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A stay of greater than 90 days

pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
I'm aware that variations of this question have been asked/posted previously, but I can't find an answer to my specific question, so here goes (and apologies in advance if it has been answered somewhere and I missed it).

All being well, next year I wish to spend 5 weeks or so undertaking an intensive Spanish language course in Salamanca, and then make my way down to Sevilla to start a 7-week or so stroll along the VDLP. Allowing for a bit of time before and after, I'm likely to fall over the 90-day Schengen visa limit by a week or so.

I know that Schengen visas can't be extended, so that leaves me looking for another visa type. Since I don't want to work, or formally study, my research tells me that my only option is to apply for a long term visa which becomes a precursor to Spanish residency, even though that's not an option which I am considering.

Has anyone else dealt with this issue, or can advise me? Of course the easiest path is simply to trim the cloth to fit the 90 days. But I'd like a bit of freedom and flexibility if I can manage it. Thanks in advance.

ps - to the degree it's relevant, I'm from Australia, and I've been to Spain numerous times, always in the past on a Schengen visa.
 
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biarritzdon

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF11, CF12, CP13, CF14, CA15, S.Anton15, CF&CI15
Ditch Pig16, CF&CP17, CdN18, CM18, CF18, LePuy19
I had a resident's visa in France for a number of years that I had to be renewed every year to maintain its validity. All I can say is the process is a big pain in the ass.
Consult the Spanish Embassy in Australia to get your answer. Anything you learn on this Forum will not official.
 

trecile

Camino Addict
Past OR future Camino
Francés (2016 & 2017), Norte (2018), Francés-Salvador-Norte (2019), Portuguese (2019)
I'm aware that variations of this question have been asked/posted previously, but I can't find an answer to my specific question, so here goes (and apologies in advance if it has been answered somewhere and I missed it).

All being well, next year I wish to spend 5 weeks or so undertaking an intensive Spanish language course in Salamanca, and then make my way down to Sevilla to start a 7-week or so stroll along the VDLP. Allowing for a bit of time before and after, I'm likely to fall over the 90-day Schengen visa limit by a week or so.

I know that Schengen visas can't be extended, so that leaves me looking for another visa type. Since I don't want to work, or formally study, my research tells me that my only option is to apply for a long term visa which becomes a precursor to Spanish residency, even though that's not an option which I am considering.

Has anyone else dealt with this issue, or can advise me? Of course the easiest path is simply to trim the cloth to fit the 90 days. But I'd like a bit of freedom and flexibility if I can manage it. Thanks in advance.

ps - to the degree it's relevant, I'm from Australia, and I've been to Spain numerous times, always in the past on a Schengen visa.
Attending an intensive language school may be enough to apply for a "student" visa. Definitely something toiok into.
 

pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
Consult the Spanish Embassy in Australia to get your answer. Anything you learn on this Forum will not official.
Thanks, yes, I've already had preliminary chats with the consul here, but with all the Covid uncertainty everything's a bit wonky - and "unofficial" guidance is always helpful :) ...
 
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CE1948

New Member
Past OR future Camino
2019
I'm aware that variations of this question have been asked/posted previously, but I can't find an answer to my specific question, so here goes (and apologies in advance if it has been answered somewhere and I missed it).

All being well, next year I wish to spend 5 weeks or so undertaking an intensive Spanish language course in Salamanca, and then make my way down to Sevilla to start a 7-week or so stroll along the VDLP. Allowing for a bit of time before and after, I'm likely to fall over the 90-day Schengen visa limit by a week or so.

I know that Schengen visas can't be extended, so that leaves me looking for another visa type. Since I don't want to work, or formally study, my research tells me that my only option is to apply for a long term visa which becomes a precursor to Spanish residency, even though that's not an option which I am considering.

Has anyone else dealt with this issue, or can advise me? Of course the easiest path is simply to trim the cloth to fit the 90 days. But I'd like a bit of freedom and flexibility if I can manage it. Thanks in advance.

ps - to the degree it's relevant, I'm from Australia, and I've been to Spain numerous times, always in the past on a Schengen visa.
Just a clarification - are you intending to try to stay longer in Europe or are you travelling further (e.g. another country, continent or back to Oz?). If the latter, you'd naturally depart on your Oz passport?
 
