Long Post - My Packing Considerations

[Ussasx]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

 

[Anniesantiago]

Holy Moly, to me a 50L pack is overkill.
Pretty much everything you've mentioned would fit in my 32L pack.
But different strokes...
Buen Camino!

 

[Ussasx]

Holy Moly, to me a 50L pack is overkill.
Pretty much everything you've mentioned would fit in my 32L pack.
But different strokes...
Buen Camino!

My pack list does fit a smaller pack (i had it all in the Exos 38). But i just found the bigger pack more comfortable to wear and easier to access everything The challenge has been not adding too much to the list to fill that space!!

 

[kelleymac]

Looks good! I'd recommend one more step -- well, actually lots of steps. Put on your shoes and your pack and hike 10 miles or more for a few days. Your feet will probably swell up (esp. on a hot day) and you can see how your feet feel after a few days walking.

 

[trecile]

Holy Moly, to me a 50L pack is overkill.

He did say the following:

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before decidin

 

[Kitsambler]

The challenge has been not adding too much to the list to fill that space!!

Indeed, the Basic Law of Physics applies to larger-than-necessary packs: "The amount of stuff expands to fill the space available."

 

[muddy-mama]

Looks good to me. I got the kindle app for my phone & e guide book by G Kelly to read up on the next day. I used Gronze.com for accommodation ect. That and dropping the drone would save you 1kg. Also I took 2 sets of clothes including two pair of double thickness socks & two pair of thin socks for the evening.

 

[Anniesantiago]

He did say the following:

Yes, however a partially full pack isn't always a great idea.
Items shifting around can cause blisters and other issues.
But as I said, to each his/her own

 

[palmah]

Love the thought you've put into your list and thanks for posting it here on the forum. Buen Camino!

 

[Ussasx]

Looks good! I'd recommend one more step -- well, actually lots of steps. Put on your shoes and your pack and hike 10 miles or more for a few days. Your feet will probably swell up (esp. on a hot day) and you can see how your feet feel after a few days walking.

That's a great suggestion, Thanks. I have done a 12 mile, a 14 mile and a 20 mile day in these shoes and pack, just not consecutively and unfortunately no hot days to test it in the UK

Yes, however a partially full pack isn't always a great idea.
Items shifting around can cause blisters and other issues.
But as I said, to each his/her own

Thanks. I think taking Kelleymacs suggestion and doing a couple longer days back to back to test everything out will help. The Atoms 50 is split so it has a ~5l top pocket that is removable and may get left at home, the main section splits in two and everything has tightening straps so the internal space can be restricted quite significantly to prevent jostle if needed. It works for me, but definitely isn't for everyone

 

[Ussasx]

Looks good to me. I got the kindle app for my phone & e guide book by G Kelly to read up on the next day. I used Gronze.com for accommodation ect. That and dropping the drone would save you 1kg. Also I took 2 sets of clothes including two pair of double thickness socks & two pair of thin socks for the evening.

The 1kg in the book and drone are my two biggest - "do I really need them?" and make the biggest difference really. Ill download those apps and check them out. I think that's going to be an easy decision. I already dropped my Journal and Pen as i can make notes on my phone that also dont run the risk of water damage, so should apply that logic to the book! There is something about flicking through the pages though....

 

[muddy-mama]

The 1kg in the book and drone are my two biggest - "do I really need them?" and make the biggest difference really. Ill download those apps and check them out. I think that's going to be an easy decision. I already dropped my Journal and Pen as i can make notes on my phone that also dont run the risk of water damage, so should apply that logic to the book! There is something about flicking through the pages though....

I took notes on my phone but still took a pen. I know what you mean about flicking through pages but it soon becomes second nature to navigate an e book

 

[Anhalter]

Just a few ideas:
- do you need the multitool? I carry a 35g pocket knife which, contrary to your tool, has a very useful corkscrew for uncorking... waterbottels ;-)
- clothing seems fine, but i personally am not a fan of merino undies (switched out mine mid camino for synthetic)
- sleeping kit could lose some weight, i carry a 240g sleeping bag and a few grams of earplugs.
- First aid and toiletries seem excessive.
- electronics.... i carry only my trusty smartphone. but if thats your thing, go with it.
- i can understand the whish for a guidebook but prefer digital.
- i would leave the flask and hit an extra bar or two for hot or cool drinks.
- if you got access to a decathlon they have those tiny 10L daypacks for next to no money that weigh around 50g

 

[Ussasx]

Just a few ideas:
- do you need the multitool? I carry a 35g pocket knife which, contrary to your tool, has a very useful corkscrew for uncorking... waterbottels ;-)
- clothing seems fine, but i personally am not a fan of merino undies (switched out mine mid camino for synthetic)
- sleeping kit could lose some weight, i carry a 240g sleeping bag and a few grams of earplugs.
- First aid and toiletries seem excessive.
- electronics.... i carry only my trusty smartphone. but if thats your thing, go with it.
- i can understand the whish for a guidebook but prefer digital.
- i would leave the flask and hit an extra bar or two for hot or cool drinks.
- if you got access to a decathlon they have those tiny 10L daypacks for next to no money that weigh around 50g

Thanks for the feedback.

Multitool - good suggestion is this the one you mean:

Amazon.co.uk

The merino undies have been good for me so far but will continue testing.

I looked for a lighter weight sleeping bag but it seems to be a considerable spend to drop the weight. Open to suggestions if you know of a cheap bag at 240g. The earplugs are a bit heavier as I find them much more comfortable fit in my ears over the foam ones. They are in a little case so I don't lose them.

Think the guidebook is staying at home....

Will have to consider the flask, it is quite heavy but i like having coffee throughout the morning so even at a euro a coffee getting a couple each day will add up in the budget over 35 days (I'm assuming 1-2 euro per coffee, 2-3 per day or up to 200euro for coffee!), though maybe its a vice I can use the Camino to kick....
I have had a little look round and i could actually grab something like:

Camelbak Forge Vacuum Insulated Mug 0.35L | GO Outdoors

Want to enjoy your morning coffee on the go? This rugged vacuum-insulated mug will keep it warm for up to 6 hours.

www.gooutdoors.co.uk

No doubt will be equally as good, however is smaller and 130grams lighter.

I do have a decathlon nearby. Had a look and £2.99 for the 45g 10l pack. Great suggestion. Thanks.

 

[HaveringRob]

Holy Moly, to me a 50L pack is overkill.
Pretty much everything you've mentioned would fit in my 32L pack.
But different strokes...
Buen Camino!

But that is the one that felt best to him. Size is arbitrary -- weight and comfort is not.

 

[Anniesantiago]

But that is the one that felt best to him. Size is arbitrary -- weight and comfort is not.

Which is why I said, "Different strokes."

 

[Ex99125b]

That's a great suggestion, Thanks. I have done a 12 mile, a 14 mile and a 20 mile day in these shoes and pack, just not consecutively and unfortunately no hot days to test it in the UK


Thanks. I think taking Kelleymacs suggestion and doing a couple longer days back to back to test everything out will help. The Atoms 50 is split so it has a ~5l top pocket that is removable and may get left at home, the main section splits in two and everything has tightening straps so the internal space can be restricted quite significantly to prevent jostle if needed. It works for me, but definitely isn't for everyone

I am 65, 6'2 and weigh 230, with a 23" torso and 32" inseam, (weird, right?) and comfort is my main consideration.
I also have an Atmos 50 which I will strip down and compress. I am willing to carry a slightly heavier pack while still keeping packout weight and size (and sweaty back) within limits for the suspension and fit the pack gives me. No other pack that fit my frame came close.

 

[Anhalter]

Thanks for the feedback.

Multitool - good suggestion is this the one you mean:

Amazon.co.uk

The merino undies have been good for me so far but will continue testing.

I looked for a lighter weight sleeping bag but it seems to be a considerable spend to drop the weight. Open to suggestions if you know of a cheap bag at 240g. The earplugs are a bit heavier as I find them much more comfortable fit in my ears over the foam ones. They are in a little case so I don't lose them.

Think the guidebook is staying at home....

Will have to consider the flask, it is quite heavy but i like having coffee throughout the morning so even at a euro a coffee getting a couple each day will add up in the budget over 35 days (I'm assuming 1-2 euro per coffee, 2-3 per day or up to 200euro for coffee!), though maybe its a vice I can use the Camino to kick....
I have had a little look round and i could actually grab something like:

Camelbak Forge Vacuum Insulated Mug 0.35L | GO Outdoors

Want to enjoy your morning coffee on the go? This rugged vacuum-insulated mug will keep it warm for up to 6 hours.

www.gooutdoors.co.uk

No doubt will be equally as good, however is smaller and 130grams lighter.

I do have a decathlon nearby. Had a look and £2.99 for the 45g 10l pack. Great suggestion. Thanks.

