sue-sheila
Member
- Time of past OR future Camino
- Camino Frances - August 16 - September 19 2017
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Let's not suggest such polarization!I am aware that these are two completely opposing schools
Hi @sue-sheila,Hello everyone - I initially was contemplating going on a pre-mapped/routed CF walk with bag transfers and hotel bookings. However, after posting a question to receive tips and guidance there was an unanimous response by everyone (kind enough to take the time to offer me advice) to take the Camino as it comes and to NOT plan everything to the last detail simply because there are too many variables to contend with.
The fact also remains that the only two people that I have actually spoken with at length are 2 women who both walked the CF last year in May (at different times) and both of them highly recommended having an agency plan the trip and that it worked out well for them.
I know that there *are* people who opt for the pre-mapped trip but was wondering if after having used a tour company once, whether they would do the same or whether they would "go with the flow" and open themselves up to the adventure of the unknown and unpredictable if they got the chance to walk again.
Please note that I am aware that these are two completely opposing schools so I don't want to start a debate so much as hear from the agency-guided people about their experience/thoughts/regrets/resolutions.
Thank you in advance.
I would argue that there is not an "instinctive" bias. Rather it is a bias based on the fact that most people who post on this forum have done the Camino without a tour company, and have found it very satisfactory. I would agree that there is a general majority opinion that a tour company is not necessary in most cases and forum members are trying to explain why.there is "an instinctive bias against tour companies".
Yes, I forgot to mention that, not having to worry about getting to town before things fill up is a definite plus.Interestingly, as I observed the non-reservation albergue pilgrims as I walked, I realized that I had a much less routinized Camino than they did: no need to finish the day's walk by early afternoon or risk not getting a bed in a town where I wanted to be, no need to rush to wash my clothes in time to dry them, no need to finish dinner before curfew (and not be able to relax and have another glass of Rioja or cup of te manzanillo), no need to get up early (I'm not a morning person) to start the day's schedule again.
But you can book just a day or two ahead so as not to be rushed each day.Yes, I forgot to mention that, not having to worry about getting to town before things fill up is a definite plus.
From all that I've read so far it seems to be that the best option is to plan ahead and pre-book - but do it myself and do it based on my comfort-zone, general state of feet and tolerance and fatigue and climate and back-packing stamina etc. And yes - if one doesn't have the time for research then definitely a tour company would take away all the hassle and free up time for (maybe training or researching equipment/gear etc.)
Robo - what a marvelously comprehensive post - thank you for taking the time to write this - much appreciated. I am definitely coming to the conclusion that booking ahead 1-2 days at a time is the way to combine the best of both worlds.
That's my plan when I return to the Camino.Robo - what a marvelously comprehensive post - thank you for taking the time to write this - much appreciated. I am definitely coming to the conclusion that booking ahead 1-2 days at a time is the way to combine the best of both worlds.
Robo - what a marvelously comprehensive post - thank you for taking the time to write this - much appreciated. I am definitely coming to the conclusion that booking ahead 1-2 days at a time is the way to combine the best of both worlds.
Try and let yourself get out of your comfort zone now and then and be surprised as to where it takes you.
Please let me add another gentle suggestion to the one above. To break yourself in slowly pick an albergue with a high room to bed ratio. You may get to like 90 beds to a roomAnd may I just gently suggest that you do try an albergue for a night or two? They are NOT horrendous experiences, despite how it sounds written down!!! No, they are UNIQUE experiences, well worth trying just once or twice, so that you can at least dismiss them with knowledge and have a few good tales to tell afterwards!
I actually liked the anonymity that you get when you are in a dorm with twenty+ other people rather than just a few, and preferred the large dorms. Especially when the dorm didn't fill up, and people could spread out more.Please let me add another gentle suggestion to the one above. To break yourself in slowly pick an albergue with a high room to bed ratio. You may get to like 90 beds to a roombut at first you might want to try 6 to a room.
I actually liked the anonymity that you get when you are in a dorm with twenty+ other people rather than just a few, and preferred the large dorms. Especially when the dorm didn't fill up, and people could spread out more.
