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We don't try to do it on our own. We take lessons weekly and have also enrolled in school in Spain on some trips. We don't have contant exposure in the US where live so the progress is slow, but I find my Spanish has improved a lot over time and by leaps when I am immersed in a country where it is the primary language. I also try to read a Spanish newspaper each day which helps to reinforce vocabulary. Admittedly, it is harder than when I was younger.
Hi Alex. I identified totally with your post. After visiting Spain for ten years, and still only having the ability to converse in tourist Spanish, I've finally decided to make the effort to seriously learn before my next camino. For the first time, I've "enrolled" with a tutor, because I have never had the discipline to persevere solo with Babel and so on. We have probably had 10 sessions so far.... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
Hi Alex. I identified totally with your post. After visiting Spain for ten years, and still only having the ability to converse in tourist Spanish, I've finally decided to make the effort to seriously learn before my next camino. For the first time, I've "enrolled" with a tutor, because I have never had the discipline to persevere solo with Babel and so on. We have probably had 10 sessions so far.
Like you, I learned Latin for 5 years at school, and textbook French. I am extremely frustated that it should be so difficult to make rapid progress - I agree with JW, that it's an age thing. I find now that my ability to put coherent sentences together is pretty good, but when my tutor speaks to me normally, I go blank. It's very frustrating.
What I can say though, is that having a weekly lesson does impose a structure, and I think I will persevere.
It doesn’t get any easier as you get older (although learning English with the ‘help’ of the British Army probably gave you a more interesting vocabulary than you’ll find in a textbook!)... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
In a nutshell: Get a Spanish girlfriend... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
Well I did run your suggestion past Mrs Henrythedog, and unsurprisingly she was not sympathetic. To put it mildly.In a nutshell: Get a Spanish girlfriend
Better (healthier) to keep using Google translatorWell I did run your suggestion past Mrs Henrythedog, and unsurprisingly she was not sympathetic. To put it mildly.
Or boyfriend. But seriously, having a partner who speaks another language has been shown (how do academics come up with these research subjects) to be one of the most effective predictors of second language learners. Now for stage 2.In a nutshell: Get a Spanish girlfriend
Well I did run your suggestion past Mrs Henrythedog, and unsurprisingly she was not sympathetic. To put it mildly.
With this officially from a moderator: Maybe Mrs. Henrythedog will reconsiderhaving a partner who speaks another language has been shown (how do academics come up with these research subjects) to be one of the most effective predictors of second language learners.
So Ms henrythedog is going to become fluent in Spanish? Good for her.With this officially from a moderator: Maybe Mrs. Henrythedog will reconsider
[Seriously] My neurologist vividly recommended learning another language as a very effective way against age-forgetfulness.First the good news: although our ability to learn languages (or anything else) does deteriorate with age, it does so at nowhere near the rate that was once claimed. More recent studies suggest that language learning is not much more difficult for a 60+ year old than for a 20+ year old. An adult learner will very rarely achieve perfect pronunciation unless they are a natural mimic, like Peter Sellers, but we can get close. Not only that, learning a new language is one of the few activities that actually seems to slow dementia,.
Secondly, learning a language is like learning anything else: it relies on memory. Memory relies on association and repetition.
Thirdly, motivation is important.
Finally, the bad news: grammar is important.
I suggest you take a face to face class once a week. It will be fun, and you can practise, reinforce and consolidate what you learn.
Whilst I love her dearly, it is clear that you have never met Mrs HtD. She is of certain and fixed opinions on a wide range of topics.With this officially from a moderator: Maybe Mrs. Henrythedog will reconsider
Well, that would have been my father who learned all the dirty words from themIt doesn’t get any easier as you get older (although learning English with the ‘help’ of the British Army probably gave you a more interesting vocabulary than you’ll find in a textbook!)
