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Can we please talk kilometres, litres, Celsius, right-side driving, etc.?

Marbe2

Active member
Camino(s) past & future
2015 SJPD to Burgos
2017 Leon to Santiago
Pamplona to Santiago Mar. 2018
Burgos - SCDC (Oct 18)
Esperanto? English is the worlds current lingua franca.....:);)

I just joined the septuagenarian club and have, “most of the time” - learned to adapt to whatever the measurements are. Driving a non automatic in Europe, (driving on the left with clutch on the left is a challenge) translating metrics to “English”, ordering cold cuts in grams..whatever...it is part of the fun of the adventure...no complaints here!
 
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Lillamy

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
Going on my first in october, for two weeks. (2017)
What is “normal” or “proper” anyway? Apart from the UK, South Africa and Australia, there surely are other countries where you drive on the “wrong” side of the road. Sweden changed sides - can’t remember which year. Any Swedes on this forum who can tell us how difficult that was?"

Sweden changed to right-hand traffic in 1967. I wasn´t born yet so can´t speak of any personal experiences, but I´ve heard it went quite well actually. People were very against it beforehand (82% voted against it), but when it was a fact it went smoothly.
 

David Tallan

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances (1989 and 2016), Portugues - from Porto (2018)
This is great news for you then. Since velocity is distance divided by time (V=D/T} rearrange and T=D/V and this shows you that the greater the distance the more time you have to do it. ;)
I may be mistaken as it has been a few years since high school, but I thought direction had a role to play in velocity, not just distance and time. If you are just talking distance and time, you are talking speed rather than velocity. So if you head off in the wrong direction, it is really affecting your velocity.
 

Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
According to a Papal bull many centuries ago all people in Christian lands should ride on the left hand side of the road.
Let's put this commonly held belief to rest. Seen on websites, in books and even papers, which is really sad. Various versions: pope decreed that everyone / all pilgrims on the way to Rome / everyone in Rome / people on the Sant'Angelo bridge ... must walk / ride on their left hand side / on their right hand side.

There's no evidence whatsoever for any of this.

There are just about four lines in Dante's work that describe people walking over a bridge and say it's similar to the situation in the jubilee year 1300 when so many pilgrims came to Rome that arrangements were made for the Sant'Angelo bridge so that those who went towards the castle and St Peter's had to walk on one side and those going in the other direction had to walk on the other side of the bridge. It's impossible to conclude from these poetry lines where the left and the right lanes were in relation to the stream of people. It's not even certain that Dante went to Rome in 1300 and saw it with his own eyes.
 
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jmcarp

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances, 2013
Camino del Norte a Chimayó (USA), 2015
Camino Portugues, 2017
I think it's time to move on to a more important topic, like which digit group and decimal separator to use:
1 234 567.89 or 1,234,567.89 or 1.234.567,89 or 1'234'567.89. Or maybe something even more controversial, like shoe sizes. o_O
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
When hell freezes over: A clever university exam question

Bonus Exam Question: Is hell exothermic (gives off heat) or endothermic (absorbs heat)?

The answer by one student was so ‘profound’ that the professor shared it with colleagues, via the Internet, which is, of course, why we now have the pleasure of enjoying it.

Most of the students wrote proofs of their beliefs using Boyle’s Law (gas cools down when it expands and heats up when it is compressed) or some variant of that.

One student, however, wrote the following:

First, we need to know how the mass of hell is changing in time. So we need to know the rate at which souls are moving into hell and the rate at which they are leaving. I think that we can safely assume that once a soul gets to hell, it will not leave. Therefore, no souls are leaving.

As for how many souls are entering hell, let’s look at the different religions that exist in the world today.

Most/all of these religions state that if you are not a member of their religion, you will go to hell. Since there is more than one of these religions and since people do not belong to more than one religion, we can project that all souls go to hell.

With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number of souls in hell to increase exponentially.

Now, we look at the rate of change of the volume in hell, because Boyle’s Law states that, in order for the temperature and pressure in hell to stay the same, the volume of hell has to expand proportionately, as new souls are added.

This gives us three possibilities:

1. If hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls enter hell, then the temperature and pressure in hell will increase until all hell breaks loose.

2. If hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until hell freezes over.

3. Hell is expanding accordingly to the new number of souls.

So which is it?

If we accept the postulate given to me by Teresa during my freshman year that, “It will be a cold day in hell before I sleep with you”, and take into account the fact that I slept with her last night, then number 2 must be true, and thus I am sure that hell is exothermic and has already frozen over.

The corollary of this theory is that, since hell has frozen over, it follows that it is not accepting any more souls and is therefore, extinct … leaving only heaven, thereby proving the existence of a divine being which explains why, last night in my chamber, Teresa kept shouting all night: “Oh, my God!” Oh, my God!."

This student received the only A

This gives us all hope. And all in metrics, of course...:cool:
 
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Marcus-UK

Old Git
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Ingles (2016) Camino Portuguese (2017) Considering Invierno 2019
The measurement of liquids in the US is (to my way of thinking) totally stuffed up. They use a pint of 20 fluid ounces. The trouble is that their Fl.O. is smaller than those used in Britain (and previously in Aust/NZ). Why I have not the slightest idea - all I know is that an Imperial Gal is around 4.546 litres and a US Gal is about 3.96 litres.
The US gallon used to be a legal measurement in the UK. It is the UK spirit gallon. It is a smaller size than the UK standard Imperial gallon since it allows for evaporation of volatile liquids in spirits. i suspect that once the US colonies separated from Brittain, their equivalent weights and measures just simplified the three or four different legal gallon measure to one standard for everything.