... I plan to walk mid-August to end September. ... the more I read about flashers on the trail the more I want to at least walk within sight and hearing distance of others ...
I haven't read this book. However, please put it in the context of all the other stuff that you have read. I am not an "albergue-type-of-person" but have been very pleased with most of my albergue experience. If I were writing a book, it would be much easier to describe and emphasize the negatives than the positives. In any case, albergues are not compulsory and it is not an all-or-nothing decision. If I don't feel like an albergue one day, then I go to a hostal or hotel.Katherine Soper's book where her albergue experience is far from pleasant!
The cheaper accommodation tends to fill up fastest. Albergues come in several different types and many different styles; some will offer private (single or double) rooms often without private bathrooms. The next type of accommodation is a "hostal" - this is really a small hotel that doesn't have all of the hotel amenities such as 24-hour reception. It is probably a technical classification, but for our purposes, they are small hotels. They can be quite comfortable and inexpensive for a private room and bath. A "casa rural" is essentially a bed and breakfast. All of these can be found on any of the popular booking sites and are also advertised along the way. It is not necessary to list and reserve them all in advance, and it is not necessary to pick out all the "best" ones in advance.Is it typically the albergues that run out of room and is the next upgrade an hospitales or casa rurales?
They are not frequent on the trail, so I wonder what you are reading. Again, please put in context of the number of people walking the camino. Walking in August-September you will have have no shortage of people in sight and within hearing.the more I read about flashers on the trail
Please let me know - the more I read about flashers on the trail the more I want to at least walk within sight and hearing distance of others
@SYates, you mean the others, right? Not the flashers?In August/September that is pretty much guaranteed on the CF ;-) BC SY
I never saw, nor had any fear of encountering flashers on the Camino.I read about flashers on the trail the more I want to at least walk within sight and hearing distance of others so I can be alone and yet feel a little more secure.
@SYates, you mean the others, right? Not the flashers?
Having a little fun. I hope you noticed Mr. RolleyesObviously - sorry second language English speaker here.
I have no experience with this company so I'm not recommending them but it looks like you should check this out: http://www.stormwhistles.com/quickfacts.htmlThank you - I am currently researching (piercing) whistles!
I have no experience with this company so I'm not recommending them but it looks like you should check this out: http://www.stormwhistles.com/quickfacts.html
Not only did I forget about those but I also forgot about those trekking poles that do double duty as alpenhorns.I'd check your rucksack first, some of them come with integrated whistles
If you do get one of these (the large or small) please review it here. I've seen the large one in orange at camping stores but even if it were sanitary to try them out I don't think I have the guts to try one out there. I do however ring large bells when I can find them. The one at St. Stevens in Zabaldika was a real treat. I haven't been to the Liberty Bell in Philadephia yet but watch for news reports.Thank you Rick - sounds (pun intended) perfect - exactly what I was looking for
Interestingly, as I observed the non-reservation albergue pilgrims as I walked, I realized that I had a much less routinized Camino than they did: no need to finish the day's walk by early afternoon or risk not getting a bed in a town where I wanted to be, no need to rush to wash my clothes in time to dry them, no need to finish dinner before curfew (and not be able to relax and have another glass of Rioja or cup of te manzanillo), no need to get up early (I'm not a morning person) to start the day's schedule again.
I have seen a few different variations....
The Tour Company.
Booking Ahead with Luggage.
Totally Free Wheeling.
Rick - having got your measure I'm now no longer sure when you're kidding & when you're not
Sorry. I've lead you on a wild goose chase. I thought my rolleyes icon would have been a giveaway that I was kidding.Rick - having got your measure I'm now no longer sure when you're kidding & when you're not - I'm now researching trekking poles being used as alpenhorns - please tell me it's not a wild goose chase!:-O
Hi @sue-sheila, do you have a starting town in mind?
And @DurhamParish may be able to give you some info on a tour company he's used and liked.
Take care and Buen Camino!