Snap me to love it! (I am also lazy and writing lots of notes is not for meI used the free Language transfer course on the internet. I liked it a lot. It is not based on memorising but more on "insight". It builds on the many similarities between English and Spanish (many English words are "roman" in origin) The form is a dialogue between teacher and a not-.spanish speaking pupil. I used it many times while doing training walks for my caminos
Well, that would have been my father who learned all the dirty words from them. I myself was far too young to really be in danger there ... but thanks to the Brits we had the British Forces Broadcasting Service and I would listen to radio and watch Monty Python and Dr. Who without subtitles a lot. So it was less the drunken drill sergeant who helped me, but the likes of John Cleese and Eric Idle
LOL. I can so relate to your first post, @Arctic_Alex.what did I start here
My experience with all things Google (Navigation and Translation) is that an 80:20 rule applies:Better (healthier) to keep using Google translator
@jungleboy, I have to say that your post was inspirational.Let me respond from the point of view of someone who is currently (but not always) highly motivated in language learning, and who is married to a fanatical language learner …
So then, Mr. HtD...apparently you and Mrs. HtD have this one thing in common.Whilst I love her dearly, it is clear that you have never met Mrs HtD. She is of certain and fixed opinions on a wide range of topics.
In a mixed career I was briefly and unremarkably a management consultant.So then, Mr. HtD...apparently you and Mrs. HtD have this one thing in common.
My experience with all things Google (Navigation and Translation) is that an 80:20 rule applies:
80% of the time it's fine and does the job but 20% of the time it can land you in deep doodah!
The problem is that we often don't discover that until we're in that doodah.
I find SpanishDict to be a very useful (and more accurate) translator with a lot more learning potential.
Lots of different ways to learn. People are all different. Some learn faster by watching videos, others enrolling in a class, etc. My advice, commit yourself by spending a few bucks for an online intructor. Spending money on something, for me, is a great motivator! Good luck!! Peace.... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
Here's one to start with. There are Camino documentaries on the same site where the Spanish is spoken more slowly.https://www.rtve.es/play/videos/caminos-de-santiago-entre-el-cielo-y-la-tierra/pelicula-camino-santi/6729514/The topic of "learning Spanish" has a lot of reactions and commentaries.
I'm looking for stories and videos about the camino, written and spoken in Spanish.
Must be a very interesting, nice, pleasant and powerul tool, anyone having suggestions???
You should get that translated into Seminole.Personally, I like walking with audio books. If fact my neighbors call me, "Walks-With-Audio-Books."
Thanks for your well thought out reply...you just jump-started my stalled Spanish and Swedish efforts! Make it fun...so logical!Let me respond from the point of view of someone who is currently (but not always) highly motivated in language learning, and who is married to a fanatical language learner (@Wendy Werneth).
A word @Arctic_Alex used three times in the OP is motivation, and this is of course the key to everything. People often say about Wendy something like, 'She is so motivated to learn languages'. And she is.
But let's say you have a friend who likes watching movies. Perhaps every week they go to the cinema 1-2 times and watch several more movies at home. Would anyone say that they are 'motivated' to watch movies? No. And why not? Because in our minds, we categorise watching movies (or sports, or other such activities) as something that is inherently fun, while language learning is categorised as study, something that is not fun and therefore that requires motivation (the generally poor level of instruction in foreign languages at school is a large contributing factor in this, but that's a conversation for another day).
So the short answer is this: make language learning fun.
I asked Wendy to reply to this thread and she declined because she essentially does not understand not being motivated in language learning. It's inherently fun for her so she doesn't need to motivate herself, just like the person who likes watching movies doesn't need to be motivated to watch a new movie.
Making language learning fun is easier said than done, of course, and even more so at a beginner level when you can't access a lot of great material. But the key to it is essentially this: do what you like doing in your native language in your target language, and then it will be fun for you.
We are understandably focused on speaking in language learning. And of course, speaking well tends to be the end goal, and for good reason. But in your own language, you do far more input than output. And that's the second key: input (that is, listening/watching and reading). Input is how you unlock output in a foreign language -- i.e. it's how your learned your native language as a child. And, if you consume the right content for you, it can be fun simply to consume it, so that the learning happens naturally as a byproduct.
For example, I listen to history podcasts (e.g. Hardcore History, The History of Rome etc) for fun in English; therefore, it makes sense if my level is high enough that I would do the same in Italian, which is my current focus language (e.g. Storia d'Italia).
