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Just looked at the Goddard King book. Her own journey went from Lourdes through Bedous then Canfranc and Jaca and Punte la Reina. What we would now call the Aragones. She did also visit Pamplona and Roncesvalles though she only covers a visit to Roncesvalles in a brief appendix. SJPDP only gets one mention in the text when she is discussing the Aymeric Picaud itinerary. Why do you think her book settles the "starting point" argument in favour of SJPDP?And yes, SJPP as the "starting point" even in the 1910s, so that it would seem that this notion is not a recent invention.
The early Camino material is very interesting. The academic Walter Starkie walked the Way in 1954 and published an account of his experience in 1957, called, "The Road to Santiago". A wonderful synthesis of his personl journey and the history of the pilgrimage.Some Camino associations have restored a 45-minute 1951 documentary on the Camino, which seems to be French :
https://www.elcorreogallego.es/soci...ental-o-camino-santiago-frances-90141162.html
The pilgrims seemed to have used the Codex Calixtinus as a primary source for their itinerary.
They describe the film as descriptive of the first period of modern Camino revival in the 1950s, led by some French intellectuals -- though I'd personally comment that in the Holy Years of the 1930s to 1950s, there were already groups of Spanish foot pilgrims doing similar.
It seems they are planning to post the documentary onto Youtube.
In the same event, the associations presented a 3-volume 1917 English-language Camino "guidebook" by US author and medievalist and peregrina Giorgiana Goddard King, published in 1920, currently being translated into Spanish.
There's a brief review of the book here (in French) : https://www.persee.fr/doc/hispa_0007-4640_1926_num_28_1_2235_t1_0094_0000_2 Similar here : https://www.persee.fr/doc/bec_0373-6237_1923_num_84_1_460637_t1_0378_0000_001
Looks rather interesting !!
Reprints of all three volumes are available on Amazon, not expensive.
The description for volume 2 includes :
Completed in 1917, this three-volume masterpiece is a wide-ranging exploration of the history, literature, legends, and architecture of the Camino de Santiago. It is based on Professor King's "three years wanderings" on foot and by cart, mule, and other conveyance on the Spanish pilgrimage road, and on extensive academic research with particular emphasis on medieval art and architecture. Professor King was both a well-respected scholar and a keen observer of her surroundings. As a result, she has given us a fascinating, detailed description of both life and architecture on the Camino de Santiago nearly 100 years ago.
The books seem to be part Camino mémoir, part "guidebook" in the older sense of the term, i.e. something to read in preparation not carry with you on the Way, part historical notes on the cities, towns, villages and monuments along the Francès between SJPP and Santiago.
And yes, SJPP as the "starting point" even in the 1910s, so that it would seem that this notion is not a recent invention.
Starkie travelled from Canfranc to Santiago. Along the way he used a lot of different means of transport - bus, car and lorry amongst them. Walking was only a minor part of his journey.The academic Walter Starkie walked the Way in 1954 and published an account of his experience in 1957, called, "The Road to Santiago".
Are there other sources now ?The pilgrims seemed to have used the Codex Calixtinus as a primary source for their itinerary.
There are several others.Are there other sources now ?
It's not up yet.(I cannot manage to access the video, could you provide the exact link ?)
Well I don't, but I guess I got a false inference from the Galician article.Why do you think her book settles the "starting point" argument in favour of SJPDP?
Academics have used GG King's trilogy for years as a yardstick for the art, architecture and history of the pilgrimage to Santiago.Some Camino associations have restored a 45-minute 1951 documentary on the Camino, which seems to be French :
https://www.elcorreogallego.es/soci...ental-o-camino-santiago-frances-90141162.html
The pilgrims seemed to have used the Codex Calixtinus as a primary source for their itinerary.
They describe the film as descriptive of the first period of modern Camino revival in the 1950s, led by some French intellectuals -- though I'd personally comment that in the Holy Years of the 1930s to 1950s, there were already groups of Spanish foot pilgrims doing similar.
It seems they are planning to post the documentary onto Youtube.
In the same event, the associations presented a 3-volume 1917 English-language Camino "guidebook" by US author and medievalist and peregrina Giorgiana Goddard King, published in 1920, currently being translated into Spanish.
There's a brief review of the book here (in French) : https://www.persee.fr/doc/hispa_0007-4640_1926_num_28_1_2235_t1_0094_0000_2 Similar here : https://www.persee.fr/doc/bec_0373-6237_1923_num_84_1_460637_t1_0378_0000_001
Looks rather interesting !!
Reprints of all three volumes are available on Amazon, not expensive.
The description for volume 2 includes :
Completed in 1917, this three-volume masterpiece is a wide-ranging exploration of the history, literature, legends, and architecture of the Camino de Santiago. It is based on Professor King's "three years wanderings" on foot and by cart, mule, and other conveyance on the Spanish pilgrimage road, and on extensive academic research with particular emphasis on medieval art and architecture. Professor King was both a well-respected scholar and a keen observer of her surroundings. As a result, she has given us a fascinating, detailed description of both life and architecture on the Camino de Santiago nearly 100 years ago.