Faith
I too used Macs - excellent! I highly recommend them. My Camino was about the walk, so had no second thoughts about bag transfers and pre-booked rooms. Plenty of social opportunity en route - if you want it - and there are plenty of folks who, if you ask, would welcome you to their breakfast or dinner table. On that, go for the breakfast included self guided tour but don't include the evening meal. Means you always set out with a breakfast inside you, but leaves you flexibility for the evening.Hi @sue-sheila,
I walked the full Camino Frances, March/April/May 2016, and booked with an organising company for a bunch of reasons. I had an extra bag transferred forward every day and stayed in very small hotels. If I had carried a large pack I wouldn't have made it as I developed a bad case of plantar fasciitis. I had suffered a bout of PF while training during the previous year - that almost completely cleared up by Camino time but I was very wary of it recurring. It did and it took me 6 months to recover. I had extra gear to carry - photographic equipment and a Cpap machine, also clothes, etc. for a long holiday after the Camino. I really enjoyed the privacy in the evenings because I needed long hot showers and did a lot of hobbling and limping and lying down.
Negatives: I missed out on the whole hostel social scene but I met hundreds of people walking and at mealtimes. It cost a lot of extra money. If anything goes wrong and you want a few rest days (blisters, sprains) you're locked in to pre-booked accommodation and that can be for weeks ahead.
What I would do differently?: I would book ahead same as last time BUT, allow more rest days - one per week is not enough. Get regular massages - one a week sounds lovely.
I walked for a couple of weeks, off and on, with a couple who booked ahead every day, stayed in many hotels I did. I think they sent bags ahead too, we all carried similar small daypacks. So they didn't use a "tour" company and saved some money, were more flexible. Infrastructure along the Camino Frances is extensive - taxis, baggage transfers, accommodation, etc. BUT, I expect that summer would be very different, all services would be very much in demand. If Spain was closer to home, I might have done it differently. I could have stopped, jumped on a quick flight or train home and gone back the following year. But Australia is very expensive flights to everywhere and I'm a bit of an obsessive planner.
Purist pilgrims would not approve of my Camino choices. But I walked 800kms and I was 72 at the time. No regrets at all.
I used Macs Adventure (Glasgow). Service was flawless, they never missed a beat. Local contact was a Spanish company called Tee Travel, they were great to deal with, solved a few problems instantly, I only had to call them 3 or 4 times.
Buen Camino, - Mike
Yes, I spent a few bucks on accommodation but really pigged out at the included breakfast. When there was a lot of choice I really went for it and therefore saved on lunch expenses. I always got my own dinner, but often paid for dinner at the hotel as that was a good source of profit for the owners. They were almost always very eager to please and kind. I'm a vegetarian so often asked for a mix and match order from among the menu choices. This never caused any problems. This personal service in a small establishment was always very pleasant and good-natured.I too used Macs - excellent! I highly recommend them. My Camino was about the walk, so had no second thoughts about bag transfers and pre-booked rooms. Plenty of social opportunity en route - if you want it - and there are plenty of folks who, if you ask, would welcome you to their breakfast or dinner table. On that, go for the breakfast included self guided tour but don't include the evening meal. Means you always set out with a breakfast inside you, but leaves you flexibility for the evening.
Marly Camino does a fantastic job. They can arrange your tour, or you can join one of their tours. wonderful people, and they only do camino trips.
I did a pre booked week long trip on the Camino (St. Jean to Logrono) with breakfast included and would not opt for the breakfast again. I found myself departing before the breakfast was served and preferred to eat after an hour or two of walking. You can always arrange breakfast upon check in, so no need to pay for at the time of booking.Yes, I spent a few bucks on accommodation but really pigged out at the included breakfast. When there was a lot of choice I really went for it and therefore saved on lunch expenses. I always got my own dinner, but often paid for dinner at the hotel as that was a good source of profit for the owners. They were almost always very eager to please and kind. I'm a vegetarian so often asked for a mix and match order from among the menu choices. This never caused any problems. This personal service in a small establishment was always very pleasant and good-natured.