As a second example, I have always enjoyed reading fantasy-type books in English as a child and as an adult (e.g. Narnia, Tolkien's books, Harry Potter etc). So I am doing the same in Italian. In the last three months I have read 8.5 books written by the Italian adolescent fantasy author Licia Troisi. I read them in LingQ which is (among other things) essentially a tool to help you to read in a foreign language. I have read about 30 books by the Spanish adolescent fantasy author Laura Gallego in the last 12 years. Reading her most famous trilogy (Memórias de Idhún) was literally the biggest factor in allowing me to take the next step in Spanish. Reading is magic, as Wendy says.
These are just examples of the kinds of things you can do, according to your own interests. If you like music, listen to music in your target language. If you like soap operas, watch soap operas in your target language. Use tools like LingQ (and I'm sure there are others) to import books or content from YouTube or Netflix or wherever to assist with things like transcriptions/subtitles to allow for greater understanding. This content would ideally but not necessarily be aimed at native speakers, including at children for beginner learners.
The two themes I hear again and again when polyglots speak about their language learning success are to listen/read extensively, and to do it every day. Consuming content that you're interested in motivates you and gives you the grounding in the language that you need in order to be able to speak well.
In today's connected world, there is an enormous amount of content available to consume for major languages (including Spanish, obviously, as that's likely to be our focus here -- Notes in Spanish is one good example at multiple levels). The excuse of not being in the country where the language is spoken is, these days, just that.
I live in Portugal but with my current language focus, I am exposed to far, far more Italian than Portuguese on a daily basis, because I am choosing to surround myself with Italian through listening, reading and iTalki conversations. For example, I just watched a 25-minute video on Dante before writing this post, and when I finish this post I'm going to read the transcript of the video to enhance my understanding of what I watched and to pick up some new language along the way (listening and having access to the transcript is gold). I once took a course in English on Dante for fun, so watching this video in Italian was also fun.
In a nutshell: figure out how to consume lots of content in your target language in a way that is fun for you. That's when you reach the secret Wendy level where language learning is fun, motivation is inbuilt and when you wake up each morning you can't wait to get started on it.
I hope this helps.
P.S. Apps like duolingo have realised they can making language learning fun through gamification, but they are not actually very effective by themselves.
How do I overcome language barriers? Download Google translate. Type what I want to say and then read to the person (or show it to them.) Used with great success in the Netherlands, Spain and Germany in 2022. Buen Camino!... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
Another vote for Pimsleur. Years ago I was able to get the Pimsleur audiotapes from my local library (Latin American Spanish) and went through all the levels over and over and over. Lately, you can get Spanish via a monthly subscription on an app and European Spanish is available. It's a wonderful and enjoyable way to learn Spanish.i tried youtube and other free programs like duolingo but finally found the Pimsleur method was fantastic! I learned what i needed and ended up translating for other pilgrims even though I only did Pimsleur for two months! for me it's expensive and so it was motivating to make use of it because of the cost. stay clear of rosetta stone-not useful and is expensive!
Where do I find this method? I have tried Rosetta Sotne, Duolingo and Babble and find it starts so easy and all of a sudden it is too hard and then stop. I need something mroe as it is very scay to always rely on someone being kind enough to hear my English and I want to be better by the time I am in Primitivo route this October!i tried youtube and other free programs like duolingo but finally found the Pimsleur method was fantastic! I learned what i needed and ended up translating for other pilgrims even though I only did Pimsleur for two months! for me it's expensive and so it was motivating to make use of it because of the cost. stay clear of rosetta stone-not useful and is expensive!
Final tip - the old time phrasebooks with the typical situations described (introductions, numbering, at the train/bus station, at the restaurant, etc.) are still valuable because, Imho, they provide the correct grammatical phrasing + the vocab + some method of transliteration of the target language.
Here you can get a monthly subscription (with a free trial to start): https://www.pimsleur.com/Where do I find this method? I have tried Rosetta Sotne, Duolingo and Babble and find it starts so easy and all of a sudden it is too hard and then stop. I need something mroe as it is very scay to always rely on someone being kind enough to hear my English and I want to be better by the time I am in Primitivo route this October!