Past OR future Camino
June 2018
I'm aware that variations of this question have been asked/posted previously, but I can't find an answer to my specific question, so here goes (and apologies in advance if it has been answered somewhere and I missed it).

All being well, next year I wish to spend 5 weeks or so undertaking an intensive Spanish language course in Salamanca, and then make my way down to Sevilla to start a 7-week or so stroll along the VDLP. Allowing for a bit of time before and after, I'm likely to fall over the 90-day Schengen visa limit by a week or so.

I know that Schengen visas can't be extended, so that leaves me looking for another visa type. Since I don't want to work, or formally study, my research tells me that my only option is to apply for a long term visa which becomes a precursor to Spanish residency, even though that's not an option which I am considering.

Has anyone else dealt with this issue, or can advise me? Of course the easiest path is simply to trim the cloth to fit the 90 days. But I'd like a bit of freedom and flexibility if I can manage it. Thanks in advance.

ps - to the degree it's relevant, I'm from Australia, and I've been to Spain numerous times, always in the past on a Schengen visa.
When are you thinking of doing this precisely 'next year'? I am thinking of doing the same. I realise than since Brexit, I will be more reliant on my Aussie passport, and I was thinking of school in Malaga (I am already quite fluent, as lived in Barcelona as a 14 year old) and taking a quick trip to Marocco to re-vitalize my Schengen visa if the school can't help.
 

pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
Just a clarification - are you intending to try to stay longer in Europe or are you travelling further (e.g. another country, continent or back to Oz?). If the latter, you'd naturally depart on your Oz passport?
Just back to Oz. It all depends on flight schedules at the time, but essentially it would be out from and back into Oz, even if the flight schedule is via another Schengen country or maybe the UK. Apart from any transit ports, all my time would be spent in Spain.
 
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pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
When are you thinking of doing this precisely 'next year'?
It's all Covid dependent of course, but essentially around this time next year for the school, and then walking from Sept onwards. No firm dates - don't even know when we'll be allowed to leave Oz, so it's all still a bit of a dream (albeit one I've been planning for a couple of years now).
 
Past OR future Camino
June 2018
It's all Covid dependent of course, but essentially around this time next year for the school, and then walking from Sept onwards. No firm dates - don't even know when we'll be allowed to leave Oz, so it's all still a bit of a dream (albeit one I've been planning for a couple of years now).
I was planning on doing the 2nd half of the GR65, the chemin de St Jacques, in 2018but got food poisoning, then in 2019, but missed out due to a second bout with appendicitisthen missed out due to Covid, like most of us, i am planning a 6 month trip.....but who knows what will happen. A walk down the East coast of Australia might be the thing!
 
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O Peracha

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
1341
Several years ago I was going to do a hike thru several Schengen countries that was going to take longer than 90 days. Most of the time was going to be spent in France, so, I applied for a long term visa at the French consulate in Houston, Texas. Here's my take:

  • The requirements are cumbersome and somewhat time consuming but, overall, I didn't think it was that bad.
  • Follow the instructions. It's not a perfunctory process. They check that you have all the requirements. At the same time the requirements are pretty clear and they don't deviate, i.e. they didn't ask for anything that wasn't listed in the requirements.
  • However, having said that, it was clear that they really only cared about one thing - Finances, i.e. bank account. They want to make sure that you can support yourself while over there. I got the impression that once that was satisfied, everything else was pretty much a check the box exercise. And, no, they do not tell you what the magical number is.
Naturally, this is just my impression of my experience. Your mileage, as they say, may vary.
 

C clearly

Moderator
Staff member
Past OR future Camino
Most years since 2012. Hoping now for 2022.
a quick trip to Marocco to re-vitalize my Schengen visa
It does not work that way. By leaving the Schengen area for a day/week, you do not re-set the 90 days. You only subtract that day/week from the 90 days of the last 180, so you can re-enter for a day/week more. You must count your days in the last 180 days.
 

gpavey

New Member
Past OR future Camino
2021
Any chance you are a dual passport holder? You could then leave the Schengen area and return on a different passport. Worked for a friend.
 