I'll keep it short again (bit busy atm):
- yes, i used the "waiter" modell. Only thing missing is scissors, but i will take one for manicure, which can cut other things aswell when needed (which i did not on my first, but you never know)
- i used the S2S Spark 0 bag on my first camino and will use the Cumulus Magic 100 on my next. Unfortunately neither is cheap. But you could leave the liner and pillow and save weight there, but i understand that it's a very personal choice.
- regarding coffee: 1-2€ is about right, and yes, it sums up. But consider that this price comes with a free bathroom and a chair out of the wind and rain attached. Plus a fresh made coffee might be of slightly better taste than what has been in your flask for a couple of hours ;-)

 

[Ussasx]

I'll keep it short again (bit busy atm):
- yes, i used the "waiter" modell. Only thing missing is scissors, but i will take one for manicure, which can cut other things aswell when needed (which i did not on my first, but you never know)
- i used the S2S Spark 0 bag on my first camino and will use the Cumulus Magic 100 on my next. Unfortunately neither is cheap. But you could leave the liner and pillow and save weight there, but i understand that it's a very personal choice.
- regarding coffee: 1-2€ is about right, and yes, it sums up. But consider that this price comes with a free bathroom and a chair out of the wind and rain attached. Plus a fresh made coffee might be of slightly better taste than what has been in your flask for a couple of hours ;-)

Thanks again for the help.
I will order the waiter Model. I have a small pair of sewing scissors and thread in the first aid kit so they will do im sure (the first aid and wash kit are my next area for review.

I would love a lighter sleeping bag but the ~200 is not justified for me on this Camino. Im sure if i get the bug and plan future trips i will make the investment. I think i will drop the liner and pillow as the bag will be adequate and ill treat it in permethrin for the bugs.

The flask is proving a tricky one. Your points are all valid re the coffee and it I likely will only fill the flask on those days where there is not a lot of towns etc to pass through. So it makes sense to leave it.

 

[Oravasaari]

Good list. In addition to what’s been mentioned above already I think the trowel is overkill unless you plan to sleep out a lot. I’ve never needed one, plenty of services for No 2 pit stops. A multi-tool is quite heavy (and will mean you have to check your bag for the flight). Buy wine with screw tops, take/ obtain a plastic knife for salads and cheese. Get up later and ditch the head torch (1 hour of snore-free bliss in an empty dorm until kicking out time from the alburgue). Consider an internal dry bag instead of a pack cover. I throw my pack into a stream/ river now and then to soak off the sweat. Take just a silk liner in warmer months. Use you phone for everything inc books. One set of clothes on, one in the wash, clean clothes for the evening and in bed. I’ve never needed anything other than shorts (including a late March start SF-Salvador-Primitivo). In warmer months ditch extra layers and walk faster (but take an exposure blanket) Use the same multipurpose soap for body, hair and laundry. Super item = cotton square/ bandana => impromptu picnic blanket/ neck/ face dust protection/ first aid sling/ face flannel/ face towel/ pillow case.

 

[Ussasx]

Good list. In addition to what’s been mentioned above already I think the trowel is overkill unless you plan to sleep out a lot. I’ve never needed one, plenty of services for No 2 pit stops. A multi-tool is quite heavy (and will mean you have to check your bag for the flight). Buy wine with screw tops, take/ obtain a plastic knife for salads and cheese. Get up later and ditch the head torch (1 hour of snore-free bliss in an empty dorm until kicking out time from the alburgue). Consider an internal dry bag instead of a pack cover. I throw my pack into a stream/ river now and then to soak off the sweat. Take just a silk liner in warmer months. Use you phone for everything inc books. One set of clothes on, one in the wash, clean clothes for the evening and in bed. I’ve never needed anything other than shorts (including a late March start SF-Salvador-Primitivo). In warmer months ditch extra layers and walk faster (but take an exposure blanket) Use the same multipurpose soap for body, hair and laundry. Super item = cotton square/ bandana => impromptu picnic blanket/ neck/ face dust protection/ first aid sling/ face flannel/ face towel/ pillow case.

Thanks for the advice.
Have switched out the multitool. Given the size of the atmos I have to check the bag and I already have hold luggage on my flights so not a concern there, I like the previously suggested Victorinox.
Lay in and Ditch the headtorch - consider that one done.
I'm unsure on the silk liner vs bag approach. Will pack with the bag but see how I feel nearer the time. I can always take both for my first week before the Camino and try both. See how I feel in the climate. Send whichever I'm not happy with home with my friend (who flies back to UK when i start the Camino).

 

[C clearly]

I like your statements of key lessons from the forum. The only one I have some hesitation about is this one...

You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!

I don't think this is the key lesson to be learned from the forum - I don't see the word "layers" anywhere. Taking 3 of anything is less flexible than looking at all the layering options. You have 3 identical shirts - they are nylon and will dry in about 20 minutes anyway, so you only need 2 at most.

In fact, I would suggest taking only one of those nylon button shirts, but taking a second t-shirt. If you wear a t-shirt under your buttoned shirt for walking on a cool morning, you will want a different clean one for the night. For me, wearing a t-shirt under the nylon shirt would be more comfortable as well, although that t-shirt might need daily washing. If you wash the t-shirt daily, or have an extra (third) one, you don't need to wash the over shirt so often.

so even at a euro a coffee getting a couple each day will add up in the budget over 35 days (I'm assuming 1-2 euro per coffee, 2-3 per day or up to 200euro for coffee!),

You haven't added the weight of 600 mL of coffee that you'll start out carrying each morning! Also, how are you planning to make that coffee, if you aren't going to buy it?

I likely will only fill the flask on those days where there is not a lot of towns etc to pass through.

On the Camino Frances in April-May, there are not many days like this.

Buy wine with screw tops

When I last tried, I found it very hard to find screw-top bottles of wine in Spain!

 

[Ussasx]

I like your statements of key lessons from the forum. The only one I have some hesitation about is this one...

I don't think this is the key lesson to be learned from the forum - I don't see the word "layers" anywhere. Taking 3 of anything is less flexible than looking at all the layering options. You have 3 identical shirts - they are nylon and will dry in about 20 minutes anyway, so you only need 2 at most.

In fact, I would suggest taking only one of those nylon button shirts, but taking a second t-shirt. If you wear a t-shirt under your buttoned shirt for walking on a cool morning, you will want a different clean one for the night. For me, wearing a t-shirt under the nylon shirt would be more comfortable as well, although that t-shirt might need daily washing. If you wash the t-shirt daily, or have an extra (third) one, you don't need to wash the over shirt so often.


You haven't added the weight of 600 mL of coffee that you'll start out carrying each morning! Also, how are you planning to make that coffee, if you aren't going to buy it?


On the Camino Frances in April-May, there are not many days like this.


When I last tried, I found it very hard to find screw-top bottles of wine in Spain!

Thanks also for the input. I have been walking recently here in the UK in just the nylon shirt with a light rain jacket. With the bag and a reasonable pace I find I manage quite well. I can't see Spain in April being colder. I seem to be very exothermic and get hot easy, so likely won't ever wear the shirt underneath. But if I find I do I can always grab a spare at a decathlon etc.
This fact I'm always warm is also drawing me more toward the liner over the sleeping bag. Though I can't quite bring myself to get to that one yet haha

I had the coffee in the "food and drink£ as carrying 1500ml of liquid instead of 1000ml. Thanks to you all the decision on the flask and coffee is made. Which with the bottle and 600ml of theoretical coffee is just shy 1kg off my total!

 

[Anamiri]

Thanks again for the help.
I will order the waiter Model. I have a small pair of sewing scissors and thread in the first aid kit so they will do im sure (the first aid and wash kit are my next area for review.

I would love a lighter sleeping bag but the ~200 is not justified for me on this Camino. Im sure if i get the bug and plan future trips i will make the investment. I think i will drop the liner and pillow as the bag will be adequate and ill treat it in permethrin for the bugs.

The flask is proving a tricky one. Your points are all valid re the coffee and it I likely will only fill the flask on those days where there is not a lot of towns etc to pass through. So it makes sense to leave it.

I always take my tiny embroidery scissors, they are needle sharp, light and useful for so much.
Which Camino are you walking, if its the Frances, there is always coffee in May. There is only one longer leg where you wont get coffee.
Yes and layers, I usually start off in just about everything and by 11am am down to just a t-shirt. Do your shirts have room for others underneath?
In May I rarely used a sleeping bag but did use the liner - depends how hot you sleep.
Re washing clothes I will just add that after walking all day. having a shower and getting into clean clothes is one of life's great pleasures.
By the end of May I would arrive every afternoon completely drenched. I'm not a fan of carrying sweaty clothes in my pack for a day, I find the earlier they are washed, the easier they are to get clean, especially with non-natural or mixed fabrics. Dirty clothes left to 'ripen' are unpleasant. (I have been told I have a better sense of smell than most.) But each to his own.

 

[Ussasx]

I always take my tiny embroidery scissors, they are needle sharp, light and useful for so much.
Which Camino are you walking, if its the Frances, there is always coffee in May.

