the Xunta, the Junta de Castilla y Leon, etc) has tourism laws that require owners to facilitate free exit and entry at all times for the guests.

So, if this happens to anyone on the Camino, you should not accept it. I know that pilgrims don't have time to file a law suit, but you can let the owner know you know the law and insist on being able to get in and out, with a key or whatever it takes. This is a huge safety issue, I think, in addition to being able to come and go as you please.

Buen camino, Laurie

It is a life safety issue ! What do you do in a fire situation.

 

[naplesdon]

It is a life safety issue ! What do you do in a fire situation.

I think the best advice was given earlier in this thread. Check out the escape routes and if you are uncomfortable say something to the hospitalero and if you are still uncomfortable decide to stay or leave. The 5 to 8 euros you might forfeit are worth the peace of mind you will gain. As an architect and one who was responsible for the safety and security of others in challenging situations, it is best to let your internal radar do your thinking for you. I have many friend who have walked the escape route to make sure there is an a way out. It's good plan.

 

[Rajy62]

I think the best advice was given earlier in this thread. Check out the escape routes and if you are uncomfortable say something to the hospitalero and if you are still uncomfortable decide to stay or leave. The 5 to 8 euros you might forfeit are worth the peace of mind you will gain. As an architect and one who was responsible for the safety and security of others in challenging situations, it is best to let your internal radar do your thinking for you. I have many friend who have walked the escape route to make sure there is an a way out. It's good plan.

Shouldn't all these alberques/hostels locking people in advice us. They seems to give all other rules...I don't ever recall anyone telling us you will be locked in and can't leave before such an such time. What i do remember is they would wake us up and kick us out by 8 AM...

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I was locked in in 2008 in the muni in Los Arcos. Not much better than the little hostel in Thailand that had padlocks on the outside of guestroom's doors. Oh, the radar went up that night, and we ended up going to another place the following morning.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

it's all part of the camino scene. Don't let your fears overcome you.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I was locked in in 2008 in the muni in Los Arcos.

That is a long time ago. I do not even remember the doors locking at the municipal in Los Arcos!

 

[peregrina2000]

it's all part of the camino scene. Don't let your fears overcome you.

Reb, I'll bet this is the first time I've ever disagreed with something you posted. In my opinion the dangers of being locked inside a building overnight are too great to chalk it up to it being part of the camino scene. I agree that it's important to keep our fears well cabined as we confront all the unknowns of the camino. The handful of times I've been locked in, nothing has happened, and I never knew about it until later. But when I learned that I had spent a night with no way out, I was kind of creeped out. I admit I never check up on this feature when I arrive at my night's lodging, and maybe I've fallen into complacency on the hope that the owners have followed Spanish law. But I think there's nothing wrong with insisting on compliance if you find yourself in a situation where you are not going to have any exit strategy in case of emergency. Buen camino, Laurie

 

[Deleted member 3000]

How many places really have no egress in an emergency? Even the chain across the door at En El Camino could be removed. You can get out of San Javier in Astorga with the key, but you cannot get back in. Ruitelan tells you to stay in bed until they wake you with music, but it is possible to get out the doors. Where and how has someone actually been locked in including access to courtyards and the like?

 

[ebrandt]

Long story warning! In the municipal Albergue in Burgos it was not readily possible to get out. We stayed there with a big group of overly anxious German pilgrims. They got up at 5:00 am and, very noisily, prepared to leave. We gave up on sleep and also got up went to the common room and made a small breakfast. While we were eating the Germans tried to leave. They were pretty aggressive trying to get out but could not leave. I was chagrined. I knew the doors of some albergues were locked, but I assumed, like falcon, that there were ways out. Now this was not an emergency. Maybe if it had been a Hospitalero would have appeared. Possibly several people together could have battered down the door or broken and cleared a window. But in an emergency, these don't seem like great options.

I'm like Laurie, I didn't find out whether doors were locked. But it strikes me as an unsafe situation.