I took German in school in fifth grade. Other than a few words and counting numbers to up to ten, the only true sentence/phrase I remember was "Ich kann meine Gummischuhe nicht finden." It means I can't find my rubber shoes...very useful.I can only remember the first useful phrase ‘The elephant is a magnificent beast with ears like winnowing baskets’
This is an excellent phrase to start a small talk conversation at a boring party!I took German in school in fifth grade. Other than a few words and counting numbers to up to ten, the only true sentence/phrase I remember was "Ich kann meine Gummischuhe nicht finden." It means I can't find my rubber shoes...very useful.
I occasionally have met a number of German's on my Caminos on the trail or at a communal dinner. I always tell them I know some German and proceed to say that sentence...It's fun and always gives them a good laugh.This is an excellent phrase to start a small talk conversation at a boring party!
That is a tell that you are starting to be able to think in the language. It is a huge accomplishment. I get glimpses, but primarily dream in English. Thinking in the target language eliminates the translation layer (listening to Spanish, translating to English, translating to Spanish, speaking in Spanish and visa-versa).Did you ever attempt to learn a language and one night, started to dream in that language? It happened to me with Spanish…
Gronze.comThe topic of "learning Spanish" has a lot of reactions and commentaries.
I'm looking for stories and videos about the camino, written and spoken in Spanish.
Must be a very interesting, nice, pleasant and powerul tool, anyone having suggestions???
Gronze.com
Watch the news and a soap opera on your Spanish language TV channels. When alone in your car, listen to English talk radio and try to respond in Spanish. Have fun. It will be difficult because you don't have the vocabulary and the proper structure. But you'll get it. As far as the news and soap operas, it will help to become accustom to the speed. Warning! The soaps are addictive.... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
Soaps works for many, I know, but I hardly find any kind of series entertaining unfortunately. I need complexity in TV show else I get very negative emotions ;-) Only on rare occasions I do watch anything that comes in more than 3 episodes these days. Plus, we do not have "normal TV" ... no cable, no sat. All we got is the internet. I am sure there are free Spanish shows but I am just so hard to please. And that which could please me will be too complex language for me ... yet. So this, unfortunately, is a trick that has to be spared for the future.Watch the news and a soap opera on your Spanish language TV channels. When alone in your car, listen to English talk radio and try to respond in Spanish. Have fun. It will be difficult because you don't have the vocabulary and the proper structure. But you'll get it. As far as the news and soap operas, it will help to become accustom to the speed. Warning! The soaps are addictive.
Any particular soap operas that you'd recommend??Watch the news and a soap opera on your Spanish language TV channels. When alone in your car, listen to English talk radio and try to respond in Spanish. Have fun. It will be difficult because you don't have the vocabulary and the proper structure. But you'll get it. As far as the news and soap operas, it will help to become accustom to the speed. Warning! The soaps are addictive.
Soaps works for many, I know, but I hardly find any kind of series entertaining unfortunately. I need complexity in TV show else I get very negative emotions ;-) Only on rare occasions I do watch anything that comes in more than 3 episodes these days. Plus, we do not have "normal TV" ... no cable, no sat. All we got is the internet. I am sure there are free Spanish shows but I am just so hard to please. And that which could please me will be too complex language for me ... yet. So this, unfortunately, is a trick that has to be spared for the future.
But thanks anyway. Those little games as you mentioned replying to the radio, I actually say simple things in Spanish to my dogs.
This is exactly what I tell other people who try to learn a foreign language. However, or own life and use of time over here is really streamlined. As we run our own business, have several dogs, bees and buildings to maintain in harsh climate, we totally rationalised and optimised those tasks you mention to the absolute minimum. Those you listed at max add up to 5 minutes per day, not kidding. Except the cooking, but that time often has double use as we might discuss business then. That which remains is either heavy brain work or physically very demanding.Alex, if you consider your usual day, you will realise that you spend a lot of time doing things which do not require much mental effort, such as getting dressed, making your bed, preparing breakfast. hanging out clothes to dry, sorting laundry, ironing, cooking, etc, et.c. If you use this time to play tapes or CD's or have apps on your phone. Listen to Spanish, don't worry if you don't understand it. that is the way you learnt your mother tongue. Some day look at the book of what you have been listening to, and try to learn a little. This helped me. OK my Spanish is not yet great but I have learnt enough to get by nicely
Yes, I can communicate with people in some way usually. But in order to really learn a language, this would be a very slow path on the Camino. On the Camino I found myself so busy ... walking, talking to many people who do not speak Spanish, even communal dinners often end up in English ...How do I overcome language barriers? Download Google translate. Type what I want to say and then read to the person (or show it to them.) Used with great success in the Netherlands, Spain and Germany in 2022. Buen Camino!