Hi. Yes Frances from SJPdP on April 25th. Theoretical arrival in SdC on May 27th.
Then if my legs are holding up the wrong way to Porto on the Portuguese for my flight home on 7th June.

 

[nidarosa]

Hi, and welcome! That is a lot of good work gone into your pack and packing. A few points I wanted to make have already been excellently put: Yes to layering, as weather can change very quickly (I'm looking at you, Galicia). Yes to coffee, it's the best you'll have for a while so enjoy it while it is abundant! Yes to leaving the multitool *and* adding nail scissors - foot care is everything and you can clean them and use them for other things too. No to the trowel and the cup and heavy bottle - I use a filter bottle because I am a water snob who doesn't want to use lots of plastic bottles, and I have a water bag to fill it up on days with few chances to top up.
That sound you are hearing now, is the groan as some people will know what I am about to say:

Ditch the headtorch

Well yes you can. But please use your mobile torch then to check your mattress for bedbugs every day before you lay yourself - or anything else - on it. Shine your light into the corners and over the slats and walls and alert the hospitalero/a if you see something suspicious so they have a chance to rectify it. If you do take the headtorch, don't use it in a darkened dorm in the morning and you'll be fine! We'll be leaving at the same time so I might see you on the way.

 

[RJM]

Your physical condition and knowing your physical limitations far more important than backpack weight and size. To me that's of a higher priority. If you are physically able, carry what you want and what keeps you comfortable and happy on the Camino. I would say no more than 10 kilograms, with water, IMO.

 

[RJM]

I just looked at your list. About the only things I wouldn't bring is the trowel for burying poop, and I wouldn't bring a sleeping bag liner and a sleeping bag. Just bring the bag.
I never needed a trowel as I never pooped while on the path, though on a couple of occasions I came close to. Mind you, I'm all for leave no trace and had this bear s**t in the woods I would have found something to bury it with, a stick etc.
The head light/torch does come in handy sometimes. I ended up using mine on a few occasions on the Camino. Not so much in the albergue, but outside.

 

[Ussasx]

OK. I would like to say a massive thank you to everyone who has contributed. I thought I had nailed it but actually there was a LOT of wiggle room. I have been walking long distances with a 10kg+pack so I know I can handle it, but the repeated day after day makes me want to bring it down. I can always get something on route if it is making me miserable not having it.


What changes have I Made?

Dropped the Guide Book - Will take Apps on my Phone -290grams
Dropped the Flask. Will just use my 1litre Camelbak, if i find this not to be enough ill get a standard plastic water bottle. - 330gr in bottle and 500gr in liquid.
Dropped the Pillow and Silk Liner. Will just take the Sleeping bag and a lightweight cotton pillow case - 260gr. This may reduce even further if i go for the liner only over the sleeping bag.
Swapped daysack for decathlon one -80gr
Swapped multitool for Victorinox - 26gr
Dropped Headtorch - will use phone if needed -60gr

I then agreed with my walking partner to split some items. We will take one power bank (12000mah enough to charge both phones) and one wall adaptor. This means a saving of approx 190gr each.
I will carry a hand sanitizer, he will carry a small pack of wipes. Saves approx 50gr each.
We will each carry small toiletries (toothbrush, toothpaste and soap), but I will carry the shared toiletries (deo, hair stuff, suncream), whilst he carries a reduced first aid kit (removed all the duplicate items in the first aid kit. If we need 7 sterile dressings at once we will just call an ambulance) This reduces my overall carry of toiletries and first aid from a whopping 980gr to 457gr.

Finally – Layering. By dropping one of the Long Sleeve Columbia shirts (-230gr) I can take a second light t shirt (+70) and change the NH100 raincoat which is plastic, not the most comfortable or practical for a different lightweight fully zippable jacket (+215gr).

In total a drop from 8066 pack and 12283 Skin Out to 6580 pack and 10037 Skin Out. With The Drone which may yet stay at home too but I really want to capture videos with it along the route to make a short movie for me and my stepfather and our journey.

 

[Anhalter]

Just one more thing: Warmth

You state that you run hot while walking. As do i. But you also state that you are working on some significant weight loss, which put simply means losing some insulation as well. Then also please consider that you will not be walking all the time. I arrived at my destinations somewhere between 11am and 4pm. Lots of time to sit around and enjoy Spain. Which can be surprisingly cold, since a good part of the camino is close to or even above 1000m. I had snow at cruz de fierro. In June! I would neverever walk the camino without bringing some decent insulation. I even bring a pair of gloves (25g, Decathlon) for the chilly mornings (using sticks and putting hands into pockets doesnt work)

But your adjustments of the packing list are good ones so far

edit: posted it a few times already on the forums, so you might have seen it, but here's my list. (some things are yet missing, might end up 300-700g heavier)

 

[Anamiri]

OK. I would like to say a massive thank you to everyone who has contributed. I thought I had nailed it but actually there was a LOT of wiggle room. I have been walking long distances with a 10kg+pack so I know I can handle it, but the repeated day after day makes me want to bring it down. I can always get something on route if it is making me miserable not having it.


What changes have I Made?

Dropped the Guide Book - Will take Apps on my Phone -290grams
Dropped the Flask. Will just use my 1litre Camelbak, if i find this not to be enough ill get a standard plastic water bottle. - 330gr in bottle and 500gr in liquid.
Dropped the Pillow and Silk Liner. Will just take the Sleeping bag and a lightweight cotton pillow case - 260gr. This may reduce even further if i go for the liner only over the sleeping bag.
Swapped daysack for decathlon one -80gr
Swapped multitool for Victorinox - 26gr
Dropped Headtorch - will use phone if needed -60gr

I then agreed with my walking partner to split some items. We will take one power bank (12000mah enough to charge both phones) and one wall adaptor. This means a saving of approx 190gr each.
I will carry a hand sanitizer, he will carry a small pack of wipes. Saves approx 50gr each.
We will each carry small toiletries (toothbrush, toothpaste and soap), but I will carry the shared toiletries (deo, hair stuff, suncream), whilst he carries a reduced first aid kit (removed all the duplicate items in the first aid kit. If we need 7 sterile dressings at once we will just call an ambulance) This reduces my overall carry of toiletries and first aid from a whopping 980gr to 457gr.

Finally – Layering. By dropping one of the Long Sleeve Columbia shirts (-230gr) I can take a second light t shirt (+70) and change the NH100 raincoat which is plastic, not the most comfortable or practical for a different lightweight fully zippable jacket (+215gr).

In total a drop from 8066 pack and 12283 Skin Out to 6580 pack and 10037 Skin Out. With The Drone which may yet stay at home too but I really want to capture videos with it along the route to make a short movie for me and my stepfather and our journey.

You will walk through towns on the Camino, so if you change your mind on anything, you can always buy it on the way.

 

[dougfitz]

Holy Moly, to me a 50L pack is overkill.
Pretty much everything you've mentioned would fit in my 32L pack.
But different strokes...
Buen Camino!

I used to get much more energised by pack volume and weight discussions than I can now, but @Anniesantiago's comment does illustrate a key consideration about these. Most seem to occur without context information that I think is essential to any advice given on this, and that is the weight and height of the individuals concerned.

If I recall correctly, Anniesantiago once revealed that she is slightly shorter than the average US white woman, and probably weighs a bit less as well. In that context, walking in summer with a 32 li pack would seem entirely reasonable.

I think the OP and I are similar heights, which would make him slightly shorter than the average UK male, and he would have a similar ideal walking weight of around 76 kg, which makes sense of his comment that he is able to fit everything into a 38 li pack. This fits a general rule of thumb I developed some years ago that a good initial start point when looking for a pack is to halve one's body weight (in kg) and look for a pack that size in litres.

The OP is walking in April, when it would not be unreasonable to add a small allowance, up to about 25%, to account for the extra weight of warmer clothing, etc, that might be carried compared to a summer walk. I know that I have been comfortable in the past walking at this time of year with a Deuter Guide 45li pack, although that has occasionally had my 'evening shoes' attached to the outside of the pack.

While this might seem to make a 50 li pack larger than might strictly be necessary, it doesn't seem too much larger to me.

@Ussasx, what I do find interesting is using an FSO target of 15%. When I researched this, I took the guidance offered in the US walking classic, 'The Complete Plain Walker IV' by Colin Fletcher and Chip Rawlings. Their view is that an FSO weight of up to 20% has little effect on walking speed, while anything over 30% should be avoided. I would be interested to know the source of the 15% target you are using.

In all of this, remember that for pack weight, 10% is a magic number and a guide but not a rule, and that carrying less weight is always better, provided that you have what you need to walk safely.

 

[Ussasx]

I used to get much more energised by pack volume and weight discussions than I can now, but @Anniesantiago's comment does illustrate a key consideration about these. Most seem to occur without context information that I think is essential to any advice given on this, and that is the weight and height of the individuals concerned.

If I recall correctly, Anniesantiago once revealed that she is slightly shorter than the average US white woman, and probably weighs a bit less as well. In that context, walking in summer with a 32 li pack would seem entirely reasonable.

