Tia Valeria
Veteran Member
- Time of past OR future Camino
- Pt Norte/Pmtvo 2010
C. Inglés 2011
C. Primitivo '12
Norte-C. de la Reina '13
C. do Mar-C. Inglés '15
For 2024 Pilgrims: €50,- donation = 1 year with no ads on the forum + 90% off any 2024 Guide. More here. (Discount code sent to you by Private Message after your donation) |
---|
61/13, of which 1 child - so encouragingly numbers continue to fallPeter Robins said:total now 66, of which 15 in intensive carePeter Robins said:several others have been moved out of intensive care, which now totals 22. 70 in total are still in hospital
what's the alternative though? Should Galicia remain cut off and economically backward, with mules and ox carts? Should Santiago be just a museum for affluent outsiders to photograph on brief visits, or should it modernise like any other city? Should Spain keep its old trundle trains that took forever to get anywhere?jirit said:The author suggests that "of a decade of oversized dreams, fast money and fast trains" may have contributed to the crash (not with standing the fact that the driver was speeding, and talking on the phone moments before the accident). After walking the Via de la Plata this past spring, and witnessing first hand both high speed rail and super highway construction slicing up the Spanish countryside, I could not help but agree.
jirit said:Some interesting comments about the train crash in Santiago
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... uman-error
The author suggests that "of a decade of oversized dreams, fast money and fast trains" may have contributed to the crash (not with standing the fact that the driver was speeding, and talking on the phone moments before the accident). After walking the Via de la Plata this past spring, and witnessing first hand both high speed rail and super highway construction slicing up the Spanish countryside, I could not help but agree.
I doubt that - the idea that 'countryside' should be 'pretty' is modernstevenjarvis said:I imagine that many of the residents on the Via de La Plata were APPALLED at the Romans carving up the countryside with their metaled (?) roads and bridges....
indeed. This sort of accident inevitably (and rightly) puts the spotlight on rail safety, but longer-term stats give the incidence of passenger fatalities in Spain at <0.4 per billion passenger km http://www.era.europa.eu/Document-Regis ... %20web.pdfstevenjarvis said:The tragic derailment will make them even safer.
57/11Peter Robins said:61/13, of which 1 child - so encouragingly numbers continue to fallPeter Robins said:total now 66, of which 15 in intensive carePeter Robins said:several others have been moved out of intensive care, which now totals 22. 70 in total are still in hospital
I couldn't agree more, and should have said, these things should be safe.jirit said:good progress to improve the lives of many but not at the expense of some.
A lot of people paid dearly last week.
Quite, however there has always been resistance to change and nostalgia. I remember Chester before it was ruined with those awful City walls......Peter Robins said:I doubt that - the idea that 'countryside' should be 'pretty' is modernstevenjarvis said:I imagine that many of the residents on the Via de La Plata were APPALLED at the Romans carving up the countryside with their metaled (?) roads and bridges....
yes, and Santiago before it was ruined with all that baroque stuff ...stevenjarvis said:I remember Chester before it was ruined with those awful City walls......
the judge ruled this afternoon that, although the timing and place of the call was 'unfortunate' given what transpired, it was part of the normal work of a train journey and could not be held to be responsible for the crash.falcon269 said:Cell phone distraction may have played a part in the tragedy. I have never seen railroad employees NOT use cell phones while working, including the engineer very visible in the single-car coach to Zaragoza. The conductor was talking almost full time.
according to the head of Renfe, it is not a question of cost, but that this line, opened last year, is still in a transition phase; it will not be a fully operational AVE line until 2018. There are some outstanding issues with the ERTMS ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_R ... ent_System ) to resolve, but this should be complete by the end of the yearjirit said:What troubles me in the march to get things done, to build out a network of super highways and fast trains that some things get over looked. Things that make you wonder why.
For example a 4-5 km of rail track whereby there is no advanced control features in place
People complained but others it appeared were prepared to overlook this in the name of progress.
"It cost too much money and it would delay things", were some of the comments I read.
Peter Robins said:more on the use of phones in an article today http://www.lavozdegalicia.es/noticia/ga ... 2P9992.htm
"Using a phone? But that's why they give us one!"
JohnnieWalker said:When do we let this go?
I think we will find that it was much more than using a mobile phone.
I think people we learn that the so called control system that was in place for this section of track was not in full operation, that this section of the track was poorly marked and designed and the equipment and material used by the train engineers is mostly low tech - simple sheets of paper to guide them on the speed between each section of the journey.
What is most alarming is the max speed for the section of track before the accident is rated at 200 km which then drops down to only 80 km though out the curve. The change is speed occurs at the 84.1 km mark, a few meters just beyond the tunnel, and only meters before where the accident occurred. Without a fully operational system in place, a train operator driving the train at the legal full speed at 200 km, that is distracted by a phone call, gets no obvious audio or visual warnings that the speed should be reduced to 80 km/hr unless he or she happens to check a sheet a paper. There is nothing on the track to indicate this (unlike highway signs that indicate a need to slow down) and if the system was not fully operational as some reports now suggest there was probably no electronic or audio indicators too.
If this is case, then this is very troubling.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?