Totally agree and when walking on the Camino I am not attached to my phone at all (other than for taking pictures of course).If you really want to learn spanish, turn-off your phone and go for it.
Interact with the locals, they love teaching spanish and helping the helpless peregrinos.
Above all , LISTEN, when your ears adjust to the silences between the words your understanding
will increase like a hokey stick ... ;-)
just my sunday two cents.
While I don't know Babbel, I have found that while both Rosetta Stone and Duolingo have some utility for vocabulary building, they don't really help you to speak the language you're learning. Prior to walking the VF from Turin to Rome last February, I went back to Pimsleur - half hour audio lessons focused on the spoken language. I was able to converse, call ahead for rooms, and function at a beginner high / intermediate low level on my walk, which was necessary since the wonderful Italians I met spoke neither English nor Spanish. As a former Spanish teacher, I always recommend Pimsleur.?
This is exactly what I tell other people who try to learn a foreign language. However, or own life and use of time over here is really streamlined. As we run our own business, have several dogs, bees and buildings to maintain in harsh climate, we totally rationalised and optimised those tasks you mention to the absolute minimum. Those you listed at max add up to 5 minutes per day, not kidding. Except the cooking, but that time often has double use as we might discuss business then. That which remains is either heavy brain work or physically very demanding.
So the only time that would be feasible is when on the rowing machine ... but that is the time that gives me peace and the sound of water
So in other words, in order to learn I really need to dedicate special time.
It would be different if I was a commuter. I guess car-time is good time for language exposure.
It would be exhausting if I would not give myself sacred spare time to actually do nothing! But that time is something I will not use for brain work of any kind.Take a step back…we all need some down time. If I had only 5 minutes free a day I would use the space for quiet time to clear my head. Time to chill on that rowing machine or a quiet walk. Some quiet is renewing. In the realm of your current life maybe your circumstances are not currently conducive to language learning? You state thatthere isnopressureon you to learn Spanish, butseemto have solittle free time! Your situation sounds exhausting.
I haven't.or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
Am bilingual. English/German. The recent revision of duolingo is better than the old program and you can use it for free. Currently I’m on 300+ days of daily Spanish practice on Duolingo after years of inconsistent Spanish practice. Also volunteered in Mexico for two years before the violence made it untenable for us to stay. Have better receptive skills than expressive language in Spanish.
There have been excellent suggestions, partcularly from @jungleboy, to learning another language. Of course motivation is key! Lots of materials may appeal to various interest levels. But in the end one may have reasons why they choose not to learn. No magic hear. ..one has to put in the effort…easier, of course, if living in that culture.
One of my pandemic projects was to learn Italian. I found some great online schools and have come a long way in the past couple of years. My favorite schools offer group classes, lessons geared to my particular level, the chance to record myself and get feedback from my teachers. Even more, I have found a community of learners like me and we learn from each other.... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
A YouTube channel that discusses the linguistics of Spanish in Iberian Spanish is Linguriosa (thanks @trecile). It's fun; the presenter is a young woman who plays various characters and has no problem haming it up (a moustache indicates she is now the RAE, the Royal Spanish Academy). Most videos are 10 to 15 minutes and you can turn on closed captioning.
My fingers slipped when looking for a video to double check if closed captioning was in English, Spanish or your choice and I accidentally picked this one, a short blooper video with LOTS of cussing I hadn't heard in other videos. This has CC in English but I am remembering choices for others. Use the channel link above to checkout her more typical videos.