I think the OP and I are similar heights, which would make him slightly shorter than the average UK male, and would have a similar ideal walking weight of around 76 kg, which makes sense of his comment that he is able to fit everything into a 38 li pack. This fits a general rule of thumb I developed some years ago that a good initial start point when looking for a pack is to halve one's body weight (in kg) and look for a pack that size in litres.

The OP is walking in April, when it would not be unreasonable to add a small allowance, up to about 25%, to account for the extra weight of warmer clothing, etc, that might be carried compared to a summer walk. I know that I have been comfortable in the past walking at this time of year with a Deuter Guide 45li pack, although that has occasionally had my 'evening shoes' attached to the outside of the pack.

While this might seem to make a 50 li pack larger than might strictly be necessary, it doesn't seem too much larger to me.

@Ussasx, what I do find interesting is using an FSO target of 15%. When I researched this, I took the guidance offered in the US walking classic, 'The Complete Plain Walker IV' by Colin Fletcher and Chip Rawlings. Their view is that an FSO weight of up to 20% has little effect on walking speed, while anything over 30% should be avoided. I would be interested to know the source of the 15% target you are using.

In all of this, remember that for pack weight, 10% is a magic number and a guide but not a rule, and that carrying less weight is always better, provided that you have what you need to walk safely.

Hi. Thanks for responding.
I can't recall where or when I saw the 15%. It might have been one of the guides, or YouTube videos I watched before I found the forum.
With the practice walks I have found the pack at 10-12kg, plus clothing for UK hikes to be fine and not impact my walking as you say. However I haven't done 15miles a day for weeks, so the advise to bring it down seems sensible, though not to the extent I want to go ultralight.
I think for me it's the toss up between light enough for comfort, but not at the expense of greater comfort.
Things like sacrificing a pillow case AND a towel AND a buff, for one piece of cotton to save 100grams is a length I'm not ready for.
Yet, it is quite addictive trying to find lighter replacements I must say.

 

[dougfitz]

Yet, it is quite addictive trying to find lighter replacements I must say.

I agree, although it always seems to have greater effect in lightening my wallet than my pack!!

 

[Ussasx]

I agree, although it always seems to have greater effect in lightening my wallet than my pack!!

Oh that I have noticed! I still have 10 weeks to to. See if I get persuaded to buy that 240g sleeping bag before then....

 

[trecile]

Re washing clothes I will just add that after walking all day. having a shower and getting into clean clothes is one of life's great pleasures.

I agree! I also like having washing my clothes as part of my daily routine. If I could skip every other day I think that it would break the rhythm and pattern of my day.

 

[Viva Terlingua]

I have a DJI Air 2S that I take hiking with me often, but I wouldn't even consider taking it on the Camino. Not just because of the weight. I figure stopping to take a couple simple drone shots takes about 20 minutes. After a few days you're going to tire of it pretty quickly, at least I would.

 

[VNwalking]

Indeed, the Basic Law of Physics applies to larger-than-necessary packs: "The amount of stuff expands to fill the space available."

Not so.
There's no law of nature that fills packs. You just need discipline!

Frankly, it can be a bit grating when some of the smaller pack brigade (not pointing at anyone specifically, or even on this thread) piles on with airs of superiority. It's not anyone's business what someone else carries, especially if that big pack is comfortable. You may be able to afford to own multiple packs of different sizes, but not everyone can. And who knows what that other person geniuinely needs to carry?
Ok, rant over.

@Ussasx, you can carry that pack proudly - and comfortably!

 

[Kanga]

@Ussasx for years I carried a 50 plus litre pack (I am wearing it in my Avatar) and then I switched to a 30 litre pack. I'm going back to a slightly larger pack again because although I could fit everything into the 30 litre pack, I hated having to meticulously arrange everything to get it all in. Too fiddly.

In any case, I'm with you in thinking that comfort is the most important factor. If that means a bigger pack, with a decent frame, so be it. If that means a smaller lighter pack, so be it. Totally a matter of what suits each individual body.

As to contents, pretty much everything in your pack can be augmented or discarded along the way.

Buen Camino!

 

[Oravasaari]

I went right down to an Osprey Rev 6 hydration pack (yes 6 litres and sub 5kg with water) in June 2018 so that I could run/walk Pamplona to Sahagun. So although that was a rather extreme example it shows it can be done. I’ll be going back to my “big” pack (an Osprey Talon 33) for a future walking only camino. My winter camping pack here in Finland is 120 litres and even that’s a struggle to fit everything in for a minus 20 degrees expedition. Horses for courses.

 

[Ussasx]

I have a DJI Air 2S that I take hiking with me often, but I wouldn't even consider taking it on the Camino. Not just because of the weight. I figure stopping to take a couple simple drone shots takes about 20 minutes. After a few days you're going to tire of it pretty quickly, at least I would.

This is what I have been considering. Its pretty quick and easy to get going, but still means getting it out of packaging, setting up, getting in the air. Playing around as the shots aren't always great first time. Im going to carry it 500miles for maybe 10-15 good clips. Now i have everything loaded in my bag, im heading to the lakes to do two days in a few weeks. I will test the rigmarole of getting it out for a shot or two and see how it goes.

 

[Eve Alexandra]

I really enjoyed your post. As a fully 6 ft tall woman, I also am not of the “tiny pack” brigade. Being a larger human in either height or breadth or both means that clothes are also longer/larger and weigh more. When I walked in March (I hit snow and sleet and I was very glad for my rain pants which doubled as snow pants) I comfortably carried about 12% of my weight, and I am healthy but not an athlete. I regretted having a smaller pack. As you said, it’s fussy and annoying if you are wired as an organization lover. Lol. I’m taking a larger one next time, 45-50 ltr.

I also run hot. I didn’t wear my shell when most were layered up around me. I didn’t trust my gut because of the advice I received (not this forum) and packed based on all the warnings of how cold I would be, and ended up shipping back a lot of unnecessary expensive layering pieces. That said, I still experience post workout chill, so I kept one layer for that and used it pretty much every single evening.

I took a winter weight sleeping bag liner and the infamous Costco quilt in a very cold end of winter and I was only truly cold one night. I put on the layers I had left. It was fine. No need to bust your budget when you could use the money on extra coffees.

Truly lightweight head lamps are not expensive and I was sooooo glad I had it. I used it several times, both using the red light option to not disturb others, and also when I left early one morning and ended up in a pitch black woods. Ymmv

The advice to walk the 10-12 mile days back to back with a fully loaded pack is critical, imho. A shoe/sock combination that works on single days may fail you on consecutive days. I learned that one the hard way and still have the scars from blisters to show for it. Next time I’m bringing both trail runners and walking sandals because I’ve learned that my feet need to switch regularly to stay happy. It’ll weigh more but it’s worth it to me.

And lastly, if you are a reader and/or an introvert, take the book if you want to. Everyone told me to leave my kindle at home (I don’t enjoy reading on my phone). I am really glad I ignored that piece of advice and will most definitely bring it again because it makes me happy.

 

[Tandem Graham]

I've enjoyed reading this thread. My first impression of the OP was that he had already done more thinking and planning about pack and contents than 95% of first time caminantes. With the help of this discussion, we can safely say more than 99%, now!
@Ussasx you're going to be fine!
Please remember to let your analytical side have a rest during your Camino. And enjoy the walking and the talking, the mystery and the history, the tests and the rests, the views and ...the booze ....
Any more rhyming pair suggestions?
Buen Camino!

 

[Ivan Shannon]

Hello, I am due to arrive on the 25th May in St Jean, I have many similar viewpoints regarding kit as yourself to the point that your initial pack list could be mine. In fact I am going to pack my bag according to your list so I can see what is the initial pack weight. I am a number of years older but at 87 kgs similar weight.

 

[ktchnofdngr]

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!

I actually recommend 4 sets of clothes, but then, I HATE washing clothes--i look for Albergues with washers when it's time to wash clothes. I'm probably going to do my upcoming Camino with only 2 pr. Pants instead of 4 (I wear skorts so I look decent at Mass) but with 4 tops to lower my weight.

My kit is about 7 kilos (15 lbs), and I'm hoping to get it down to 5kilos before water. This is my 4th Camino, so that means mostly swapping out for lighter gear rather than changing what is inside. What I have works for me, and that is really the important thing!

Buen Camino!

Ruth

 

[Ussasx]

I actually recommend 4 sets of clothes, but then, I HATE washing clothes--i look for Albergues with washers when it's time to wash clothes. I'm probably going to do my upcoming Camino with only 2 pr. Pants instead of 4 (I wear skorts so I look decent at Mass) but with 4 tops to lower my weight.

My kit is about 7 kilos (15 lbs), and I'm hoping to get it down to 5kilos before water. This is my 4th Camino, so that means mostly swapping out for lighter gear rather than changing what is inside. What I have works for me, and that is really the important thing!

Buen Camino!