Past OR future Camino
Us:Camino Frances, 2015 Me:Catalan/Aragonese, 2019
Citizens of Australia and New Zealand have it great with lots of countries giving them special breaks. If they are careful about following the rules they can spend years in Europe as tourists. They should check out this web page:


Other nationalities should go to the above page too as it has information on how to see if there are special Schengen rules exceptions for you too.
 
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pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
Citizens of Australia and New Zealand have it great with lots of countries giving them special breaks.
Thanks @Rick of Rick and Peg - I've now also had this drawn to my attention separately . It looks like it might have potential ... it also looks a bit complex, but I have heaps of time to try to work it out.
 
Past OR future Camino
Us:Camino Frances, 2015 Me:Catalan/Aragonese, 2019
Thanks @Rick of Rick and Peg - I've now also had this drawn to my attention separately . It looks like it might have potential ... it also looks a bit complex, but I have heaps of time to try to work it out.
I was in the process of editing my post by adding a link to this webpage so I'll put it here to make sure you see it.

 

deg333

New Member
Past OR future Camino
camino frances 2001, 2003
When are you thinking of doing this precisely 'next year'? I am thinking of doing the same. I realise than since Brexit, I will be more reliant on my Aussie passport, and I was thinking of school in Malaga (I am already quite fluent, as lived in Barcelona as a 14 year old) and taking a quick trip to Marocco to re-vitalize my Schengen visa if the school can't help.
Schengen is 90 days in and then 90 days OUT. A trip to morocco will do nothing for you
 

Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
My usual note of caution: etiasvisa.com is not an official EU site. It is a commercial site. I read through their bilateral visa waiver agreements article. They have a tendency to fill a lot of space with a lot of words.

I don't think that all of it is correct, in particular not their statements about procedures on how to extent your stay beyond 90 days. It is pure fantasy what they write: that you can first stay for your 90 days Schengen visa waiver period and then request an extension while you are already in the Schengen country. I am next to 100% certain that it doesn't work like this, not now and not after the introduction of ETIAS in 2023.
 
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C clearly

Moderator
Staff member
Past OR future Camino
Most years since 2012. Hoping now for 2022.
Schengen is 90 days in and then 90 days OUT. A trip to morocco will do nothing for you
No. You do not need to spend 90 days OUT, except of course if you want to gain 90 more days IN.

It is a rolling total of 180 days, of which you are allowed to have only 90 days inside the Schengen. You can come and go, but each time you must count up through the last 180 days, determine how many have been within the Schengen, and then see how many days remain of the allowed 90. A 2-day trip to Morocco will gain you 2 more days in Schengen.
 
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Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
https://www.mfat.govt.nz/assets/NZ-...GENEVA/Border-controls-in-Europe-Schengen.pdf

The document linked above has a bit of a weird title but it contains official government information about bilateral visa waiver agreements between New Zealand and a number of EU countries, and it works the same way for other countries who have such bilateral agreements. In contrast to what the website etiasvisa.info claims, there are no procedures to follow. These old bilateral agreements give you, as the national of one of the parties to the agreement, the right to just stay, for a certain time, in the country that is the other party to the bilateral agreement, and to move within the EU/Schengen area according to the principles enshrined in the old agreement and framed by later EU law, as described in the document.

The document has been issued by the New Zealand Ministry for Foreign Affairs & Trade.
 
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Past OR future Camino
Us:Camino Frances, 2015 Me:Catalan/Aragonese, 2019
https://www.mfat.govt.nz/assets/NZ-...GENEVA/Border-controls-in-Europe-Schengen.pdf

The document linked above has a bit of a weird title but it contains official government information about bilateral visa waiver agreements between New Zealand and a number of EU countries, and it works the same way for other countries who have such bilateral agreements. In contrast to what the website etiasvisa.info claims, there are no procedures to follow. These old bilateral agreements give you, as the national of one of the parties to the agreement, the right to just stay, for a certain time, in the country that is the other party to the bilateral agreement, and to move within the EU/Schengen area according to the principles enshrined in the old agreement and framed by later EU law, as described in the document.