Liz

 

[Chacharm]

I agree with you, there are some occurrences, that makes me wonder what the heck am I doing planning that trip!!! so it did n0t happens to you? CharCharm. Please send me the name of the Albergues you used. I CAN"T BE LOCK UP!

Unfortunately I had a little journal on my phone and that phone was stolen a week after I got home. I have no idea which albuergues I stayed in. But really you shouldn't worry about this!

 

[Chacharm]

Locking doors, good or bad, is is a more or less standard regulation. You can see in Consumer Eroski, in the description of most albergues (even private ones), the final line "possibility of leaving when it is closed: no"
In Spain, many hostals, even hotels, also lock doors late in the night, but you can ring an employee.
I guess this started as a safety concern -actually not a bad thing in big cities. The idea that everybody can enter by night to the albergue and roam freely by the dorms would give me some uneasiness.
To me, the nightly curfew makes perfect sense. If I would like to be late with my friends, I'd make a reservation in a hotel. But that's me...
I suppose the central point is that somebody be available to open the doors, if the need comes. In well managed albergues, you can see that the hospitalero's dorm is close to the entrance.
If I were staying in a friend's home, I would consider reasonable to find the street door locked. Hospitaleros are not exactly my friends, but public albergues are'nt either commercial establishments.

Yes - locking others OUT is reasonable. Locking people IN is another matter entirely. In case of fire or illness (what if someone had a heart attack? Got up in the middle of the night for the bathroom and fell and hit their head?) it is a serious liability.

 

[Chacharm]

Reb, I'll bet this is the first time I've ever disagreed with something you posted. In my opinion the dangers of being locked inside a building overnight are too great to chalk it up to it being part of the camino scene. I agree that it's important to keep our fears well cabined as we confront all the unknowns of the camino. The handful of times I've been locked in, nothing has happened, and I never knew about it until later. But when I learned that I had spent a night with no way out, I was kind of creeped out. I admit I never check up on this feature when I arrive at my night's lodging, and maybe I've fallen into complacency on the hope that the owners have followed Spanish law. But I think there's nothing wrong with insisting on compliance if you find yourself in a situation where you are not going to have any exit strategy in case of emergency. Buen camino, Laurie

I think I will simply be looking at the doors as I enter to see if there is a working lock from the inside.

 

[grayland]

Another reason to opt for pensions and hotels.

I do remember that the doors to the albergues in Orense were locked and chained with a padlock. Some Spanish pilgrims (priests) were trying to leave at 5:30 and could not get out. I was also up and reading in the common room when they were trying to get out. We all looked for about 1/2 hour for some way out. The hospi came at a few minutes after 6am to open door. He was not staying in the albergues and had to unlock the door open it as bit to access the lock on the chain and open that to get the door open. I am not even sure how he locked the chain when he left. Seemed a bit of a crazy system...even if it were somehow safe.

The scary thing was that there were no windows on the ground floor and we did have some concerns after realizing that it would be a real problem in a serious emergency.

 

[jsalt]

How many places really have no egress in an emergency? Even the chain across the door at En El Camino could be removed. You can get out of San Javier in Astorga with the key, but you cannot get back in. Ruitelan tells you to stay in bed until they wake you with music, but it is possible to get out the doors. Where and how has someone actually been locked in including access to courtyards and the like?

I could not get out of Casa San Nicolas in Santiago in 2012 until the senora came along and opened the front door with her key.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I could not get out of Casa San Nicolas in Santiago in 2012 until the senora came along and opened the front door with her key.

That is a pretty upscale place! http://www.casa-sannicolas.com/casa/casa.html

The photos show a lot of exits to a courtyard. Were they blocked for emergency use?

 

[jsalt]

That is a pretty upscale place! http://www.casa-sannicolas.com/casa/casa.html

The photos show a lot of exits to a courtyard. Were they blocked for emergency use?

The bedrooms are on the upper floor. I looked around for a fire exit, but couldn't find one. The main stairs leads down to the front door, which opens onto the street. The ground floor rooms all looked private, and was where the owner/manageress lived, so obviously I didn't go into them to see if there was a way out that way. My main concern at the time was getting out of the FRONT door (not into the courtyard), so I could get the first bus at 6am to the airport to catch my flight.