In a similar way how many ounces (oz) in a pound (lb) could 14,15,16,20 etc. to allow for spoiling of stored meat. Recruiting posters for the Royal Navy used to list the daily allowances for food and beverages and include the measurement of a full "X many ounces to the pound."
And please do not expand this argument to include the US system of 400 degrees in a circle proposed as the Gradian measure some years ago!
 

Marcus-UK

Old Git
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Ingles (2016) Camino Portuguese (2017) Considering Invierno 2019
And by the way, the reason the US did not convert to metric in 1976 was that commercial interests prevailed upon politicians to squash the change, which proves that science doesn't have a chance against politics--especially when there are re-tooling costs to consider.
I started an electrical engineering apprenticeship in the 1970s' in the UK. The college component utilised the SI Metric measurement system. When fabricating brackets for mounting equipment we used Metric. When drilling holes for the bolts we used imperial inch measurements since that was the tooling that was available!
For many years the UK government tried to convert people to using metric weights for buying meat and groceries. Older people did not like this and many grocers and butchers kept both metric and imperial weighing scales. Local council weights and measure department would seize imperial weighing scales and prosecute shop owners for selling goods by imperial weight. To be legal butchers would weigh and price in Metric then put the meat on the imperial scales to tell the customer that his sausages weighed 1Ib 8oz. ie the optimum size for a toad in the hole for a family of four!
Sometime in the 2010s' the UK government relented on the Metric V Imperial argument and people are now allowed to use both systems. The driving force for this was for exports to countries who had not adopted the Metric system.
 

jmcarp

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances, 2013
Camino del Norte a Chimayó (USA), 2015
Camino Portugues, 2017
...
And please do not expand this argument to include the US system of 400 degrees in a circle proposed as the Gradian measure some years ago!
I'm in the US and I never heard of a 400-degree circle.

...
But let's hear it for GPS decimal degrees.
I personally don't like decimal degrees, but I guess it's more efficient for GPS to handle. Actually, when hiking and wayfinding with boots on the ground, I prefer to use UTM coordinates in concert with a map with UTM gridlines. Of course, that means I have to think in meters. ;)
 

jmcarp

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances, 2013
Camino del Norte a Chimayó (USA), 2015
Camino Portugues, 2017
@Marcus-UK, in my working life I was an architect, and occasionally worked on projects in other countries outside the US. I was forced to think metric and to learn the equivalent dimensions of common building materials in the metric world.
 
Camino(s) past & future
Northern Way (2017)
For all of us who have successfully sailed through both eras. Australia adopted metric (or then it was labelled decimal currency on 14 Feb 1966).
We can still comprehend easily the old and the ‘new’ (sort of, lol). Height is measured metric here too but I still think or picture in my mind feet and inches .

My point is : I’m sure it is taken on board as naturally as (you) understand a few different languages? I’m pretty sure you’re multi lingual?

Good thread though. Very interesting stuff coming through. I hadn’t realised Canada used kilometres! It must be confusing crossing the border to USA. ?

Buen Camino
Annie
I’m a Canuck and work in building engineering. Our building codes are metric. Our construction materials in imperial. The only place I know you can buy 10m rebar (10mm) in 9 foot lengths. Why? Because the great construction market to our south. And I know exactly how big a metre is and how long a kilometre is, but 100mm must be converted to 4” in my head before I can hold my thumb and forfinger the correct distance apart. And I have no idea if an apartment 100sq m is large or small-but I daydream about an apartment that is 1000sq ft. And our code calls for guardrails a minimum of 1070mm in height. Why 1070? Because it is 3’6”.

Confused yet?

I grew up with only metric in school which means I know how to calculate with metric, but when working with wood the measuring tape is most likely in feet and inches. And recipes books are mostly US publications, so anything cooking related I understand in imperial. Except quarts and ounces. And if I have to figure out how many teaspoons in a tablespoon, I convert to ml first.

All of this without really thinking about it. Too much.

I find myself working in a company that has many professionals from outside of North America and we can barely communicate. Or at least I can barely keep up.

And my students wonder why they get answers wrong when the number is right but there is no unit of measure given...
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2012, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011
I don't get it: Why don't we have common measurements? While the rest of the world is talking unified units, some places they measure all things outside the metric system.
If my memory serves me correctly, you are from one of the countries which I found most confusing when it comes to reference to distances. When I first walked in Norway, I was a couple of days walking from Oslo when I saw a mile post - yes, a mile post - indicating that I was five miles from Christiania. I wondered why anyone would move the mile post to the rather isolated spot where it was located.

Several days later, I met a young Norwegian serviceman - clearly trim, fit and active - who claimed to have only walked 3.5 miles that day. I had walked over 20 km, and I must have shown my surprise that he had only walked such a short distance. He had the courtesy to explain that a Norse mile is just a little longer than any other mile. It all became clear!

I wonder, @alexwalker, if you are proposing that the Scandinavian countries give up their miles with the same enthusiasm that you are proposing for the rest of us?
 
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Camino(s) past & future
I intend to leave the UK the day Before Brexit and walkMarch -April 2019 Camino Frances
What word do those who measure distance in kilometres use when they talk ‘mileage’?
We have that covered in the UK, petrol is purchased by the Litre as£1.30 sounds a lot better than £ 5.90 per gallon ,less is better. When it comes to consumption we use miles per gallon because 50mpg sounds better than 5.65l per 100km. Higher is better.
 
Camino(s) past & future
cycled from Pamplona Sep 2015;Frances, walked from St Jean 2017.
It was a little bit more complicated. It's all over the internet, including NASA's initial report by the Mars Climate Orbiter Mishap Investigation Board, so easy to read up on. Yes, it was a problem of data that were used in English units (as they term it) instead of metric units in one particular software application. So also a story of garbage in, garbage out, of Lockheed and NASA, of quite complicated stuff. The units in questions were pound force seconds (lbs-s) vs Newton seconds (N-s), btw.