Ruth

I hate laundry too. Me and my stepfather are sticking with the laundry every other day idea, using machines where possible. As there is two of us it means every 4 days for each of us. Sharing chores

 

[Tim-F]

I've enjoyed reading this thread. My first impression of the OP was that he had already done more thinking and planning about pack and contents than 95% of first time caminantes. With the help of this discussion, we can safely say more than 99%, now!
@Ussasx you're going to be fine!
Please remember to let your analytical side have a rest during your Camino. And enjoy the walking and the talking, the mystery and the history, the tests and the rests, the views and ...the booze ....
Any more rhyming pair suggestions?
Buen Camino!

The nice flowers and hot showers ...

 

[Ussasx]

I really enjoyed your post. As a fully 6 ft tall woman, I also am not of the “tiny pack” brigade. Being a larger human in either height or breadth or both means that clothes are also longer/larger and weigh more. When I walked in March (I hit snow and sleet and I was very glad for my rain pants which doubled as snow pants) I comfortably carried about 12% of my weight, and I am healthy but not an athlete. I regretted having a smaller pack. As you said, it’s fussy and annoying if you are wired as an organization lover. Lol. I’m taking a larger one next time, 45-50 ltr.

I also run hot. I didn’t wear my shell when most were layered up around me. I didn’t trust my gut because of the advice I received (not this forum) and packed based on all the warnings of how cold I would be, and ended up shipping back a lot of unnecessary expensive layering pieces. That said, I still experience post workout chill, so I kept one layer for that and used it pretty much every single evening.

I took a winter weight sleeping bag liner and the infamous Costco quilt in a very cold end of winter and I was only truly cold one night. I put the layers I had left. It was fine. No need to bust your budget when you could use the money on extra coffees.

Truly lightweight head lamps are not expensive and I was sooooo glad I had it. I used it several times, both using the red light option to not disturb others, and also when I left early one morning and ended up in a pitch black woods. Ymmv

The advice to walk the 10-12 mile days back to back with a fully loaded pack is critical, imho. A shoe/sock combination that works on single days may fail you on consecutive days. I learned that one the hard way and still have the scars from blisters to show for it. Next time I’m bringing both trail runners and walking sandals because I’ve learned that my feet need to switch regularly to stay happy. It’ll weigh more but it’s worth it to me.

And lastly, if you are a reader and/or an introvert, take the book if you want to. Everyone told me to leave my kindle at home (I don’t enjoy reading on my phone). I am really glad I ignored that piece of advice and will most definitely bring it again because it makes me happy.

Everyone's insights are so helpful in these internal debates. But i am going to load up (and stick with the additional 2kg over this list) and go out for two full days this weekend. The weekend is not looking good weather wise so will test my layers are adequate and dry bags work as intended. Two long days back to back tests my gear, and my ability to carry the pack multiple days.
Ill report back next week

 

[Eve Alexandra]

I actually recommend 4 sets of clothes, but then, I HATE washing clothes--i look for Albergues with washers when it's time to wash clothes. I'm probably going to do my upcoming Camino with only 2 pr. Pants instead of 4 (I wear skorts so I look decent at Mass) but with 4 tops to lower my weight.

Lol I like 3 sets. I don't think I would ever go with just 2. What brand of skorts do you like? That's my preference for warm weather as well.

 

[Ussasx]

I've enjoyed reading this thread. My first impression of the OP was that he had already done more thinking and planning about pack and contents than 95% of first time caminantes. With the help of this discussion, we can safely say more than 99%, now!
@Ussasx you're going to be fine!
Please remember to let your analytical side have a rest during your Camino. And enjoy the walking and the talking, the mystery and the history, the tests and the rests, the views and ...the booze ....
Any more rhyming pair suggestions?
Buen Camino!

As a former business analyst and current project manager you can imagine that the 18+ months I have been planning this Camino I have been through many iterations of the analysis - if anyone is going to spreadsheet the hell out of the Camino its me.

This is one of my key reasons for doing the Camino. To switch off from the constant over thinking and allow the daily routine to take its own shape. To meet and walk with people I haven't met and allow that to change my plans. It is unusual for me to not have an itinerary and accommodation all pre-booked so that's my first step...

 

[C clearly]

My first impression of the OP was that he had already done more thinking and planning about pack and contents than 95% of first time caminantes. With the help of this discussion, we can safely say more than 99%, now!

I don't think this is true. Certainly not for forum members. Many of us have well-edited spreadsheets! I'm not saying they are necessary - just that they (and detailed planning) are not unusual.

 

[Scott Sweeney]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

You are way over thinking your Camino.

 

[Eve Alexandra]

Many of us have well-edited spreadsheets! I'm not saying they are necessary - just that they (and detailed planning) are not unusual.

/raises hand...I also weigh to the gram and have spread sheets

 

[trecile]

For me, the problem with using washing machines is that you have to hang around the albergue until the machine is done, or wait your turn to use it then wait until it's done. It doesn't take me long to hand wash my clothes, and as soon as I hang them up I'm free to explore the town.

 

[jalluisi]

That's a great suggestion, Thanks. I have done a 12 mile, a 14 mile and a 20 mile day in these shoes and pack, just not consecutively and unfortunately no hot days to test it in the UK


Thanks. I think taking Kelleymacs suggestion and doing a couple longer days back to back to test everything out will help. The Atoms 50 is split so it has a ~5l top pocket that is removable and may get left at home, the main section splits in two and everything has tightening straps so the internal space can be restricted quite significantly to prevent jostle if needed. It works for me, but definitely isn't for everyone

My husband took his Atmos 50 and loved it on the camino the past October. He said it was more comfortable than the 36 liter he has. It came in handy at the end to put items we wanted to buy and take home too!! lol

 

[MayDaz]

Hi Just a quick point on the Victorinox talking from experience, if you are planning on taking your rucksack on the plan as hand luggage rather than booking it in. The chances are that this will be confiscated when going through security. Lost a really good cork screw this way
buen camino

 

[muddy-mama]

I don't think this is true. Certainly not for forum members. Many of us have well-edited spreadsheets! I'm not saying they are necessary - just that they (and detailed planning) are not unusual.

For my first Camino last year I planned everything on the back of an envelope carried it all the way to Santiago and didn't look at it once.

 

[Tandem Graham]

You are way over thinking your Camino.

Having teased the over-analytical, I will now leap to their defence.
For some people, *planning* the Camino, if only by gathering useful information to inform in-the-moment decisions later, is *part* of their Camino.
I don't make spreadsheets but I do hoover up Camino info from this forum and Gronze etc. I prepare a list of my preferred accomodation in almost every hamlet before any Camino I walk, so that every stop is both unplanned and informed! Nerdy? Overthinking? It works for me!
I admire @Ussasx for his attention to detail on his pack. While planners and spreadsheet makers may be over-represented on this forum, we have all seen pilgrims staggering under over-weight packs containing unnecessary items. He won't be one of them.

 

[Eve Alexandra]

Having teased the over-analytical, I will now leap to their defence.
For some people, *planning* the Camino, if only by gathering useful information to inform in-the-moment decisions later, is *part* of their Camino.
I don't make spreadsheets but I do hoover up Camino info from this forum and Gronze etc. I prepare a list of my preferred accomodation in almost every hamlet before any Camino I walk, so that every stop is both unplanned and informed! Nerdy? Overthinking? It works for me!
I admire @Ussasx for his attention to detail on his pack. While planners and spreadsheet makers may be over-represented on this forum, we have all seen pilgrims staggering under over-weight packs containing unnecessary items. He won't be one of them.

Considering all the details while I'm at home allows me the mental freedom to not fuss and fret on the path. Anxiety seems to think I am her best friend as she doesn't like to let go of my hand. #annoying

 

[SeñorJacques]

As a former business analyst and current project manager you can imagine that the 18+ months I have been planning this Camino I have been through many iterations of the analysis - if anyone is going to spreadsheet the hell out of the Camino its me.

This is one of my key reasons for doing the Camino. To switch off from the constant over thinking and allow the daily routine to take its own shape. To meet and walk with people I haven't met and allow that to change my plans. It is unusual for me to not have an itinerary and accommodation all pre-booked so that's my first step...

I could have written this myself - not to mention that I’m also in the process of trying to lose some unnecessary body weight before my walk to lighten my load (I’m down 11 lb/5kg since New Year’s as of today!) Thanks for sharing your thought process in such detail, as well as your spreadsheets - and for admitting that “letting go” somewhat is one of the goals of your Camino. I too am a chronic overplanner when it comes to travel, which has usually served me well. But I’m hoping that my Camino will allow me to embrace a little more positive entropy in my experience moving forward.

All that said - don’t know if you’re familiar with LighterPack.com but it is tailor made for those of us who enjoy/are obsessed with tallying our kit before a trip. I have a feeling you might find it as fun to play with as I do!

LighterPack

lighterpack.com

Having teased the over-analytical, I will now leap to their defence. For some people, *planning* the Camino, if only by gathering useful information to inform in-the-moment decisions later, is *part* of their Camino.