The books seem to be part Camino mémoir, part "guidebook" in the older sense of the term, i.e. something to read in preparation not carry with you on the Way, part historical notes on the cities, towns, villages and monuments along the Francès between SJPP and Santiago.
And yes, SJPP as the "starting point" even in the 1910s, so that it would seem that this notion is not a recent invention.
Fascinating…I’ll check it out. Thanks for posting and sharing! Always up for historical perspective.Some Camino associations have restored a 45-minute 1951 documentary on the Camino, which seems to be French :
https://www.elcorreogallego.es/soci...ental-o-camino-santiago-frances-90141162.html
The pilgrims seemed to have used the Codex Calixtinus as a primary source for their itinerary.
They describe the film as descriptive of the first period of modern Camino revival in the 1950s, led by some French intellectuals -- though I'd personally comment that in the Holy Years of the 1930s to 1950s, there were already groups of Spanish foot pilgrims doing similar.
It seems they are planning to post the documentary onto Youtube.
In the same event, the associations presented a 3-volume 1917 English-language Camino "guidebook" by US author and medievalist and peregrina Giorgiana Goddard King, published in 1920, currently being translated into Spanish.
There's a brief review of the book here (in French) : https://www.persee.fr/doc/hispa_0007-4640_1926_num_28_1_2235_t1_0094_0000_2 Similar here : https://www.persee.fr/doc/bec_0373-6237_1923_num_84_1_460637_t1_0378_0000_001
Looks rather interesting !!
Reprints of all three volumes are available on Amazon, not expensive.
The description for volume 2 includes :
Completed in 1917, this three-volume masterpiece is a wide-ranging exploration of the history, literature, legends, and architecture of the Camino de Santiago. It is based on Professor King's "three years wanderings" on foot and by cart, mule, and other conveyance on the Spanish pilgrimage road, and on extensive academic research with particular emphasis on medieval art and architecture. Professor King was both a well-respected scholar and a keen observer of her surroundings. As a result, she has given us a fascinating, detailed description of both life and architecture on the Camino de Santiago nearly 100 years ago.
The books seem to be part Camino mémoir, part "guidebook" in the older sense of the term, i.e. something to read in preparation not carry with you on the Way, part historical notes on the cities, towns, villages and monuments along the Francès between SJPP and Santiago.
And yes, SJPP as the "starting point" even in the 1910s, so that it would seem that this notion is not a recent invention.
Perhaps of interest to some …JabbaPapa,
Thanks for the link to the video.
Some fellow posters have been reading Georgina Goddard King in recent years to experience the difference 100 years makes by reading some of her early 20th c descriptions published c1920.
You can begin to research GGK and her Spanish journeys in this earlier Forum thread.
Indeed the times may have changed but thankfully most locations still remain !!
Happy reading and Carpe diem.
His 1982 guide shows both routes mentioned in the Codex Calixtinus. One from Sant Michel and the other from Borce - both which were in 'Spain' until the borders were changed in the 1800s.Elías Valiña’s guidebook from the 1970s doesn’t even choose SJPDP as the starting point of the CF. As the godfather of the modern pilgrimage resurgence (he started the yellow arrows!), his book highlighted the Aragon route as the original and felt that the CF jumping off point was just before SJPDP where several routes merged together.
Just looked at the Goddard King book. Her own journey went from Lourdes through Bedous then Canfranc and Jaca and Punte la Reina. What we would now call the Aragones. She did also visit Pamplona and Roncesvalles though she only covers a visit to Roncesvalles in a brief appendix. SJPDP only gets one mention in the text when she is discussing the Aymeric Picaud itinerary. Why do you think her book settles the "starting point" argument in favour of SJPDP?
He describes St Jean Pied de Port, but it doesn't sound like he is describing it as the start of any route or pilgrimage, just as one of the towns he is passing through. Or am I missing something?I just wrote a brief citation of how Domenico Laffi, a 17th century pilgrim from Bologna to Santiago de Compostela, visited and described Saint Jean Pied de Port during his pilgrimage.
Yes, but joramos was referring to "official routes or paths recognized under Law 5/2016 of May 4, on the cultural heritage of Galicia (art. 73.2)" in his list. You left out the qualifying latter part in your quote. There are certainly many routes considered "official" in their regions, marked and supported. But the examples you provide are probably not recognized under Law 5/2016 and were thus not included in the list.The number of "official routes" is much larger than that, and cataloguing them would involve gathering information on "official routes" both nationally in the various countries of Europe and regionally within those countries.
The current Major routes of the Camino are all within Spain, France, and Portugal -- though arguably the Jakobsweg should really be included (with its major variants) -- though by counter-example, the route down here, the Provençal/Via Aurelia was historically a very major route, leading not only from the South of France and Eastern and Southern Spain to Rome, but also from the South-East of France and Italy to Compostela. It's still anyway an "official" route, recognised, waymarked, and possessed of pilgrim support infrastructures.