I was particularly intrigued by your comment that "one smart man (yes a man) used 50 mile (or 80 km) above the Martian surface". Maybe I'm misinterpreting the comment. Is it as in man vs alien or man vs machine or man vs woman? It happened in 1999. Women scientists, women software developers, women project managers weren't unheard of by that time. And the first woman on a spaceflight was Valentina Tereshkova in 1963.
Thanks for the explanation. The use of "pound force units" is even more complicated, still this is the mob that took us to the moon so they knew something. As for who "male" or "female", well it was a bit tongue in cheek but from my limited knowledge of female scientists - they double check & cross reference. Oh and yes being someone born before 1950 I know who Valentina Tereshkova is - she will be 82 on March 6th.
 
Camino(s) past & future
cycled from Pamplona Sep 2015;Frances, walked from St Jean 2017.
I'm in the US and I never heard of a 400-degree circle.
;)
Hola @jmcarp . Well if you were a pilot during the mid-1970's it was being discussed as a means of increasing accuracy and also to make bearings (magnetic ones that is) easier to understand - N 000/400; E 100; S 200; W 300.
From what I can recall it never really took wings (so to speak) and when B747's came along with their "inertial reference" navigation systems and then during the 1980's GPS it just died. In fact until the above post I had not heard it mentioned for 20/30 years. Cheers
 
Camino(s) past & future
cycled from Pamplona Sep 2015;Frances, walked from St Jean 2017.
I’m a Canuck and work in building engineering. Our building codes are metric. Our construction materials in imperial. The only place I know you can buy 10m rebar (10mm) in 9 foot lengths. Why? Because the great construction market to our south. ..
I find myself working in a company that has many professionals from outside of North America and we can barely communicate. Or at least I can barely keep up.

And my students wonder why they get answers wrong when the number is right but there is no unit of measure given...
WE overcame the measurement issue by all but banning the import of tape measures that read in anything but metric units. I think it was only in the 1990's with tapes made in Taiwan (for both the US & Australian markets) that we had tapes the measured in both systems. It was a bugger if you were colour blind as the US were green and the Metric Red.
Of course you live in the country where one of the most famous aviation "incidents" occurred because the aircraft refueler mis-managed his Kilos and Pounds. By shear luck and great airmanship that the 70 people survived.Cheers
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
If my memory serves me correctly, you are from one of the countries which I found most confusing when it comes to reference to distances. When I first walked in Norway, I was a couple of days walking from Oslo when I saw a mile post - yes, a mile post - indicating that I was five miles from Christiania. I wondered why anyone would move the mile post to the rather isolated spot where it was located.

Several days later, I met a young Norwegian serviceman - clearly trim, fit and active - who claimed to have only walked 3.5 miles that day. I had walked over 20 km, and I must have shown my surprise that he had only walked such a short distance. He had the courtesy to explain that a Norse mile is just a little longer than any other mile. It all became clear!

I wonder, @alexwalker, if you are proposing that the Scandinavian countries give up their miles with the same enthusiasm that you are proposing for the rest of us?
One mile=10 kms. Metric system again. :);):cool:
 

Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
He had the courtesy to explain that a Norse mile is just a little longer than any other mile. It all became clear!
How interesting! I had no idea that the Scandinavian mile is in use in Norway and Sweden. But, as @alexwalker explained, they did the sensible thing: when the metric system was introduced, which is essentially just another step of many standardisation steps throughout the centuries, their mile was equivalent to roughly 11.3 km in Norway and 10.7 km in Sweden. So they decided that 1 mile would mean 10 kilometres from now on.

Similar to what happened in France and Germany and many other regions where the old pound (livre or Pfund) was set to 500 g when they switched to metric units while it had been equivalent to various weights ranging between 400 g and 700 g, or the Zentner, similar to the English hundredweight, was set to 100 (new) Pfund. Similar for Maß (beer drinkers may know what it means). The old denominations were kept and are still in use today, just with a somewhat different definition. And that's not something very revolutionary if one looks a bit further into the past history of standardisation.

So, we showed the way! One English pound will be 500 g, one pint will be 500 ml (= half a litre), and one English mile will be 1.5 km or 2 km which is even better. Easy peasy. Go on, courage, if we could do it you can do it, too. 🙃
 
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Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
Mentioning the Bavarian Maß for ordering beer reminded me of the fact that the quantity of beer you get can vary significantly from region to region when you say the equivalent of "a beer, please" in the local language. And led me to a website that says that Spaniards hardly ever order "una cerveza, por favor“ but use a multitude of other expressions like caña, copa, tuba, doble and, again, the quantity of beer you get may vary depending on the town or region. True?
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2012, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011
One mile=10 kms. Metric system again. :);):cool:
Indeed, but it fails the fundamental point you made in starting this discussion that we needed common measurements. In this case a couple of countries cause confusion by having non-common measures within a metric system. You can choose one or the other but clearly not both while we have oddities like the Scandinavian mile.
 

Camino Chris

One step forward...
Camino(s) past & future
Frances 2015;
Norte/Primitivo 2016;
Frances 2017;
Le Puy 2018;
Portuguese/FishermanTr. 2019
This is the reason my head never stops spinning on this thread! o_O I probably should give up reading as I only go deeper into the well of confusion! :oops:
 

William Marques

Moderator
Staff member
Pot, jug, pint, schooner, midi, seven, pony, stubby. Even in one country these can mean different measures from state to state!