The document has been issued by the New Zealand Ministry for Foreign Affairs & Trade.
I'm concerned about some things that are in that document. First, @pac1952 wants to stay more than 90 days in one country yet the document says he can stay only that long in any one country although he can stay longer in the Schengen zone by then visiting other countries.
However, New Zealand has bilateral visa waiver agreements with the below listed
individual countries in the Schengen area. These visa waiver agreements allow New
Zealanders to spend up to three months in the relevant country, without reference to
time spent in other Schengen area countries.
Next, without getting a visa to visit countries after the first 90 days there is no way to tell if a traveller upon leaving the zone spent (e.g.) 200 days in one particular country or possibly spent time in a Schengen country that didn't have a bilateral agreement.
 

Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
I'm concerned about some things that are in that document. First, @pac1952 wants to stay more than 90 days in one country yet the document says he can stay only that long in any one country although he can stay longer in the Schengen zone by then visiting other countries.
My main point is: in contrast to what the etiasvisa.info article writer states, there are no procedures for prolonging a stay once you are in the Schengen area. It just is.

@pac1952 is apparently from Australia so he has to look at bilateral visa waiver agreements that Australia has with other EU countries and what these agreements say. The NZ document describes the principles of these old agreements in the context of/parallel to current EU law.

I vaguely remember that I had a look at some of these old bilateral visa waiver agreements some time ago and most of them talked about a visa free period for a stay of 3 months within the EU country that is party to the bilateral agreement.

The NZ document points out the need to keep ATM slips and accommodation receipts and other proof of where you stayed for how long and that border and immigration officials in Schengen area countries may be unaware of these old bilateral agreements and may question a traveller's rights to stay visa-free in the Schengen area for longer than 3 months. They also advise to make sure that one's passport is stamped on entry and exit at the external borders of the Schengen area in any case. All these important aspects are not mentioned by the etiasvisa.info article writer. Also, I noticed with amusement the long lists of bilateral agreements on etiasvisa.info. They must have copy-pasted this from the EU Commission's website, LOL (The Commission had asked the members states some time ago to draw up lists of their bilateral visa waiver agreements, I guess they are preparing future EU legislation to knock some order into all this).
 
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Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
The NZ document describes all this much better and in fewer words than etiasvisa.info: You enter the Schengen area, you get your entry stamp, you stay in various countries within the Schengen area according to the rights that you have as the national of a country that has old bilateral visa waiver agreements. You keep receipts, slips etc to document your stay everywhere ... when and how long.

If you happen to be questioned by officials, for example because you hired a car and got caught in a police control when you drove just a tiny bit too fast on the Autobahn and you have to show your passport and they look at the Schengen entry stamp and it's been stamped into your passport more than 90 days ago, you simply explain your bilateral agreement rights to them. Same when you leave the Schengen area and get your exit stamp and they think that you are an overstayer, you simply explain your bilateral agreement rights to them and show your receipts if necessary to document that you stayed strictly within your rights.

Or you just apply for a long-term visa before you travel to Europe. It may save you hassle and worries and it is apparently not so hard to get a long-term visa. Especially when you are a national of Australia or New Zealand with their statistically low numbers of overstayers and illegal immigrants to the EU.
 
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Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances 2019
No Nothing. There was no paperwork, no questions just showing the Australian passport and always let through. I stayed in various countries including Spain, France, Germany, Portugal and many others. In 2016 I was away for 6 months and in 2019 nearly 5 months.
 

Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
So, instead of talking about all sorts of countries: @pac1952 is from Australia and wants to stay in Spain for more than 90 days. What exactly is the bilateral agreement between Australia and Spain? Spain is listed as a bilateral agreement partner of Australia on various websites including on gov.au but there are no further details. Does anyone know more or can point to a source with more information?

Spain themselves do not list any bilateral visa waiver agreements with Australia in the official EU list published in April 2019 here: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:52019XC0408(02)&from=EN . Did Spain unilaterally rescind such an agreement with Australia?

In the absence of any precise information, should @pac1952 simply hope that he will be waved through by passport control when he leaves Spain to return to Australia? That's still likely to happen in 2021 and possibly in 2022 but perhaps no longer in 2023 when the new automated EU Entry/Exit control system is in place.
 