Thanks also to @Tandem Graham for posting this. As much as I appreciate how much I’ve learned on this forum from those who have gone before me and generously share their knowledge, there’s a patronizing whiff of gatekeeping around the occasional comment like the one you responded to here. As I recently said in another thread, what works for one person doesn’t neccessarily work for everyone - and isn’t “walking your own Camino” something that gets bandied a lot here as well?

 

[Oravasaari]

Laundry - If you handwash every day it becomes so automatic you hardly even think about it.

 

[isawtman]

Here's a note about the backpack, the Atmos AG 50.
It is 4 lbs which is not outrageous for a backpack.
The other thing about the backpack is that you can
take the lid off and use it like a fanny pack for those
times you are walking around town, or sending your
pack ahead through a transportation service. Or you
could just not bring the lid which would bring down
the overall weight of the pack. Not sure how much
lighter it would be

 

[MichelleElynHogan]

I have said this before on a number of other posts, no matter what you take with you on your first Camino, if you go on a second Camino your pack will likely be half the size, half the weight. Rather than a 50 L pack, consider a 35 L pack.

 

[ken2116]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

Nice list, likely to serve most people well. Some considerations:

- Small multitools have short blades and can be flimsy - at similar weight (2oz.) there are Swiss Army knives that are more capable and durable - some have cork screws!

- Consider finger and toenail management.

- Maybe a simple watch that doesn't require recharging during the trip - light weight and inexpensive.

- Light weight shower sandals.

- Also a small traditional (non-electronic) compass.

- Bundled clothing can serve as a pillow.

- If you need reliable GPS over a long day, consider something like the Garmin eTrex 30 series that will run for > 20hrs on AA cells.

- Is there any possibility of spending a night out of doors, in weather?

 

[Ian Campbell]

I have the Atmos 50. I picked orange so the drivers could see me. Including the pack, I'm at 9kg at the moment. I'm hoping to shave 1 kg to get to 10%, but it already seems pretty comfortable. It's a good pack. The disadvantage is its 2kg net weight, but I'm not about to spend money for a smaller one. I do not allow the pack to exert its mind control powers on me and load more stuff in it. I use a scale and focus on the final weight.

The Atmos 50 is a good multipurpose pack. I think you'll be happy with it. It's been on my back walking across Fraser Island and up and down the hills of Nepal (not mountains, that's above my pay grade). I did the LePuy camino a few years ago with "ultralight" camping gear in the same pack. Weighed 12-13 kg, which was a little heavy, but most days I hardly noticed.

I haven't tried carry-on with this pack. It seems a bit long. I think I measured it one time and it was borderline. Maybe if you took the brain off, not sure. I use a backpack carry bag and check it with poles, etc.

 

[Saint Mike II]

Hola @Ussasx
All I can say is WOW. For a first time pilgrim I doubt I have seen a better prepared pilgrim.
My comments: yes a 50l might be on the large size - but if its comfortable and does the job whats the worry;
walking shoes and sock - again personal preference. You have done the training and trial testing - go with what is comfortable and works;
closes - how much to take - again personal preference. You could start off with the minimal but there are shops in Spain and the Camino Frances does go through 3 or 4 (or more) large cities/towns - Pamplona; Burgos or Leon to name a few.
My tip - go with what your happy with. Buen Camino.

 

[Ussasx]

You are way over thinking your Camino.

I may not be if I hadn't been thinking about it considerably whilst not being able to travel in the previous years
Thanks all for the support. Having my start a few times I can't explain how much I'm looking forward to striking out!

Nice list, likely to serve most people well. Some considerations:

- Small multitools have short blades and can be flimsy - at similar weight (2oz.) there are Swiss Army knives that are more capable and durable - some have cork screws!

- Consider finger and toenail management.

- Maybe a simple watch that doesn't require recharging during the trip - light weight and inexpensive.

- Light weight shower sandals.

- Also a small traditional (non-electronic) compass.

- Bundled clothing can serve as a pillow.

- If you need reliable GPS over a long day, consider something like the Garmin eTrex 30 series that will run for > 20hrs on AA cells.

- Is there any possibility of spending a night out of doors, in weather?

Thanks for the advice. The watch works quite well probably only needs charging every 3 to 4 days. Its part of my daily routine, I can play music direct to my headphones, save GPS points etc. So it's part of my must haves really

My victorinox arrived today and seems perfect and lightweight so that one is taken care of. I also have a small pair of lightweight scissors and thread in the first aid kit.

Need to consider what for shower sandals. I have some super light foam flip flops so they may come along. And great idea on clothes bundle for pillow.

 

[Tim-F]

I may not be if I hadn't been thinking about it considerably whilst not being able to travel in the previous years
Thanks all for the support. Having my start a few times I can't explain how much I'm looking forward to striking out!

Thanks for the advice. The watch works quite well probably only needs charging every 3 to 4 days. Its part of my daily routine, I can play music direct to my headphones, save GPS points etc. So it's part of my must haves really

My victorinox arrived today and seems perfect and lightweight so that one is taken care of. I also have a small pair of lightweight scissors and thread in the first aid kit.

Need to consider what for shower sandals. I have some super light foam flip flops so they may come along. And great idea on clothes bundle for pillow.

Hi. How about Crocs? Also nice for walking around in. I hate the slapping noise that flip-flops make. Though at about 370g (UK size 8) Crocs will be rather heavier than flip-flops (maybe 200g?).

 

[Ussasx]

Hi. How about Crocs? Also nice for walking around in. I hate the slapping noise that flip-flops make. Though at about 370g (UK size 8) Crocs will be rather heavier than flip-flops (maybe 200g?).

I do have some Adidas Sliders. A bit less flip floppy bit lighter than crocs at 260g. I'll have a rummage and see what else I may have.

 

[SeñorJacques]

I do have some Adidas Sliders. A bit less flip floppy bit lighter than crocs at 260g. I'll have a rummage and see what else I may have.

EVA Birkenstocks are also worth checking out. My US 11/E 44 pair weighs 260g.

Arizona Essentials EVA Metallic Anthracite | BIRKENSTOCK

BIRKENSTOCK Arizona Essentials EVA Metallic Anthracite in all sizes ✓ Buy directly from the manufacturer online ✓ All fashion trends from Birkenstock

www.birkenstock.com

 

[Eve Alexandra]

EVA Birkenstocks are also worth checking out. My US 11/E 44 pair weighs 260g.

Arizona Essentials EVA Metallic Anthracite | BIRKENSTOCK

BIRKENSTOCK Arizona Essentials EVA Metallic Anthracite in all sizes ✓ Buy directly from the manufacturer online ✓ All fashion trends from Birkenstock

www.birkenstock.com

Are the comfortable enough you could use them as a back up walking shoe?

 

[SeñorJacques]

Are the comfortable enough you could use them as a back up walking shoe?

They are very much like "regular" Birkenstocks, with a softer footbed. So if you find Birkenstocks comfortable as a walking shoe you'd likely find the EVA version comfortable as well. I like mine for wearing at the beach and around the house but prefer something with a heel strap for extended walking so I'm still debating whether to take these as my backup shoes or swallow the weight and pack my Teva Universal Trails instead - they weigh nearly a pound more than the Birks but are also more comfortable and supportive over long distances while carrying a pack, which would make them a good alternative when I want a break from walking days with my Altra Olympuses. A search for EVA Birkenstocks here will turn up many other opinions!

 

[Kathy F.]

I'm so enjoying reading this thread!!!

Lots of ideas, thoughts, advice, coming and going through my head as I think about my own upcoming Camino.

I'm glad the OP got rid of the Leatherman. I bring a small (3" max) folding pocketknife and a baby's fingernail scissors.

I bring one of those small wind-up solar flashlights that hang off my backpack as I walk, rarely needed it but good to have during an emergency run to the WC in a strange albergue.

Glad you got rid of the silk liner, glad you kept the raincoat.

I bring a small pillow, light as a feather pillow but squshes down to nothing. But I also use the drawstring bag that I carry my sleeping clothes in (to keep them separate from the other stuff in my pack) and sometimes filled it with other clothes for a makeshift pillow. More than one use, right?

My backpack is 50 ltr, and I found it to be the most comfortable of all the ones I've used over the years.

I take 2 pair of zip-leg pants. I agree with many here that doing laundry by hand is easy, quick, and a pleasant social/wind down time in an albergue. And this is from a Mom of 4 - sick of laundry!!!

I brought a pair of Decathlon sandals as my secondary shoes, not meant for long distances by any means, but they worked as a much needed substitute for a few hours walking with clean socks (I know, socks and sandals?? YIKES!!)

If you are taking a Camelback, I would only point out that there may be some villages with clean, cool, potable water in the fountain in the main square. You might want to take advantage of those water stops (I'm looking at you, Meseta!!) so make sure you can do it easily, without having to unpack alot or getting stuff wet.

Buen Camino - take your time and don't rush (hard when you're walking with someone else). Start out like an old man so you can finish like a young man.