The old John O'Grady's book "It's your Shout Mate" relates how back in the 70s the measures were different from town/brewery to town/brewery.
 

jmcarp

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances, 2013
Camino del Norte a Chimayó (USA), 2015
Camino Portugues, 2017
Hola @jmcarp . Well if you were a pilot during the mid-1970's it was being discussed as a means of increasing accuracy and also to make bearings (magnetic ones that is) easier to understand - N 000/400; E 100; S 200; W 300.
From what I can recall it never really took wings (so to speak) and when B747's came along with their "inertial reference" navigation systems and then during the 1980's GPS it just died. In fact until the above post I had not heard it mentioned for 20/30 years. Cheers
That sounds good on paper, but some "great" ideas deserve a quiet death. But you bring up an issue in navigation that has always been troublesome: true north vs magnetic north (and the southern hemisphere equivalents).
 

oursonpolaire

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
2002, Toulouse/Aragon 2005, Cami S Jaume/Aragon 2007/9, Mont Saint Michel/Norte/Vadiniense 2011, Norte/Primitivo 2013, Norte/Primitivo 2014. Norte 2015, Cami S Jaume/Castellano-Aragonese 2016
Almost 4 liters - 3.78541 liters in a gallon, but close enough government work. 😂
More realistically, given that it is eastern Ontario, a close enough to be a fair measurement when siphoning someone else's gas from their tank.
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
I'am not perfect, but I'm always myself!!!
...Driving a non automatic in Europe, (driving on the left with clutch on the left is a challenge) translating metrics to “English”, ordering cold cuts in grams..whatever...it is part of the fun of the adventure...no complaints here!
Coming from Europe and used to drive left hand steering wheel cars with gears I tried similar 20 years ago in Sydney, Oz. Driving automatic right hand rent-a-car it went quite well actually (or is it just my imagination and memory gap???) until the first roundabout...

Thank you Australia but never again :D
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2012, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011
When it comes to consumption we use miles per gallon because 50mpg sounds better than 5.65l per 100km. Higher is better.
I see it as one of the great wonders of the human mind that it is able to cope with what would clearly be a counter-intuitive construct like miles per gallon. When lower fuel consumption is better, one might expect that reduced fuel consumption would be achieved by lower numbers. Yet we remain perfectly comfortable with a system where the higher numbers are better.

I was taught physics in an odd combination of FPS and CGS units as Australia was making the transition from 'imperial' measures and currency to a 'decimal' system and SI units. It took some time, but I now happily don't translate my fuel consumption from li/100km back to mpg.

Unfortunately, the OP didn't distinguish between the advantages of a 'metric' system for how we count, and the SI system for what we measure. Conflating the two is almost as confusing, particularly when there are so many non-metric and non-SI systems around that the rest of us quite clearly cope with without becoming befuddled.

If it were otherwise, we wouldn't measure our fuel consumption in li/100km - a mix of SI and non-SI measures, or our speed in kph (or km/hr) - a mix of a metric and non-metric counting systems.
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
Unfortunately, the OP didn't distinguish between the advantages of a 'metric' system for how we count, and the SI system for what we measure.
Count your fingers. Metric.
Count your toes. Metric.

It all begins there. If we had 8, we would have a octogonal system. if we had 16, we would have a hexagonal system. :):cool:

Measures are just a prolonging of the metric system. But those Wiki articles describe that nicely. ;)

Edit: The words "'imperial' measures", are sending bad thoughts to me... Better go metric.:)
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2012, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011
For clarification:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_system

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_of_measurement

and I quoute from the latter:

"A multitude of systems of units used to be very common. Now there is a global standard, the International System of Units (SI), the modern form of the metric system. "

"Metrication is complete or nearly complete in almost all countries. US customary units are heavily used in the United States and to some degree in Liberia. "

Cool. ;):cool:
This is useful as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_System_of_Units .

I still think that you haven't made a clear distinction between the alleged advantages of using a decimal system of counting and calculation in preference to a fractional system, and what is generally a coherence that the SI system of units achieves. I agree with the latter, not the former. And whether we drive on the right or left is an arbitrary matter that seems largely the result of convention, not logic or science.
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2012, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011
Count your fingers. Metric.
Count your toes. Metric.
I can (almost) just as easily count in binary on my fingers (and toes). It is not a good argument when it is so easy to establish such clear contradictions.

I would say:
count to 10 on your fingers - base 10 mathematics,
count to 31 on your fingers - base 2 mathematics.
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
This is useful as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_System_of_Units .

I still think that you haven't made a clear distinction between the alleged advantages of using a decimal system of counting and calculation in preference to a fractional system, and what is generally a coherence that the SI system of units achieves. I agree with the latter, not the former. And whether we drive on the right or left is an arbitrary matter that seems largely the result of convention, not logic or science.
Look at children learning to count: The begin by using fingers. Decimal system :) .

But: instead of debating, I shall choose to lean on the decisions of most governments going for metric, with the exceptions of USA, Liberia, Burma (with its completely own units), and GB (there may be other odd countries that I haven't visited or heard about). And a Mile is 10 kms.:)
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
I can (almost) just as easily count in binary on my fingers (and toes). It is not a good argument when it is so easy to establish such clear contradictions.

I would say:
count to 10 on your fingers - base 10 mathematics,
count to 31 on your fingers - base 2 mathematics.
Of course, But then, you (and I, as I am holding an engineering degree in computer science for 40+ years), can easily go for binary counting. But the rest of the world will prefer finger counting before electrical current on/off digits, and go metric, :)

The End.
 
Camino(s) past & future
Le Puy - Santiago(2007-2012), Via Gebennensis (2013)
Geneve - Le Puy - Santiago (2017)
Indeed, but it fails the fundamental point you made in starting this discussion that we needed common measurements. In this case a couple of countries cause confusion by having non-common measures within a metric system. You can choose one or the other but clearly not both while we have oddities like the Scandinavian mile.
Actually, in Norway we talk about one mil, not mile. A mil is not really a measurement, but just a another way of saying 10 km. Like, say 1000 grams are 1 kg.
 