Yes, but joramos was referring to "official routes or paths recognized under Law 5/2016 of May 4, on the cultural heritage of Galicia (art. 73.2)" in his list. You left out the qualifying latter part in your quote. There are certainly many routes considered "official" in their regions, marked and supported. But the examples you provide are probably not recognized under Law 5/2016 and were thus not included in the list.
Although the relevance of this law to the 1951 documentary under discussion is not clear.
The number of "official routes" is much larger than that, and cataloguing them would involve gathering information on "official routes" both nationally in the various countries of Europe and regionally within those countries.
The current Major routes of the Camino are all within Spain, France, and Portugal -- though arguably the Jakobsweg should really be included (with its major variants) -- though by counter-example, the route down here, the Provençal/Via Aurelia was historically a very major route, leading not only from the South of France and Eastern and Southern Spain to Rome, but also from the South-East of France and Italy to Compostela. It's still anyway an "official" route, recognised, waymarked, and possessed of pilgrim support infrastructures.
I went and looked at this list, from the website of the Office of the Cathedral at Santiago de Compostela. It was very interesting!If you "click/open" the link; https://oficinadelperegrino.com/preparacion/planificacion/ then click or open "French Way," it open up a list of the different camino paths. On the top list are the ways inside France (Via Podiensis, Via Turonensis, Via Lemovicensis, and Via Tolosane). On the bottom list are the different ways and points along the Camino Frances. Starting at "Saint Jean Pied de Port!"
It is good to see Dr. King's work mentioned. I have had this three-volume set for many years. It was the first set of books that I ever purchased on the Camino. I recommend it to all those who have an interest in the Camino and enjoy an academic's own record of experience and research.Some Camino associations have restored a 45-minute 1951 documentary on the Camino, which seems to be French :
https://www.elcorreogallego.es/soci...ental-o-camino-santiago-frances-90141162.html
The pilgrims seemed to have used the Codex Calixtinus as a primary source for their itinerary.
They describe the film as descriptive of the first period of modern Camino revival in the 1950s, led by some French intellectuals -- though I'd personally comment that in the Holy Years of the 1930s to 1950s, there were already groups of Spanish foot pilgrims doing similar.
It seems they are planning to post the documentary onto Youtube.
In the same event, the associations presented a 3-volume 1917 English-language Camino "guidebook" by US author and medievalist and peregrina Giorgiana Goddard King, published in 1920, currently being translated into Spanish.
There's a brief review of the book here (in French) : https://www.persee.fr/doc/hispa_0007-4640_1926_num_28_1_2235_t1_0094_0000_2 Similar here : https://www.persee.fr/doc/bec_0373-6237_1923_num_84_1_460637_t1_0378_0000_001
Looks rather interesting !!
Reprints of all three volumes are available on Amazon, not expensive.
The description for volume 2 includes :
Completed in 1917, this three-volume masterpiece is a wide-ranging exploration of the history, literature, legends, and architecture of the Camino de Santiago. It is based on Professor King's "three years wanderings" on foot and by cart, mule, and other conveyance on the Spanish pilgrimage road, and on extensive academic research with particular emphasis on medieval art and architecture. Professor King was both a well-respected scholar and a keen observer of her surroundings. As a result, she has given us a fascinating, detailed description of both life and architecture on the Camino de Santiago nearly 100 years ago.
The books seem to be part Camino mémoir, part "guidebook" in the older sense of the term, i.e. something to read in preparation not carry with you on the Way, part historical notes on the cities, towns, villages and monuments along the Francès between SJPP and Santiago.
And yes, SJPP as the "starting point" even in the 1910s, so that it would seem that this notion is not a recent invention.
Sure, but I was just making a counterpoint that other tallies of "official routes" are possible, and that a particular regional law of Galicia doesn't define the Camino.My recent post about Camino de Santiago "official routes or paths recognized under Law 5/2016 of May 4, on the cultural heritage of Galicia (art. 73.2)" is, as it states, about "Camino de Santiago." More specifically, Camino Frances from Saint Jean Pied de Port to Santiago de Compostela.
The point I originally made in this respect was not concerning the 1951 documentary, but rather Giorgiana Goddard King's references to Roncesvalles, and so that her comments on SJPP > Roncesvalles route, written in the 1910s, shows that the general significance of that route is older than just the modern revival of the Camino that started in the 1950s and 60s.Law 5/2016 has no direct relevance to the 1951 documentary. I was merely pointing out that Saint Jean Pied de Port is a popular starting point of Camino Frances,' owing its popularity to medieval (17th) and modern histories (early 2000s). As another forum member alluded, current popular Camino Frances starts where the paths in France end, Saint Jean Pied de Port.
I wouldn't try and necessarily replicate their stages every day as a walker. Some of them are pretty long! And it is pretty clear they had horses for at least some of their pilgrimage.Hmmm.
Using the Codex as your guidebook on the Camino.
Now, there's a challenge I could sink my teeth into (I DO have a copy).
Your advice is, of course, valid and pertinent.I wouldn't try and necessarily replicate their stages every day as a walker. Some of them are pretty long! And it is pretty clear they had horses for at least some of their pilgrimage.
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