A wise choice. I didn't always eat breakfast, but enjoyed it and really stoked up when there was a big choice at a buffet breakfast at the larger hotels. That's when I really shovelled it in and saved money later in the day. I'm not an early starter, so heading out at dawn and missing breakfast is not a factor with me. I was sometimes too tired to eat dinner so was ravenous by morning. I walked for 6 weeks so had time for a pattern to set in.I did a pre booked week long trip on the Camino (St. Jean to Logrono) with breakfast included and would not opt for the breakfast again. I found myself departing before the breakfast was served and preferred to eat after an hour or two of walking. You can always arrange breakfast upon check in, so no need to pay for at the time of booking.
While on the CF last year I heard some very quick and urgent gravel crunching come up behind me like a train. I stopped and turned around in case it was a serial killer and it was a little nuggetty guy in a baseball cap who didn't miss a beat, rushed past me, walking backwards for a few paces. Italian I think, maybe 55 years of age, short shorts, and it was cold. He said he walked 40kms per day, I don't know how far he walked on his Camino in total, maybe 40kms!?We met a pilgrim on the French Camino who was continually needing to take taxis because she could not do the distance to the next reservation each day that had been prebooked by a tour company. Knowing how far you can walk consistently Is important if you are prebooking! We used caminofacil to move our bags and it worked out well! Our bags arrived without incidence! We combined hotels, pensions, and some albergues. We never stayed in dorms because of a combination of our need for 8 hours of good sleep and bathroom issues. We met some young 30km daily walkers who shared a private room with one another because of the sleep issue! The more you know yourself, abilities and limitations the easier the decision will be!
He was muscly, short and very fit for his age, very energetic. He was coming up behind me so fast I was a bit unsettled, but he turned out to be a very charming character with a powerful sense of purpose.Thank goodness for little nuggety (whatever that means) guys in short shorts who are NOT serial killers!!!
However what do you mean by max 400 km Mike? That's only half the CF!!! I get the 20-25 km per day part! Please explain.
completamente de acuerdo. Haga el Camino y lo importante es Vivirlo. Disfrutelo ! Buen Camino!I would say that quite a number of members on this Forum have an instinctive bias against tour companies, and given the nature of the Forum I think that is understandable. However, I did my first long distance walk back in 1985, and since then I have done a reasonable number of long walks. I have walked carrying my backpack and I have walked using luggage transport; I have walked using tour agencies for self-guided trips and I have walked just finding accommodation along the way; I have walked solo and I have walked with others. As far as I can tell, none of that really matters. What I think is important is to just get out and do it. It is not how you do it, but how you experience it. It is seeing and learning the culture, seeing and learning the history, meeting interesting people from around the globe, enjoying the food and wine, and maybe even learning a bit about yourself.
So my simple opinion is that if there are people out there that like the simplicity and comfort of using a tour agency, go for it. My experiences have all been good. I have no regrets. My only word of advice would be to do your research, look at multiple organizations and understand what services you are receiving for the money you are paying. If you feel you are getting decent value for the money, then it's all good.
To answer your specific question, although I have used tour agencies for self-guided trips in the recent past, this summer I am carrying my pack and basically making my own way on the Via Francigena. I have however reserved beds in advance, as accommodation appears sparse along the route. I could have used a tour company, and may do so again in the future, but this time I just wanted to change it up a bit and make sure that I am not getting too soft in my old age.
By the way, I am not connected in any way with a tour company, and I am not trying to persuade or dissuade anyone from using them. They are there, and they provide a service that meets the needs of some, but not others.
Either way, enjoy your Camino!
And let me add this: some of the folks who lead organized small-group walks are just darn good company!
In 2012 I walked with Anniesantiago. In 2015 I walked with sillydoll. And I consider myself blessed to have been able to do so. In 2017 I stepped outside my comfort zone and walked the short, simple, Camino Finisterre solo -- no group. Easily done -- and I had a wonderful good time. But you know what? I'd have had more fun walking with Anniesantiago or sillydoll! 2017 confirmed what I suspected about myself. Walking solo I tend to withdraw too much into myself.