Camino(s) past & future
cycled from Pamplona Sep 2015;Frances, walked from St Jean 2017.
Coming from Europe and used to drive left hand steering wheel cars with gears I tried similar 20 years ago in Sydney, Oz. Driving automatic right hand rent-a-car it went quite well actually (or is it just my imagination and memory gap???) until the first roundabout...

Thank you Australia but never again :D
I had a similar experience in France back in 2017. Luckily when picking up the car I took up the offer of an automatic car and one with a sat-nav system. Another plus was that the sat-nav voice was in English. As for adjusting - well when everyone else is driving on the right hand side of the road you just "follow the leader". Cheers
 

Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
Look at children learning to count: The begin by using fingers. Decimal system :) .
You do realise that learning to count to ten by using your fingers the way you are most familiar with is not a natural thing 🙂? Kids have to be taught to do so. Also, we are having a rather euro-centric discussion as in some parts of the world, Asia for example I think, they are taught to count to 12 by using the fingers of a single hand: The thumb acts as a pointer touching the three finger bones of each of the fingers, starting with the outermost bone of the little finger.

And that all this is not as natural as it seems to us is probably also the reason why it took us thousands of years before we cottoned on to the decimal system. Thanks to some people who developed it in India and thanks to some other people who transmitted it to us via the Arab world and via Spain.

Ouf, another feeble connection to the purpose of the forum - pilgrimage - found: we learnt about the decimal system and its advantages sometimes during the Middle Ages, thanks to cultural exchange, not only but also thanks to pilgrims but more so thanks to clerical scholars and tradespeople.
 
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Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
BTW, I totally agree with @alexwalker: distances are to be measured in metres, with special terms not only for 10 to the power of 3, 6, etc and -3, -6 etc but also -2, -1 or 4. 🙃

See Metric prefix for all the terms that are already in common use, among them nanometre, decimetre, hectometre ...
 
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William Marques

Moderator
Staff member
I am not sure that any measurement is more easily identifiable than another. A pint of beer - a litre of beer, a mile - a kilometre., a pound of tomatoes - a kilogram of tomatoes, these are all instantly identifiable to those who are used to using a particular system. Metric units may be best for science and calculation but in everyday life whatever you call any unit of measurement does not matter.
 

Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
In the discussion, I think, two things get mixed up: a decimal system and a common system (for counting, measuring etc.)

Think of the decimalisation of the pound when 1 pound was all of a sudden 100 pence vs the introduction of the euro when 166.386 pesetas were all of a sudden 1 euro.
 
Camino(s) past & future
cycled from Pamplona Sep 2015;Frances, walked from St Jean 2017.
Think of the decimalisation of the pound when 1 pound was all of a sudden 100 pence vs the introduction of the euro when 166.386 pesetas were all of a sudden 1 euro.
Yes the changes from "pesetas" to Euros must have been a real cultural shock. Oh to have been in Spain on the cold day in January (1998?? or '99). Everybody lining up at the bank to exchange the notes that had been hidden since Franco's time!!
 

Bradypus

Antediluvian
Camino(s) past & future
Too many and too often!
Yes the changes from "pesetas" to Euros must have been a real cultural shock. Oh to have been in Spain on the cold day in January (1998?? or '99). Everybody lining up at the bank to exchange the notes that had been hidden since Franco's time!!
I found my bill listed in both euros and pesetas in A Coruna in 2016 - 14 years after the switch to euros. Posted about it at the time in a thread which took off in a very similar direction to this one :)

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/is-the-peseta-still-alive-and-well.38728/#post-383483
 

Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
Yes the changes from "pesetas" to Euros must have been a real cultural shock. Oh to have been in Spain on the cold day in January (1998?? or '99). Everybody lining up at the bank to exchange the notes that had been hidden since Franco's time!!
I wasn't in Spain but I was in the eurozone and, frankly, I now barely remember a thing about it. Just some excitement when holding the small starter kit in my hand for the first time, a small plastic bag with shiny shiny coins, about 20 € in total. You could get it at a bank already in December but didn't have to get it at all. And then, for a while, the excitement of finding a "foreign" euro coin in one's purse, ie one where the national face showed that it had been minted for another country.

I see that the people in Spain have until the end of 2020 to exchange their peseta notes for euro notes so there was no need to queue at the bank on a cold day in January. During the first few months, we could pay in cash with either national currency or euros anyway.
 
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TerryB

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Norte/Primitivo (April/May) 2009: Norte/Primitivo (parts) (April/May) 2010: Inglés (May) 2011: Primitivo (April/May) 2012: Norte / Camino de La Reina (April/May) 2013: Camino del Mar / Inglés (May/June) 2015
My fingers aren't the youngest anymore and started already to hurt when I had counted to 8. In fact, I needed my other hand to keep my binary 0s and 1s in place. :)

As to the traditional method of counting on fingers: apparently, Americans usually start counting with the index finger as the number 1 while we in Continental Europe tend to start with the thumb as the number 1.
We spent a number of years working alongside the Wichi Amerindian people in Northern Argentina. Their system of counting (shared by other groups including the Guarani of Paraguay) included the numbers 1- 4 only. Wayhatha (one), Takfwas (two) Najit-tufwai eth (three) Tufwantes ihi (four). They could use "Okwe wayhatha" (one handful). Anything more was "los" (lots). The local Spanish speakers still reckoned in leagues.
After a few years one finds oneself thinking like it, rather than having to do a mental translation!
Maybe in years to come even we Brits will change?:rolleyes:

Blessings
Tio Tel
 

Marcus-UK

Old Git
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Ingles (2016) Camino Portuguese (2017) Considering Invierno 2019
I'm in the US and I never heard of a 400-degree circle.
The gradian has 400 degrees in a revolution. Actually a French innovation in the 18th C. I was told at college it was an Americanism. But we did not have Wikipedia then:-} I had a Grad option on my Rockwell calculator and asked my Math tutor what it was.