Entitled: User-unfriendly
http://www.tripadvisor.co.za/Hotel_Review-g187508-d1465368-Reviews-San_Nicolas-Santiago_de_Compostela_A_Coruna_Province_Galicia.html

 

[Rajy62]

The bedrooms are on the upper floor. I looked around for a fire exit, but couldn't find one. The main stairs leads down to the front door, which opens onto the street. The ground floor rooms all looked private, and was where the owner/manageress lived, so obviously I didn't go into them to see if there was a way out that way. My main concern at the time was getting out of the FRONT door (not into the courtyard), so I could get the first bus at 6am to the airport to catch my flight.

Entitled: User-unfriendly
http://www.tripadvisor.co.za/Hotel_Review-g187508-d1465368-Reviews-San_Nicolas-Santiago_de_Compostela_A_Coruna_Province_Galicia.html

Your situation seems like a poorly administered/managed place. They seems to have a system but not managed properly. What would concern me is the scenario where they lock the place and leave and there is no one to allow anyone in/out during the night. And there are no other emergency exits...

 

[peregrina2000]

Hi, falcon,

I hope there is no confusion here -- I am not saying this is a regular or frequent occurrence. In my experience it is a rare situation, but it happens. My very first was in the big stone granary albergue in Roncesvalles, but that is no longer an albergue. Most recently, in the hostal in Higueruela on the Levante. On the Vdlp in the hostal in San Pedro de Rozados, but after speaking with the owner that morning, she agreed to leave a key out in the future.

Other incidents have been reported
in Tres Cantos on the Madrid: https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/cdm-albergues-april-2014.26900/

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/no-fire-laws-in-madrid.19414/

And in my opinion, the means to get out should be equally available to all, not in the possession of someone who would have to be waked up in an emergency. I have a cousin who is a firefighter in Brooklyn and I have just heard about too many tragedies to think this is something to sluff off. But I hope I am not putting people into a panic, this not a general problem at all. Buen camino, Laurie

 

[yolanda Mejia]

Unfortunately I had a little journal on my phone and that phone was stolen a week after I got home. I have no idea which albuergues I stayed in. But really you shouldn't worry about this!

Thanks!

 

[dougfitz]

I am a little appalled with myself for not checking more regularly what the emergency arrangements were in albergues where I stayed. I know that there were places where there was only the one exit from many parts of the building rather than the two that would be normal in most hotels etc. As for locked doors, most that I saw were locked from the outside, and could be opened from the inside, but it wasn't something that I checked consistently.

I have exited through a window where the front door was locked, and the emergency exits appeared to have activation sensors fitted, just to avoid the prospect that the warning system would be activated by opening them and waking everyone up. It wasn't particularly early, around 7.00 am, but still too early for the off-site hospitalero to have arrived and opened up.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Oh dear, just imagine the number of albergues to stay in if you actually asked about egress. This is a serious issue, and frankly I would like to know what the rationale behind locking us in is: we've already paid. Is it to keep pilgrims in bed sleeping until a reasonable hour? If that's the case, say so, publically, so people can make their own decisions, idealy ahead of getting to said albergue. Eroski posts all sorts of characteristics, here's one to add to the roster.

 

[Kanga]

Thinking my tent erected in the Albergue garden is a good idea....

 

[bystander]

The father of a girlfriend was a Judge and therefore travelled the length and breadth of England to preside on court cases staying overnight mainly in hotels.
Regardless of the requirements of fire escape routes etc to be, by law, provided he always travelled with a rope ladder in his suitcase.

Not, of course, that I am suggesting that one these should be on everyone's Camino packing list.................!

 

[Kanga]

@bystander on the basis that everything we carry should have multiple uses, my rope ladder would be
(1) an escape route from locked albergues,
(2) a clothesline
(3) for self-flagellation (either religious or the other kind)
(4) to scale the castle at Pontferada
(5) for restraining rampaging dogs and bulls
(6) for securing pack at airports and bus stations.