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Anamiri

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
2016, 2017, 2019 Camino Frances
The NZ document describes all this much better and in fewer words than etiasvisa.info: You enter the Schengen area, you get your entry stamp, you stay in various countries within the Schengen area according to the rights that you have as the national of a country that has old bilateral visa waiver agreements. You keep receipts, slips etc to document your stay everywhere ... when and how long.

If you happen to be questioned by officials, for example because you hired a car and got caught in a police control when you drove just a tiny bit too fast on the Autobahn and you have to show your passport and they look at the Schengen entry stamp and it's been stamped into your passport more than 90 days ago, you simply explain your bilateral agreement rights to them. Same when you leave the Schengen area and get your exit stamp and they think that you are an overstayer, you simply explain your bilateral agreement rights to them and show your receipts if necessary to document that you stayed strictly within your rights.

Or you just apply for a long-term visa before you travel to Europe. It may save you hassle and worries and it is apparently not so hard to get a long-term visa. Especially when you are a national of Australia or New Zealand with their statistically low numbers of overstayers and illegal immigrants to the EU.
Thank you so much. I had been considering the Via Francigena (for 2023) but had discounted it as I thought we wouldn't have enough time, but with France and Italy allowing 90 days in each country that makes it legally doable. (not sure about the physical or financial aspects).
 
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OTH86

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
2017
I wonder... Considering the whims of Covid and it's variants and all our various governments, maybe it would be better to wait awhile before doing actual research on this topic. I certainly understand the desire to plan ahead (!), but sometimes too much planning too far ahead can cause confusion later... A lot can happen in the next 6-12-18-24 months 🤔
 

trecile

Camino Addict
Past OR future Camino
Francés (2016 & 2017), Norte (2018), Francés-Salvador-Norte (2019), Portuguese (2019)
I wonder... Considering the whims of Covid and it's variants and all our various governments, maybe it would be better to wait awhile before doing actual research on this topic. I certainly understand the desire to plan ahead (!), but sometimes too much planning too far ahead can cause confusion later... A lot can happen in the next 6-12-18-24 months 🤔
I agree. It's certainly fine to be aware of changes, but if you won't be leaving for several months wait until a few weeks before your departure to determine current rules.
 

pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
Thank you everyone for your comments. Prior to making my initial post I had concluded that the situation was far from straightforward, and the comments above certainly confirm this to me.

And yes, as @OTH86 and @trecile both wisely say, a lot can change. My correspondence earlier this year with the office of the Spanish Consul General in Melbourne advised:

Please note that visa application need to be submitted within 90 days prior departure.

We recommend you contact our office again when dates are closer as the requirement, fee and process could change.


It's becoming more likely that I will simply formally apply for a longer-term visa to stay in Spain beyond the 90 days. Then I won't have to worry about all the complexities of border stamps, receipts, somewhat opaque bi-lateral agreements, and all the rest, and can kick back and wander along the VDLP with impunity.

That's the plan anyway ... for those of us in Oz international travel is still a far distant dream ...
 

Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
It's becoming more likely that I will simply formally apply for a longer-term visa to stay in Spain beyond the 90 days. Then I won't have to worry about all the complexities of border stamps, receipts, somewhat opaque bi-lateral agreements, and all the rest, and can kick back and wander along the VDLP with impunity.
A wise decision, imho.

I expect that the topic of bilateral visa waiver agreements will be brought up again and I've dug a little deeper as to any such agreements between Spain and Australia.
  1. Such an agreement was concluded in 1961 in the form of an Exchange of Notes Constituting an Agreement between Australia and Spain in Relation to Visas and Visa Fees. London, 27 September 1961.
    Sources:
    Australian Treaty Series 1961 No 18 (English)
    United Nations Treaty Series Volume 426, p. 160 (Spanish)

  2. In the DeansFamily's 2017 thread Success rate for 6 month Spanish Visa application, a forum member reports that unfortunately, it would appear the earlier Spanish-Australian bilateral visa waiver agreement was terminated in 1978 [...] and the French Embassy in Canberra has emailed to me that "There is no bilateral agreement between Australia and France".