For military purposes there are 6400 Mils in a circle. I have used this for calling down artillery support in my youth.

See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gradian

Also quoting Wikipedia "In the 1970s and 1980s most scientific calculators offered the grad as well as radians and degrees for their trigonometric functions.[7] In the 2010s some scientific calculators lack support for gradians.[8] "
 
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances, 2015
Also quoting Wikipedia "In the 1970s and 1980s most scientific calculators offered the grad as well as radians and degrees for their trigonometric functions.[7] In the 2010s some scientific calculators lack support for gradians.[8] "
Back in my college days scientific calculators cost about as much as 3 months room and board at the college dorms. One maker produced a bunch with an error and in a national magazine ad was selling them as a great deal and flawless except that you had to remember what the sine (or was it cosine?) of 0 degrees was.
 

Bradypus

Antediluvian
Camino(s) past & future
Too many and too often!
Back in my college days scientific calculators cost about as much as 3 months room and board at the college dorms. One maker produced a bunch with an error and in a national magazine ad was selling them as a great deal and flawless except that you had to remember what the sine (or was it cosine?) of 0 degrees was.
Walking the Via Francigena in Italy I only needed a compass on one occasion. In the middle of a featureless stretch of rice paddy in the Po valley on a damp day with 100% cloud cover. Took me quite some time to work out that a recent update to my smartphone operating system had a bug: the compass reading was 180 degrees out and North now read as South. I was not happy as anyone who was within 100 metres or so and could understand very colloquial English would have understood :mad:;)
 

Francois de Meillon

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances Part of (2018)
Primitivo (2019)
Finistere (2019)
I don't get it: Why don't we have common measurements? While the rest of the world is talking unified units, some places they measure all things outside the metric system.

Can't these countries please start measuring things in proper units (metric system), drive on the right side of the road, and respect the majority of the sane world?

This creates a lot of problems: how far is it from one village to the next, how much water do you need, how hot is it? I do not understand these measures, and I am in the vast majority of the world population. And still I have to translate our logical metric system to those who have no clue.

F.ex. Water freezes at 0 Celsius; 32 F. What is 32?

30F sounds hot to me. But it is 2 below the freezing point of water, so a little chilly... Snow in the air...

One km. is 1000 metres. 1 step is almost 1 metre. What could be difficult with that?
And how long is a foot? what is an inch? 2.54 cm. What does it MEAN? It is certainly within the metric system... What is an Oz???

In most countries, only drunk drivers drive on the left side of the road. In f.ex. England, I need a few pints before I can drive safely.

An expensive satellite was lost in a cooperation between USA and Europe because US course calculations were done in inches (!?) sic) instead of proper centrimetres, and the next course calculation done by the US went pretty wrong...

We have 10 fingers. 10 toes. the basics of the metric system. Please join us.

Please get it right, leftists...;)
Great opportunity to broaden your general knowledge. 🤔
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2012, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011
Actually, in Norway we talk about one mil, not mile. A mil is not really a measurement, but just a another way of saying 10 km. Like, say 1000 grams are 1 kg.
Indeed, and my memory might not be serving me well here, but when it was discussed in English, the word 'mile' was what I heard. Perhaps I wasn't well attuned to the nuance at that time. Last year, walking in Sweden, the couple of times I heard the word used, it sounded more like 'meal' than either 'mil' or 'mile', but it was clear in the context that a distance was being discussed.
 

David Tallan

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances (1989 and 2016), Portugues - from Porto (2018)
Count your fingers. Metric.
Count your toes. Metric.

It all begins there. If we had 8, we would have a octogonal system. if we had 16, we would have a hexagonal system. :):cool:

Measures are just a prolonging of the metric system. But those Wiki articles describe that nicely. ;)

Edit: The words "'imperial' measures", are sending bad thoughts to me... Better go metric.:)
We have two eyes, two ears, two arms, two legs. Everything should be in binary.

Or count your fingers AND toes. Units of 20 (which have the additional advantage of being evenly divisible by four, in line units of ten).

Our decimal system is arbitrary.
 

David Tallan

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances (1989 and 2016), Portugues - from Porto (2018)
Of course, But then, you (and I, as I am holding an engineering degree in computer science for 40+ years), can easily go for binary counting. But the rest of the world will prefer finger counting before electrical current on/off digits, and go metric, :)

The End.
They prefer finger counting because that is what they are taught as children. They are taught that as children because we use the base 10 Indo-Arabic numbering system. That's the root of the "natural" preference for counting by tens. We prefer finger counting because we count by tens, not the other way round.

I'm not arguing that metric doesn't make sense. I'm just arguing that it isn't based in our biology. It is based in our culture and the numeric system we use. Other cultures used different numeric systems and had different measures.
 

sunwanderer

Member
Camino(s) past & future
SJPdP to Santiago
Sep/Oct 2015
Count your fingers. Metric.
Count your toes. Metric.
It all begins there. If we had 8, we would have a octogonal system. if we had 16, we would have a hexagonal system. :):cool:
We have 10 fingers and 10 toes, but we now have a hexagonal hexadecimal system anyway.
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
We have 10 fingers and 10 toes, but we now have a hexagonal hexadecimal system anyway.
Correct. One of my metric fingers slipped here.:)
 

nycwalking

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
CF: (2001, 2002, 2004, 2014). Hospitalera: 2002, Ponferrada. 2004, Rabanal del Camino.
This afternoon, I could have purchased a “dry liter” of tomatoes or a pint.