I speak Spanish. I know the Camino well, now -- its unique 'culture', its churches and monuments, its tapas bars and pulpo restaurants. I visit the Forum regularly.... I could certainly go solo. But when I next go back I will not walk alone.
Any phone should do, as long as it is unlocked. Either get an international plan from your current supplier, or buy a SIM card on arrival in Spain. Vodafone and others have a 30-day Visitors option that provides lots of talk time and enough data for most purposes. It can be topped up after 30 days, in case you need it longer.May I ask what phone you used on the Camino?
You do not need to carry 2 phones. All the apps and accounts that you have on your existing device will still be available when you change the SIM card. Only the phone number will change.I have tried the buy a cheap phone/SIM card options travelling in other countries before and in the end, I realized all my apps/life are on my phone and I don't want to carry two phones.
Absolutely, and do want all this when your wallet doesn't mind forking out the differences.In the end, it is a personal choice. I lead groups on the Camino and the people that usually sign up with me are people who aren't quite ready to tackle it on their own, have particular health issues, don't speak Spanish, want to walk with a group, want bag transport and don't want to deal with it, or want booked lodging and don't want to deal with it.[...] To each his/her own. Do what makes your little heart happy and listen to your gut. That's my advice.
Frankly, there's not much difference. There aren't too many places you can go in Europe for 18 nights for $1700 that include booked NICE lodging, bus transport between the large cities, and bag transport. I budget for 8 and divide the cost by 7 to cover myself. I probably "make" $2/hour, if that, for all the time it takes me to manage the trip.Absolutely, and do want all this when your wallet doesn't mind forking out the differences.
You may find it strange, but I am very happy to read that the Forum helped you to make a good decision that was right for you and your daugther. Well done by the both of you!...Then a Google search landed me here at the Camino Forum and I devoured all the posts and wisdom. I chose to trust the words here that I was physically able to walk it and the Camino would provide. Yet I was still filled with anxiety the days before I left because I was stepping outside of my comfort zone. But I chose not to hire any touring company because of the cost and also because it quickly seemed unnecessary after reading this forum because the things they provided I knew I could do myself.
My daughter and I just returned from the Camino Frances, having walked 126 km outside Sarria to Santiago in 8 days, giving us 3 extra days to spend in Santiago. We walked farther than we expected each day, averaging 8 to 12 miles. We carried our own packs, careful to adhere to the less than 10% of our body weight rule. We did not stay in any albergues. We stayed in pensions, hostels and casa rurales simply because I wanted her to have privacy and her own bathroom. Every afternoon, I looked at the next stage map from Brierley and sussed out the 8 mile range and then used Booking.com to find places with double rooms/private bath in that area and booked only the next day's stay.
Never did we have any problems. After one day walking, I knew we were fine. After two, we were having the time of our lives. We were constantly surrounded by people, we easily got by with English only, we made friends, we had our own bathroom, we paid between 30 and 40 a night for a double room/private bath and we walked at our pace....
Here's the deal, you can do anything for yourself that a tour provider will do for you, plus you'll have more flexibility. You can make your own reservations a day or two in advance based on your progress. With Jacotrans, it is easy to send your bags ahead if you like. You can also catch a taxi or bus to advance to your next destination if you get behind schedule. I can appreciate that this all feels like a leap of faith, but it is all eminently doable.Hello everyone - I initially was contemplating going on a pre-mapped/routed CF walk with bag transfers and hotel bookings. However, after posting a question to receive tips and guidance there was an unanimous response by everyone (kind enough to take the time to offer me advice) to take the Camino as it comes and to NOT plan everything to the last detail simply because there are too many variables to contend with.
The fact also remains that the only two people that I have actually spoken with at length are 2 women who both walked the CF last year in May (at different times) and both of them highly recommended having an agency plan the trip and that it worked out well for them.
I know that there *are* people who opt for the pre-mapped trip but was wondering if after having used a tour company once, whether they would do the same or whether they would "go with the flow" and open themselves up to the adventure of the unknown and unpredictable if they got the chance to walk again.