  3. No bilateral visa waiver agreements between Australia &Spain and Australia&France are listed in EUR-LEX in April 2019. EUR-LEX is an official EU website.
So I think that the bilateral visa waiver agreement avenue is closed for Australians who want to stay longer than 90 days in Spain and/or France, and an application for a long-term visa to the Spanish Consulate is the way to go.

It also confirms my impression that the etiasvisa.com website is nothing more than a conglomerate of bits and pieces copy-pasted from other websites and put together without decent own research. Which, as one can see, is easy to do when you have access to the internet and basic research skills.
 
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pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
Thanks @Kathar1na - I'm being drawn into an even deeper rabbit hole!!

I've now emailed the Spanish Consul General's office in Melbourne to attempt to seek clarification of the required visa type, and to seek any information they might have on the somewhat doubtful bi-lateral agreement arrangements.

But having now read @DeansFamily thread in detail and the hoops one has to jump through, given that I was only ever wanting to exceed the 90 days by a week or so, depending on what the Consul advises, I'll likely either cut my intensive Spanish language course back to something shorter, or give that idea away altogether.

I'm now only making these various posts "for the record", in case at some future time someone wants to grapple with the same issues. My basic question at the start of the post, that is, can I extend my visa for a short period, would seem to be "no, not easily". But it's been an interesting exercise all the same.
 

Doughnut NZ

From Aotearoa New Zealand
Past OR future Camino
2022
Thanks @Kathar1na - I'm being drawn into an even deeper rabbit hole!!

I've now emailed the Spanish Consul General's office in Melbourne to attempt to seek clarification of the required visa type, and to seek any information they might have on the somewhat doubtful bi-lateral agreement arrangements.

But having now read @DeansFamily thread in detail and the hoops one has to jump through, given that I was only ever wanting to exceed the 90 days by a week or so, depending on what the Consul advises, I'll likely either cut my intensive Spanish language course back to something shorter, or give that idea away altogether.

I'm now only making these various posts "for the record", in case at some future time someone wants to grapple with the same issues. My basic question at the start of the post, that is, can I extend my visa for a short period, would seem to be "no, not easily". But it's been an interesting exercise all the same.
Can you start your language course remotely (say the first two weeks) and then finish it off in person?
 

Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
a forum member reports that unfortunately, it would appear the earlier Spanish-Australian bilateral visa waiver agreement was terminated in 1978 [...]
And here is the text published by Spain in their Official Bulletin of the State where, on behalf of the Spanish Government, the agreement constituted by the Exchange of Notes of 1961 is terminated.

Madrid, 30 de junio de 1978.
Excelentísimo señor:
En uso de las facultades que confiere el punto 5 del Canje de notas entre los Gobiernos de España y Australia, instaurando un nuevo régimen de visados para los súbditos de ambos países, hecho en Londres el 27 de septiembre de 1961, vengo en denunciar en nombre del Gobierno español el acuerdo que constituye el referido Canje de Notas
El Canje de Notas denunciado cesó su vigencia el día 4 de octubre de 1978

There are other relevant texts in the BOE, and to me it looks like the part of the agreement that refers to Spanish travellers in Australia is maintained while the part of the agreement that refers to Australian travellers in Spain is replaced by references to current Spanish laws and regulations, i.e. presumably Schengen/EU visa law.

That was fun. :)
 
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Kathar1na

Member
Past OR future Camino
To Santiago and back (roads & paths; Tours; Francés; sea; roads & paths)
It is pure fantasy what they write: that you can first stay for your 90 days Schengen visa waiver period and then request an extension while you are already in the Schengen country. I am next to 100% certain that it doesn't work like this, not now and not after the introduction of ETIAS in 2023.
I'll have to eat my words but only a few. There are no such procedures now but such a procedure may be introduced in some EU countries who have such old bilateral visa waiver agreements. They've already made the law but it is not yet in force and I don't know when it will be. It is linked the introduction of the EU's Entry/Exit (EES) system which is scheduled for some time in 2022 or 2023.

Under this new system, all Schengen overstayers will be automatically identified and listed in the EES database.

See Regulation (EU) 2017/2226, article 60. It will apply to those bilateral agreements that are on the official list published by the EU Commission which, however, contains no Spain-Australia and no France-Australia bilateral agreements.