I chose the pint.

That “dry” business: huh!
 

oursonpolaire

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
2002, Toulouse/Aragon 2005, Cami S Jaume/Aragon 2007/9, Mont Saint Michel/Norte/Vadiniense 2011, Norte/Primitivo 2013, Norte/Primitivo 2014. Norte 2015, Cami S Jaume/Castellano-Aragonese 2016
A Canadian government lawyer of my acquaintance was given a measuring wheel by her great-uncle when she qualified as a notary (Québec version of a solicitor). It turns out that there were three varieties of arpent (sort of an acre), royal, Canadian, and a third whose name I cannot recall, and parcels of land were often described as one in a deed when it had been surveyed as another. The wheel with its three gears was a way of verifying which arpent and perch had been used. She whipped it out when she was auditing a sale of government surplus land, much to the dismay of the developer present.

We perhaps should be grateful that the Spanish ceased using Spanish leagues (4.18km) and Arabic miles (1.4km).

I stand by my long-held position that kilometre in Spain is a subjective measure; some are very short, but some are very long indeed.
 

wtrimble

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
(2018)
The globe having 360 degrees is geometrical, not metric. A circle at any latitude has 360 degrees as do all circles.
The angle from the sun to the horizon can be used to determine your latitude, i.e. how far you are north or south of the equator. Your latitude is measured in 0 to 90 degrees north or south of the equator. The latitude is 0 at the equator and 90 degrees N is the north pole. Lines of latitude are parallel and do not intersect.
In order to find your longitude, you need an accurate clock set to GMT and a chart of the sunrise time for that day of the year in Greenwich, England. Hence, your longitude ends up in degrees, minutes and seconds. Lines of longitude are not parallel and converge to meet at the poles. Think of how a shadow would fall on a sphere when lighted from a source across the room.
Yeah, this measurement stuff is confusing, isn't it.
 

wtrimble

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
(2018)
The official measure of temperature in the metric system is Kelvin. 0 Kelvin is about -273 degrees Celcius. It is the temperature where all molecular motion in a perfect crystal stops. Zero Kelvin is sometimes referred to as "absolute zero".
A temperature difference of 1 K is the same as 1 degree Celcius.
 

Kathar1na

Member
Camino(s) past & future
To Santiago (a combination of own way, voie de Tours and Camino Frances)
The globe having 360 degrees is geometrical, not metric. [...] In order to find your longitude, you need an accurate clock set to GMT and a chart of the sunrise time for that day of the year in Greenwich, England. Hence, your longitude ends up in degrees, minutes and seconds. Lines of longitude are not parallel and converge to meet at the poles. Think of how a shadow would fall on a sphere when lighted from a source across the room. Yeah, this measurement stuff is confusing, isn't it.
It's only confusing when you don't pay attention to the measuring system and the units you are using. For example, when I want to know the coordinates of the Cathedral in Santiago de Compostela and request them from the appropriate app or device, I get the following answer for latitude and longitude coordinates:

42.880596, -8.544641
. No minutes and seconds to be seen. Confused? 🙃

I find 42.880596, -8.544641 easier to handle - and to type! - than N 42° 52' 50" W 8° 32' 41".
 
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Camino Chris

One step forward...
Camino(s) past & future
Frances 2015;
Norte/Primitivo 2016;
Frances 2017;
Le Puy 2018;
Portuguese/FishermanTr. 2019
When reading through this thread (hit and miss) of the 265 various posts, it makes me feel like I am in school again. I don't think I'm absorbing too much, so this class will probably only garnish me a C...but not for Celsius. 😉
 

Marcus-UK

Old Git
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Ingles (2016) Camino Portuguese (2017) Considering Invierno 2019
Count your fingers. Metric.
Count your toes. Metric.

It all begins there. If we had 8, we would have a octogonal system. if we had 16, we would have a hexagonal system. :)🆒

Measures are just a prolonging of the metric system. But those Wiki articles describe that nicely. ;)

Edit: The words "'imperial' measures", are sending bad thoughts to me... Better go metric.:)
In India people count with their thumb against the joints of their fingers so the natural unit is 12.
In my digital electronic days I used to work in Binary base 2, Octal base 8 and Hexadecimal base 32. When working on IBM equipment I used Binary coded decimal or Extended Binary coded decimal. i also worked on base 5 Baudot coding. The Computers I worked were based on 4 bit, 8 bit, 16 bit, 24 bit, 32 bit, 48 bit and 64 bit architectures.
Now I am retired and try to work only in decimals of Pints and multiple fractions of a Gil and am much happier and a less confused person.
 

alexwalker

Forever Pilgrim
Camino(s) past & future
(2009): Camino Frances
(2011): Sevilla-Salamanca, VdlP
(2012): Salamanca-SdC, VdlP
(2014): SJpdP-Astorga
(2015): Astorga-SdC
(2016) May Pamplona-Moratinos; Sept.:Burgos-SdC
(2016): August/Sept: Camino San Olav (Burgos-Covarubbias), Burgos-Sarria
(2017): May: Portuguese; Sept: Pamplona-SdC
In India people count with their thumb against the joints of their fingers so the natural unit is 12.
In my digital electronic days I used to work in Binary base 2, Octal base 8 and Hexadecimal base 32. When working on IBM equipment I used Binary coded decimal or Extended Binary coded decimal. i also worked on base 5 Baudot coding. The Computers I worked were based on 4 bit, 8 bit, 16 bit, 24 bit, 32 bit, 48 bit and 64 bit architectures.
Now I am retired and try to work only in decimals of Pints and multiple fractions of a Gil and am much happier and a less confused person.
Then we are two of us...:) (hex base 16)
 

RENSHAW

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
2003 CF Roncesvalles to Santiago
2/4 weeks every year on CF reaching Burgos or Leon. Hospitalero San Anton June 2016.
Even though I have been metricated from the start I still feel that it is with consideration that I observe the alternative when answering or commenting on a post written by an OP from the USA or UK?
 