Duo is fine for some basic conversation but it does not take the place of a program of study. I find it to be more of a learning game than a learning platform or a real teacher.I'm using DuoLingo, but a bit concerned that it uses South American Spanish.
Wondering if I should use a different App?
Thoughts anyone?
I LOVE LOVE LOVE your thoughtful response. Everything you have said is so true. Thank you for taking the time to put your thoughts into words, I’m sure your message will really help others take the first step toward learning a new language.Let me respond from the point of view of someone who is currently (but not always) highly motivated in language learning, and who is married to a fanatical language learner (@Wendy Werneth).
A word @Arctic_Alex used three times in the OP is motivation, and this is of course the key to everything. People often say about Wendy something like, 'She is so motivated to learn languages'. And she is.
But let's say you have a friend who likes watching movies. Perhaps every week they go to the cinema 1-2 times and watch several more movies at home. Would anyone say that they are 'motivated' to watch movies? No. And why not? Because in our minds, we categorise watching movies (or sports, or other such activities) as something that is inherently fun, while language learning is categorised as study, something that is not fun and therefore that requires motivation (the generally poor level of instruction in foreign languages at school is a large contributing factor in this, but that's a conversation for another day).
So the short answer is this: make language learning fun.
I asked Wendy to reply to this thread and she declined because she essentially does not understand not being motivated in language learning. It's inherently fun for her so she doesn't need to motivate herself, just like the person who likes watching movies doesn't need to be motivated to watch a new movie.
Making language learning fun is easier said than done, of course, and even more so at a beginner level when you can't access a lot of great material. But the key to it is essentially this: do what you like doing in your native language in your target language, and then it will be fun for you.
We are understandably focused on speaking in language learning. And of course, speaking well tends to be the end goal, and for good reason. But in your own language, you do far more input than output. And that's the second key: input (that is, listening/watching and reading). Input is how you unlock output in a foreign language -- i.e. it's how your learned your native language as a child. And, if you consume the right content for you, it can be fun simply to consume it, so that the learning happens naturally as a byproduct.
For example, I listen to history podcasts (e.g. Hardcore History, The History of Rome etc) for fun in English; therefore, it makes sense if my level is high enough that I would do the same in Italian, which is my current focus language (e.g. Storia d'Italia).
As a second example, I have always enjoyed reading fantasy-type books in English as a child and as an adult (e.g. Narnia, Tolkien's books, Harry Potter etc). So I am doing the same in Italian. In the last three months I have read 8.5 books written by the Italian adolescent fantasy author Licia Troisi. I read them in LingQ which is (among other things) essentially a tool to help you to read in a foreign language. I have read about 30 books by the Spanish adolescent fantasy author Laura Gallego in the last 12 years. Reading her most famous trilogy (Memórias de Idhún) was literally the biggest factor in allowing me to take the next step in Spanish. Reading is magic, as Wendy says.
These are just examples of the kinds of things you can do, according to your own interests. If you like music, listen to music in your target language. If you like soap operas, watch soap operas in your target language. Use tools like LingQ (and I'm sure there are others) to import books or content from YouTube or Netflix or wherever to assist with things like transcriptions/subtitles to allow for greater understanding. This content would ideally but not necessarily be aimed at native speakers, including at children for beginner learners.
The two themes I hear again and again when polyglots speak about their language learning success are to listen/read extensively, and to do it every day. Consuming content that you're interested in motivates you and gives you the grounding in the language that you need in order to be able to speak well.
In today's connected world, there is an enormous amount of content available to consume for major languages (including Spanish, obviously, as that's likely to be our focus here -- Notes in Spanish is one good example at multiple levels). The excuse of not being in the country where the language is spoken is, these days, just that.
I live in Portugal but with my current language focus, I am exposed to far, far more Italian than Portuguese on a daily basis, because I am choosing to surround myself with Italian through listening, reading and iTalki conversations. For example, I just watched a 25-minute video on Dante before writing this post, and when I finish this post I'm going to read the transcript of the video to enhance my understanding of what I watched and to pick up some new language along the way (listening and having access to the transcript is gold). I once took a course in English on Dante for fun, so watching this video in Italian was also fun.