 

[ken2116]

Hi. How about Crocs? Also nice for walking around in. I hate the slapping noise that flip-flops make. Though at about 370g (UK size 8) Crocs will be rather heavier than flip-flops (maybe 200g?).

Be careful with Crocs, my standard ones are light weight but very slippery on smooth wet surfaces (tile floors, boat decks) and I've taken a few falls. "Kitchen Crocs" grip well, but are much heavier.

 

[ken2116]

I may not be if I hadn't been thinking about it considerably whilst not being able to travel in the previous years
Thanks all for the support. Having my start a few times I can't explain how much I'm looking forward to striking out!

Thanks for the advice. The watch works quite well probably only needs charging every 3 to 4 days. Its part of my daily routine, I can play music direct to my headphones, save GPS points etc. So it's part of my must haves really

My victorinox arrived today and seems perfect and lightweight so that one is taken care of. I also have a small pair of lightweight scissors and thread in the first aid kit.

Need to consider what for shower sandals. I have some super light foam flip flops so they may come along. And great idea on clothes bundle for pillow.

It appears that you're well set, enjoy your trip.

 

[dougfitz]

I used it several times, both using the red light option to not disturb others,

To be clear, a red light doesn't stop others being disturbed by a light, rather it preserves their night vision when you do disturb them. They won't thank you for the latter, but might for the former once they get over the annoyance of having their sleep disrupted!

 

[sharonmonty]

OK. I would like to say a massive thank you to everyone who has contributed. I thought I had nailed it but actually there was a LOT of wiggle room. I have been walking long distances with a 10kg+pack so I know I can handle it, but the repeated day after day makes me want to bring it down. I can always get something on route if it is making me miserable not having it.


What changes have I Made?

Dropped the Guide Book - Will take Apps on my Phone -290grams
Dropped the Flask. Will just use my 1litre Camelbak, if i find this not to be enough ill get a standard plastic water bottle. - 330gr in bottle and 500gr in liquid.
Dropped the Pillow and Silk Liner. Will just take the Sleeping bag and a lightweight cotton pillow case - 260gr. This may reduce even further if i go for the liner only over the sleeping bag.
Swapped daysack for decathlon one -80gr
Swapped multitool for Victorinox - 26gr
Dropped Headtorch - will use phone if needed -60gr

I then agreed with my walking partner to split some items. We will take one power bank (12000mah enough to charge both phones) and one wall adaptor. This means a saving of approx 190gr each.
I will carry a hand sanitizer, he will carry a small pack of wipes. Saves approx 50gr each.
We will each carry small toiletries (toothbrush, toothpaste and soap), but I will carry the shared toiletries (deo, hair stuff, suncream), whilst he carries a reduced first aid kit (removed all the duplicate items in the first aid kit. If we need 7 sterile dressings at once we will just call an ambulance) This reduces my overall carry of toiletries and first aid from a whopping 980gr to 457gr.

Finally – Layering. By dropping one of the Long Sleeve Columbia shirts (-230gr) I can take a second light t shirt (+70) and change the NH100 raincoat which is plastic, not the most comfortable or practical for a different lightweight fully zippable jacket (+215gr).

In total a drop from 8066 pack and 12283 Skin Out to 6580 pack and 10037 Skin Out. With The Drone which may yet stay at home too but I really want to capture videos with it along the route to make a short movie for me and my stepfather and our journey.

I’m doing my first Camino in May from Tui. I’ve read scores of threads on packing. Have really enjoyed yours and have some good ideas from it! Buen Camino

 

[Richard Smith]

Have switched out the multitool.

Good move. I asked for the smallest Swiss Army knife that had (knife/can opener/tweezers/cork screw/scissors) and I ended up using the scissors almost every day, the knife sometimes, the tweezers a bit, and never used the can opener or corkscrew (even though we sometimes bought meals at grocery shops/wine shops).
I would say ditch the drone, unless that is really important to you. There is heaps to do on the camino without trying to produce a good video. But that is dependent on your values.
I would take the guide book, but a small one. I took Brierley's maps-only version on the camino but had the full Brierley and one other for planning/dreaming.
The rest looks good to me. I lost weight on the camino and gained muscle - best wishes that you do also!
I also took a too-large backpack, EXOS 58, but this was virtually same weight as the smaller sizes and I have used it for multi-day walks back home afterwards. One thing to watch with lightweights like the EXOS is that a lightweight pack works well up to a certain load and over that it can become uncomfortable to carry (IMO).
And you did a great post - I enjoyed it and the follow-on threads. Thanks!

 

[hikentravel1234]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

I have walked Camino Frances 3 times and even in the hottest months, the night time temps/early AM can be VERY cold. So I would recommend at least a lightweight fleece unless you are really cold tolerant. Think about taking rain pants too. I remember being so cold I had to put on 4 upper layers as well as long johns, pants, and sweatpants to stay warm—all this inside a lightweight sleeping bag. Taking 2 pants and 3 shirts/underweear/socks is Very reasonable. Occasionally you can’t wash or the clothes don’t dry.
I could only find large bottles of toiletries on my hike—so most was left over/left behind.
For me, taking foot care was critical, esp mole skin (which i liked and couldn’t find in Spain).

 

[hikentravel1234]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

The only things I would omit is the selfie stick (unless you really want it), the flask, and the silk liner. You will need some sort of clothes cleaner. There are occasional washing machines but mostly just washing clothes in the sink. Baggies are great, so make sure you have enough. Since you have a big pack, consider taking a sturdy plastic container with a lid. I often would buy pastries for the next morning (often only able to get coffee from a machine before leaving) and the container kept things from getting flattened.

 

[hikentravel1234]

Thanks for the advice.
Have switched out the multitool. Given the size of the atmos I have to check the bag and I already have hold luggage on my flights so not a concern there, I like the previously suggested Victorinox.
Lay in and Ditch the headtorch - consider that one done.
I'm unsure on the silk liner vs bag approach. Will pack with the bag but see how I feel nearer the time. I can always take both for my first week before the Camino and try both. See how I feel in the climate. Send whichever I'm not happy with home with my friend (who flies back to UK when i start the Camino).

FYI. You may need the head torch esp if you think you might want to start walking before the sun comes up (to avoid too much time in the sun or want to walk to see the sun rise—beautifu).

 

[Ussasx]

I have walked Camino Frances 3 times and even in the hottest months, the night time temps/early AM can be VERY cold. So I would recommend at least a lightweight fleece unless you are really cold tolerant. Think about taking rain pants too. I remember being so cold I had to put on 4 upper layers as well as long johns, pants, and sweatpants to stay warm—all this inside a lightweight sleeping bag. Taking 2 pants and 3 shirts/underweear/socks is Very reasonable. Occasionally you can’t wash or the clothes don’t dry.
I could only find large bottles of toiletries on my hike—so most was left over/left behind.
For me, taking foot care was critical, esp mole skin (which i liked and couldn’t find in Spain).

Thanks. I am very cold tolerant so i think the boxers / shorts / trousers if needed will be overkill (as i say i walk in just a pair of light trousers in the UK during winter and sleep in my birthday suit so wearing layers to bed im sure will be fine. If not i can buy some long johns). Ill grab some moleskin for the first aid kit. Thanks

The Selfie stick is my walking pole! i have drilled a hole and fitted a Camera thread in the top so a phone or camera can be mounted to the walking stick
The plastic container I hadn't considered and could also double as a dry bag when not full of pastries - Thanks

**Edit. Attached an image of "selfie stick" as you can see it can be held out as a selfie stick, but i can also remove plastic tip and jam it in the ground to use as a tripod (if i find a spot where the ground isnt solid and there are no other pilgrims to help with photography of course).

 

[Viva Terlingua]

If you are taking a Camelback, I would only point out that there may be some villages with clean, cool, potable water in the fountain in the main square. You might want to take advantage of those water stops (I'm looking at you, Meseta!!) so make sure you can do it easily, without having to unpack alot or getting stuff wet.

I use a Camelbak when I walk/hike. I find it much easier to hydrate while walking. However, it is not very convenient when you've stopped and taken your pack off. My plan is to only partially fill the Camelbak and have a water bottle to use when I stop.

 

[Ronald Boivin]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

Thank you! I am preparing my third Camino for the Fall. Your detailed analysis still helps me plan my packing.

 

[Bruce30017]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

Hello Ussax,

Couldn't resist a reply when I saw you had the Osprey Atmos 50. Like you, I understood that 50L is supposedly on the large side for the Camino. However, I found that the fit was great with the hip belt and chest strap, and the mesh back spaced away from the actual pack was a big help in not getting your back, and the pack, all sweaty. So why 50L? I didn't pack it that full on the Camino, packed weight was around 16 lbs, which probably meant I was using about 40L of volume. This helped not having to cram things in the main compartment, and being able to find things easier.; it also left room for bringing home souvenirs etc. at end of trip. However, the big benefit of the 50L size is that after using the pack on two Caminos, I have also used it probably ~20 times for other trips : backpacking for 2-3 week international trips as my single pack, wilderness camping, even for shopping/errands on foot.