Camino(s) past & future
A few Caminos
Next plan - Camino Vasco interior
Hallo Camino friends,

I´m from Germany and in normal life we use only the metric system and for the wights only kilogram etc.

But cooking with Oma is not normal life and it gets really exciting for young people in Germany, when it comes to the weights of the ingredients.

Granny keeps talking about pounds, half a pound, a dozen, half a dozen, a cup, a teaspoon, a tablespoon.....

And if you go to the supermarket in the department, where the sausage is freshly cut and say very salop: "A quarter of salami please," which is common, then you will get only 125g, because the traditional elderly housewife in Germany always use the pounds system in case of sausage and meat.

Do you have any traditions like this? I know from USA oder Canada? a really collection of spoons on a ring.:)

Michael

P.S
We have always suspected on the Camino that Spanish kilometers are different than German. If they write:
5 kilometers to Sahagun - after 5 kilometers you can see Sahagun for the first time in the distance.
 
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Anamiri

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Frances
Hallo Camino friends,

I´m from Germany and in normal life we use only the metric system and for the wights only kilogram etc.

But cooking with Oma is not normal life and it gets really exciting for young people in Germany, when it comes to the weights of the ingredients.

Granny keeps talking about pounds, half a pound, a dozen, half a dozen, a cup, a teaspoon, a tablespoon.....

And if you go to the supermarket in the department, where the sausage is freshly cut and say very salop: "A quarter of salami please," which is common, then you will get only 125g, because the traditional elderly housewife in Germany always use the pounds system in case of sausage and meat.

Do you have any traditions like this? I know from USA oder Canada? a really collection of spoons on a ring.:)

Michael

P.S
We have always suspected on the Camino that Spanish kilometers are different than German. If they write:
5 kilometers to Sahagun - after 5 kilometers you can see Sahagun for the first time in the distance.
Like the people at those roadside stalls , who tell you just 4 kms more. Considering they never asked where I was headed, 4kms to where?
 

Delphinoula

Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Portuguese da Costa 2018
Finisterre Muxía 2018
Camino desde Algeciras Sevillia 2019
Some of us still use pounds, like three quarters of an pound (= 375 g) for a pot roast. Or time telling we say it’s 5 past quarter to ten meaning meaning 9.50. Coming from the time telling by the church bells ringing. A Schoppen is a normal measure for wine, and not to forget the Mass of bear in Munich.
So if nothing goes right go left.
 

Delphinoula

Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Portuguese da Costa 2018
Finisterre Muxía 2018
Camino desde Algeciras Sevillia 2019
Of course, But then, you (and I, as I am holding an engineering degree in computer science for 40+ years), can easily go for binary counting. But the rest of the world will prefer finger counting before electrical current on/off digits, and go metric, :)

The End.
😳 so counting to three is ... ah... but you can right?
 
Camino(s) past & future
A few Caminos
Next plan - Camino Vasco interior
Hola,

Delphinoula, you might be from the south of the white sausage equator;)? Bavaria?

As you say, we handle the time telling very special in Germany. We use in my area after 25 minutes the system which looks to the next full hour, it´s more or less the standard version:

7:25 five before half eight
7:30 half eight
7:35 five after half eight

In the south and the east they start earlier and say what it´s done of the next full hour:

7:15 quarter eight
7:30 half eight
7:45 three quarter eight

Is it only in Germany confusing like this, or is it somewhere else?

Michael
 

David Tallan

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances (1989 and 2016), Portugues - from Porto (2018)
Hallo Camino friends,

I´m from Germany and in normal life we use only the metric system and for the wights only kilogram etc.

But cooking with Oma is not normal life and it gets really exciting for young people in Germany, when it comes to the weights of the ingredients.

Granny keeps talking about pounds, half a pound, a dozen, half a dozen, a cup, a teaspoon, a tablespoon.....

And if you go to the supermarket in the department, where the sausage is freshly cut and say very salop: "A quarter of salami please," which is common, then you will get only 125g, because the traditional elderly housewife in Germany always use the pounds system in case of sausage and meat.

Do you have any traditions like this? I know from USA oder Canada? a really collection of spoons on a ring.:)

Michael

P.S
We have always suspected on the Camino that Spanish kilometers are different than German. If they write:
5 kilometers to Sahagun - after 5 kilometers you can see Sahagun for the first time in the distance.
As a Camadian, outside temperature is given in Celsius and oven temperatures are typically Farenheit. Volume measurements in cooking are often given in both on the things we measure in. Recipes tend to be in cups and spoons or in both.
 

Delphinoula

Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Portuguese da Costa 2018
Finisterre Muxía 2018
Camino desde Algeciras Sevillia 2019
Hola,

Delphinoula, you might be from the south of the white sausage equator;)? Bavaria?

As you say, we handle the time telling very special in Germany. We use in my area after 25 minutes the system which looks to the next full hour, it´s more or less the standard version:

7:25 five before half eight
7:30 half eight
7:35 five after half eight

In the south and the east they start earlier and say what it´s done of the next full hour:

7:15 quarter eight
7:30 half eight
7:45 three quarter eight

Is it only in Germany confusing like this, or is it somewhere else?

Michael
I don’t claim Bavaria. Lol no north of the river.
But on the Camino I only have a happy watch.
 

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