 

[Aliotmail.co]

We find it is better to stay in Parish hostels and they usually have the volunteers staying there. The only place I have stayed with the locking in and which was an awful place where I joked about staying in a gulag and I would rather sleep on the street as they were obviously only in it for the money was the municipal albergue in Najera, but I haven't been any further than Leon. The Parish hostel about one and a half miles downtown in Burgos was one of the best we have ever stayed in and wouldn't have even found if the big municipal one hadn't been full when we arrived; we had a so much better and quieter stay than in the municipal one the previous year even though the area looked more dodgy. You have to go with it to some extent as it has been going for hundreds of years and the only tragedy I have heard of was the train crash in Compostella in our first year 2012........

 

[annelise]

I was totally paranoid in an albergue in Astorga (won't name its name though). Ancient building. From the second floor I could look down to the first floor through the slatted boards. And below the first floor was an open kitchen just close to the wooden staircase going up. A true fire trap. - Well knowing that if a fire started (had made a kind or recco), I knew that I could go onto the roof and take a kind of 10 m drop into the courtyard - not a nice option.

annelise

 

[frasert]

it's all part of the camino scene. Don't let your fears overcome you.

Well bugger that it's wrong.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

I won't even bother telling you how locked-in pilgrims were at the Madres Benedictinas in Sahagun. Not just a key... a veritable barricade!

I asked about fire safety, and was told "this is a convent. We've locked the doors here for 500 years, and the place hasn't burned down yet. If there's a fire, people can escape into the cloister garden."
I wondered out loud what kind of fear would put so much "security" in place: were they afraid of someone getting in, or someone escaping?

I don't like being locked in either. But I know such noises made by "people like us" are often greeted with the arched Iberian eyebrow and murmurings of "neurotic foreigners."

 

[Deleted member 3000]

But I know such noises made by "people like us" are often greeted with the arched Iberian eyebrow and murmurings of "neurotic foreigners."

... until the first disaster where pilgrims die in a fire because their exit was blocked by mattresses on the floor or a barricaded door! The conservative mindset that "the past has always worked" will once again be exposed!

 

[naplesdon]

I was totally paranoid in an albergue in Astorga (won't name its name though). Ancient building. From the second floor I could look down to the first floor through the slatted boards. And below the first floor was an open kitchen just close to the wooden staircase going up. A true fire trap. - Well knowing that if a fire started (had made a kind or recco), I knew that I could go onto the roof and take a kind of 10 m drop into the courtyard - not a nice option.

annelise

I stayed there also and was rightfully concerned and there is another floor above the second floor. The spaces between the floor board would only accelerate the speed of a fire and the kitchen on the first floor is available for anyone to cook whether they know how to use it or not.

 

[Dutch]

Stayed at the big municipal in Burgos once. They also won't let you go before (if i remember correctly) 06:30am. The door is just locked and no way out. They would not open it a minute sooner, no matter how many pilgrims asked, while waiting to leave.

Very very weird.

 

[Icacos]

There were several of us congregating in the dimly lit hallway and facing a locked door trying to leave an albergue one morning in Acebo. Finally, in the near darkness someone managed to locate a door giving us access to the outside. I shuddered to think of the outcome if there had been an emergency in the middle of the night and no one knew where that exit door was.

 

[yolanda Mejia]

I am a little appalled with myself for not checking more regularly what the emergency arrangements were in albergues where I stayed. I know that there were places where there was only the one exit from many parts of the building rather than the two that would be normal in most hotels etc. As for locked doors, most that I saw were locked from the outside, and could be opened from the inside, but it wasn't something that I checked consistently.

I have exited through a window where the front door was locked, and the emergency exits appeared to have activation sensors fitted, just to avoid the prospect that the warning system would be activated by opening them and waking everyone up. It wasn't particularly early, around 7.00 am, but still too early for the off-site hospitalero to have arrived and opened up.

I actually researched when you click into albergues " more info " and they tell me whether they lock or no, and if there is a way to get out after time of closing. I'm staying in the albergues that I can get out after time of closing.