In a nutshell: figure out how to consume lots of content in your target language in a way that is fun for you. That's when you reach the secret Wendy level where language learning is fun, motivation is inbuilt and when you wake up each morning you can't wait to get started on it.
I hope this helps.
P.S. Apps like duolingo have realised they can making language learning fun through gamification, but they are not actually very effective by themselves.
Duo is fine for some basic conversation but it does not take the place of a program of study. I find it to be more of a learning game than a learning platform or a real teacher.
I just posted a long reply to the original post with some suggestions. I’d be happy to chat more if you wanted more info.
Hello from England. I have been teaching myself to speak French for years and last week signed up for conversational French using the App italkI. The level can be set at your own pace and classes scheduled to suit, with many tutors available, choose someone who you feel you can relate to (the cost is also very reasonable). I really enjoyed my first session and feel that this commitment will help me gain confidence for the continuation of the Chemin Saint Jacques this year. Good luck with your Spanish learning.... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
Thank you!I LOVE LOVE LOVE your thoughtful response. Everything you have said is so true. Thank you for taking the time to put your thoughts into words, I’m sure your message will really help others take the first step toward learning a new language.
I gave her both in emoji form as we are on different continents right now while she is in Ethiopia learning Amharic! (And doing a bit of work on the side.)‘Reading is magic,’ Wendy says.” She is one smart woman! Give her a hug (or high-five) from me.
She is considered the best Italian fantasy author. The most noteworthy of her works are one series of five books (La Ragazza Drago) and a set of three trilogies set in the same world (the various Mondo Emerso books). I have read La Ragazza Drago and I’m now making my way through the Mondo Emerso books (I’ve almost finished the first book of the second trilogy). Each series features young female protagonists (all quite different from each other) and can be quite dark in their good-versus-evil way, especially the one I’m reading now. I’d recommend both if that sounds like your thing, maybe Mondo Emerso first. I’ve found they’re at a good level for me (B1-B2) before I tackle adult books.Thanks for the recommendation of the Italian author Licia Troisi, I’ll be sure to looks for some of their books (Italian is my current language project, too).
Fantastic, get started! I love Laura, she might be my favourite author in any language. I don’t know which ones you have but they are almost all great. Idhún is the most famous and rightly so, and I also loved the Guardianes de la Ciudadela trilogy, as well as many of the stand-alone books (in particular Finis Mundi, Il Libro de los Portales and Donde los Árboles Cantan). The first chapter of each of her books is available as a free download from her website, so anyone can take a look and see which ones appeal. For beginner/elementary learners, she has also written children’s books such as these two.I have several Laura Gallego novels on my bookshelf waiting for me to read them. Thanks for the reminder to do so!
Thanks for these tips! Whenever I get back to Spanish reading I’ll look them up.Most recently I’ve been enjoying the mystery series that begins with”El silencio de la ciudad blanca” by Eva García Sáenz de Urturi. Another book I’d recommend is El bosque de los cuatro vientos” by María Oruña—it takes place in Galicia.
Wow, Nick, Wendy is a real language "crackerjack" and you are not far.behind her.she is in Ethiopia learning Amharic! (And doing a bit of work on the side.)
German is useful in Turkey. Check out the Lycian Way.This thread makes me smile as I remember arriving in Madrid years ago with my poor Spanish and trying to use German in its place.
I wonder if they wear galoshes/rubber shoes in Turkey.German is useful in Turkey. Check out the Lycian Way.
Others have given you excellent advice above. I will also add that you may have inadvertently provided some good advice of your own. A lager before class may help the learning go down easy....... I also agree that at a lager stage...
... and a lager to many turns me into a pro-speaker in any language. Been there, but it does not last too long unfortunatelyOthers have given you excellent advice above. I will also add that you may have inadvertently provided some good advice of your own. A lager before class may help the learning go down easy....
just look up pimsleur and you'll find it. they have a free trial.Where do I find this method? I have tried Rosetta Sotne, Duolingo and Babble and find it starts so easy and all of a sudden it is too hard and then stop. I need something mroe as it is very scay to always rely on someone being kind enough to hear my English and I want to be better by the time I am in Primitivo route this October!
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