Please note that I am aware that these are two completely opposing schools so I don't want to start a debate so much as hear from the agency-guided people about their experience/thoughts/regrets/resolutions.
Thank you in advance.
I’ve used a pre mapped company with luggage transfers and will definitely do it again. Listen, it’s hard enough out there. Your pilgrimage is YOURS. The inner work that happens while out there is deep no matter how you slice it so follow your gut on this and know it’s an amazing adventure no matter how you do it.Hello everyone - I initially was contemplating going on a pre-mapped/routed CF walk with bag transfers and hotel bookings. However, after posting a question to receive tips and guidance there was an unanimous response by everyone (kind enough to take the time to offer me advice) to take the Camino as it comes and to NOT plan everything to the last detail simply because there are too many variables to contend with.
The fact also remains that the only two people that I have actually spoken with at length are 2 women who both walked the CF last year in May (at different times) and both of them highly recommended having an agency plan the trip and that it worked out well for them.
I know that there *are* people who opt for the pre-mapped trip but was wondering if after having used a tour company once, whether they would do the same or whether they would "go with the flow" and open themselves up to the adventure of the unknown and unpredictable if they got the chance to walk again.
Please note that I am aware that these are two completely opposing schools so I don't want to start a debate so much as hear from the agency-guided people about their experience/thoughts/regrets/resolutions.
Thank you in advance.
Hi, @LpDenver, Welcome to the forum.I’ve used a pre mapped company with luggage transfers and will definitely do it again. Listen, it’s hard enough out there. Your pilgrimage is YOURS. The inner work that happens while out there is deep no matter how you slice it so follow your gut on this and know it’s an amazing adventure no matter how you do it.
I walked the Camino del Norte for two weeks last October . I used Follow the Camino for hotel booking and taking a small bag. I initially wasn’t going to use a company, but my husband was not super comfortable with his 69 yr old wife going off alone on a hike. He felt more comfortable know I had everything booked and planned ahead. This year he’s going with me for the next leg. I haven’t decided whether we’ll use Follow the Camino or not. Here are the pros and cons:Hello everyone - I initially was contemplating going on a pre-mapped/routed CF walk with bag transfers and hotel bookings. However, after posting a question to receive tips and guidance there was an unanimous response by everyone (kind enough to take the time to offer me advice) to take the Camino as it comes and to NOT plan everything to the last detail simply because there are too many variables to contend with.
The fact also remains that the only two people that I have actually spoken with at length are 2 women who both walked the CF last year in May (at different times) and both of them highly recommended having an agency plan the trip and that it worked out well for them.
I know that there *are* people who opt for the pre-mapped trip but was wondering if after having used a tour company once, whether they would do the same or whether they would "go with the flow" and open themselves up to the adventure of the unknown and unpredictable if they got the chance to walk again.
Please note that I am aware that these are two completely opposing schools so I don't want to start a debate so much as hear from the agency-guided people about their experience/thoughts/regrets/resolutions.
Thank you in advance.
I walked the Camino del Norte from San Sebastián to Llanes last October. I used Follow the Camino. I’m planning to gHello everyone - I initially was contemplating going on a pre-mapped/routed CF walk with bag transfers and hotel bookings. However, after posting a question to receive tips and guidance there was an unanimous response by everyone (kind enough to take the time to offer me advice) to take the Camino as it comes and to NOT plan everything to the last detail simply because there are too many variables to contend with.
The fact also remains that the only two people that I have actually spoken with at length are 2 women who both walked the CF last year in May (at different times) and both of them highly recommended having an agency plan the trip and that it worked out well for them.
I know that there *are* people who opt for the pre-mapped trip but was wondering if after having used a tour company once, whether they would do the same or whether they would "go with the flow" and open themselves up to the adventure of the unknown and unpredictable if they got the chance to walk again.
Please note that I am aware that these are two completely opposing schools so I don't want to start a debate so much as hear from the agency-guided people about their experience/thoughts/regrets/resolutions.
Thank you in advance.
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