I am also posting this just "for the record".
 
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pac1952

Author of "An Impossible Dream"
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2015); Portuguese Camino, Coastal Route (2018); Via de la Plata (2022, hopefully)
And now my own final word, with thanks to everyone who has contributed ...

I received a speedy response from the Consulado General de España en Melbourne, who has advised:

In order to stay over a 90 day period in Spain you would need to apply for a national visa available on our website. Unfortunately, we do not have visas to extend a tourist stay as this period is regulated by the Schengen agreement and Australian nationals have a visa waiver for this initial stay throughout the Schengen area.

If you are studying over 90 days and are enrolled you may apply for a study visa that allows you to remain in Spain for a period of 180 days.


It was worth asking, even if the answer was not what I was looking for.

And if anyone's interested, assuming that I actually can get out of Australia as some stage in 2022, the plan will now be:

. a couple of weeks intensive Spanish language lessons on line from home here before departure (a new option that has only popped up in the last little while),
. three weeks intensive Spanish onsite in Salamanca
. then off to walk.

That puts me on the ground for 87 days, allowing for a bit of give and take. As @Kathar1na said, that was fun :) ...
 
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When you walk the Camino, and suddenly a pandemic appears
Create your own ad
€1,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
Past OR future Camino
Us:Camino Frances, 2015 Me:Catalan/Aragonese, 2019
There is a website where you can look up bilateral treaties between Australia and other countries.

http://www.austlii.edu.au/

In the search box enter (using the quotation marks):

"Australian Treaty List" bilateral country-name


Using the above I came upon the termination of an earlier agreement between Australia and Spain.
 
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Laura the Explora

New Member
Past OR future Camino
2019
When are you thinking of doing this precisely 'next year'? I am thinking of doing the same. I realise than since Brexit, I will be more reliant on my Aussie passport, and I was thinking of school in Malaga (I am already quite fluent, as lived in Barcelona as a 14 year old) and taking a quick trip to Marocco to re-vitalize my Schengen visa if the school can't help.
Be aware, you can’t simply leave Schengen and the 90 days starts over. It’s 90 days out of 180 regardless of how it’s split up.
 

Davybhoy

Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances (August 2019)
Portuguese (planned August 2020)
That's the plan anyway ... for those of us in Oz international travel is still a far distant dream ...
Ain't that the truth!!! I think I have a spreadsheet plan for every single Camino as soon as we are allowed to leave the country!! Its only a matter of which one to do first!
 

Trude

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Camino Francais 2013 Finnestere, Muxia 2013, 2017
Norte 2014, Francais, 2015, 2016, VDLP 2017
When are you thinking of doing this precisely 'next year'? I am thinking of doing the same. I realise than since Brexit, I will be more reliant on my Aussie passport, and I was thinking of school in Malaga (I am already quite fluent, as lived in Barcelona as a 14 year old) and taking a quick trip to Marocco to re-vitalize my Schengen visa if the school can't help.
I think it’s 90 days in and 90 days out so a quick trip to Morroco will not work.
 
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C clearly

Moderator
Staff member
Past OR future Camino
Most years since 2012. Hoping now for 2022.
I think it’s 90 days in and 90 days out so a quick trip to Morroco will not work.
No, it is not 90 days in and 90 days out, if you are talking about consecutive days, although you are correct that a quick to to Morocco will not help much.

As previously stated...
It is a rolling total of 180 days, of which you are allowed to have only 90 days inside the Schengen. You can come and go, but each time you must count up through the last 180 days, determine how many have been within the Schengen, and then see how many days remain of the allowed 90. A 2-day trip to Morocco will gain you 2 more days in Schengen.
 

TaraWalks

Peregrina without a skateboard
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances 2016 & 2018, planning for Le Puy 2019/2020ish and for some shorter Caminos stacked
I was planning on doing the 2nd half of the GR65, the chemin de St Jacques, in 2018but got food poisoning, then in 2019, but missed out due to a second bout with appendicitisthen missed out due to Covid, like most of us, i am planning a 6 month trip.....but who knows what will happen. A walk down the East coast of Australia might be the thing!
Thinking about that too!
 

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