In other words, this versatile pack has been a good friend since 2008, not only for 500 km of the Camino, but also as my single bag for many "hands-free" trips to Europe, Africa and South America as well as here in Canada. The only complaints I would have are: it is a bit too big for taking in the cabin on board a plane; the pouches for a water bottle are quite awkward to reach with the pack on; I found that after several days the hip belt chafed a bit on my sides.

Of course, if you are buying a pack for the camino only, the 50L is probably a bit bigger than what you really need. But considering that the pack carries weight quite comfortably, has extra room when needed, I never thought of it as too big, and am still using it today. Anybody I've met with Osprey packs have been quite satisfied with them - they are quite popular in Canada.

Thought this might give you a little perspective!

Bruce30017

 

[ken2116]

The only things I would omit is the selfie stick (unless you really want it), the flask, and the silk liner. You will need some sort of clothes cleaner. There are occasional washing machines but mostly just washing clothes in the sink. Baggies are great, so make sure you have enough. Since you have a big pack, consider taking a sturdy plastic container with a lid. I often would buy pastries for the next morning (often only able to get coffee from a machine before leaving) and the container kept things from getting flattened.

I'd like to vote for retaining a sleeping bag liner (~ 5oz.), which we've been using for 50yrs. Our initial motivation was to protect our down sleeping bags from dirt and skin oils, so the bags didn't require washing as often (a major project), but have found the liners also add insulating value and on warmer evenings (Hawaii) and indoors often can be used alone. To help keep it organized, my favorite liner has an opening that matches that of the sleeping bag and is attached to the bag with light weight fabric ties that fasten to matching loops we added to the bag. Our liners are laundered every few days, but after hundreds of nights we haven't needed to wash the bags which retain nearly their original loft.

Once when in Ireland we found the tap water (Dublin) so hard that the shampoo we packed from the US turned to an un-rinsable gum in our hair whereas local shampoos worked perfectly - lesson learned.

 

[Leanne Lang]

Hello Ussax,

Just a quick thank you for your post and attaching your packing list. I'm a newbie too with my first camino this June. I'm so happy with my bag and all I have packed already, helped very much by people sharing their experience. I just received my USB 3 outlet wall charger today in the mail and it only weighs 29g! I bought it on ebay, just letting you know in case you are still wanting to shave a little more weight off.

Thanks again, Leanne

 

[Ussasx]

I'd like to vote for retaining a sleeping bag liner (~ 5oz.), which we've been using for 50yrs. Our initial motivation was to protect our down sleeping bags from dirt and skin oils, so the bags didn't require washing as often (a major project), but have found the liners also add insulating value and on warmer evenings (Hawaii) and indoors often can be used alone. To help keep it organized, my favorite liner has an opening that matches that of the sleeping bag and is attached to the bag with light weight fabric ties that fasten to matching loops we added to the bag. Our liners are laundered every few days, but after hundreds of nights we haven't needed to wash the bags which retain nearly their original loft.

Once when in Ireland we found the tap water (Dublin) so hard that the shampoo we packed from the US turned to an un-rinsable gum in our hair whereas local shampoos worked perfectly - lesson learned.

Thanks for the input. I have been considering retaining the Silk Liner and not adding a pillow case. It can be one of those multi use items then if need be and its not really heavy. It will come out of its storage bag and just go in the dry bag with all the other sleeping stuff so reduces weight further. I do need to consider the opening / closing of it as it currently is top entry only which is a pain.

Hello Ussax,

Just a quick thank you for your post and attaching your packing list. I'm a newbie too with my first camino this June. I'm so happy with my bag and all I have packed already, helped very much by people sharing their experience. I just received my USB 3 outlet wall charger today in the mail and it only weighs 29g! I bought it on ebay, just letting you know in case you are still wanting to shave a little more weight off.

Thanks again, Leanne

View attachment 118180

Thanks - I have ordered something similar. I just took what i had here which is a large cabled multicharger. Quite heavy for what it is really so this will be a big help.

A note of caution about aftermarket chargers. A published study showed that while a few are okay, many do not meet the USB standards for voltage stability and protection - some produce voltage spikes that have the potential to damage equipment, some don't maintain full voltage, and some are so poorly constructed as to present shock or fire hazards. Short of testing with specialized equipment and inspecting inside there's no way to be sure other than using the charger that came with your equipment. When we travel we take known good chargers (do confirm they'll work with the local voltage and cycles) and an adaptor plug. I believe the third party Ankor brand met all of the specs.

That is a good shout to the above point. I will probably only use the wall charger on my cheaper items and mostly to charge the power bank. I will charge my phone off the power bank whilst I'm walking, so as to avoid any potential issue.

 

[Leanne Lang]

A note of caution about aftermarket chargers. A published study showed that while a few are okay, many do not meet the USB standards for voltage stability and protection - some produce voltage spikes that have the potential to damage equipment, some don't maintain full voltage, and some are so poorly constructed as to present shock or fire hazards. Short of testing with specialized equipment and inspecting inside there's no way to be sure other than using the charger that came with your equipment. When we travel we take known good chargers (do confirm they'll work with the local voltage and cycles) and an adaptor plug. I believe the third party Ankor brand met all of the specs.

Thanks for pointing this out Ken, it was ridiculously cheap, I will get my husband's view too as he's really into electronics (and protecting equipment).

 

[NYSE]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

You could take a lot less and survive very well. My Camino was all about living well on the least possible and lookiing back, that was part of the fun.

 

[Leanne Lang]

You could take a lot less and survive very well. My Camino was all about living well on the least possible and lookiing back, that was part of the fun.

I think there's a lot in this, I have bought a knife for preparing food for the walking parts of the day, then read that one mum was just buying a chunk of cheese in the morning, and she and her kids just took bites out of it when they were hungry. Living simply.

 

[Nicola Foster]

Thanks for the feedback.

Multitool - good suggestion is this the one you mean:

Amazon.co.uk

The merino undies have been good for me so far but will continue testing.

I looked for a lighter weight sleeping bag but it seems to be a considerable spend to drop the weight. Open to suggestions if you know of a cheap bag at 240g. The earplugs are a bit heavier as I find them much more comfortable fit in my ears over the foam ones. They are in a little case so I don't lose them.

Think the guidebook is staying at home....

Will have to consider the flask, it is quite heavy but i like having coffee throughout the morning so even at a euro a coffee getting a couple each day will add up in the budget over 35 days (I'm assuming 1-2 euro per coffee, 2-3 per day or up to 200euro for coffee!), though maybe its a vice I can use the Camino to kick....
I have had a little look round and i could actually grab something like:

Camelbak Forge Vacuum Insulated Mug 0.35L | GO Outdoors

Want to enjoy your morning coffee on the go? This rugged vacuum-insulated mug will keep it warm for up to 6 hours.

www.gooutdoors.co.uk

No doubt will be equally as good, however is smaller and 130grams lighter.

I do have a decathlon nearby. Had a look and £2.99 for the 45g 10l pack. Great suggestion. Thanks.

Thanks for the feedback.

Multitool - good suggestion is this the one you mean:

Amazon.co.uk

The merino undies have been good for me so far but will continue testing.

I looked for a lighter weight sleeping bag but it seems to be a considerable spend to drop the weight. Open to suggestions if you know of a cheap bag at 240g. The earplugs are a bit heavier as I find them much more comfortable fit in my ears over the foam ones. They are in a little case so I don't lose them.

Think the guidebook is staying at home....

Will have to consider the flask, it is quite heavy but i like having coffee throughout the morning so even at a euro a coffee getting a couple each day will add up in the budget over 35 days (I'm assuming 1-2 euro per coffee, 2-3 per day or up to 200euro for coffee!), though maybe its a vice I can use the Camino to kick....
I have had a little look round and i could actually grab something like:

Camelbak Forge Vacuum Insulated Mug 0.35L | GO Outdoors

Want to enjoy your morning coffee on the go? This rugged vacuum-insulated mug will keep it warm for up to 6 hours.

www.gooutdoors.co.uk

No doubt will be equally as good, however is smaller and 130grams lighter.

I do have a decathlon nearby. Had a look and £2.99 for the 45g 10l pack. Great suggestion. Thanks.

I had to give up coffee on the Camino, when you don’t know when you’ll next find a bathroom it became a luxury I had to do without! Probably TMI!

 

[jlietzow]

I made a similar decision with my pack, but it's even bigger. I have an Osprey Atmos AG 65 that I use for backpacking that I love. It's so much more comfortable than any other pack I've ever owned and it fits me very well (I'm 6'4" tall). I bought a smaller Deuter daypack last year for shorter hikes, but I find that it forces me to carry all of the weight on my shoulders and back instead of my hips.

If money were no object, or if I were buying a pack strictly for the Camino, I'd look for a smaller Osprey (35-50 liters). But I'll just crank down on the compression straps to keep my items from shifting around in my half-empty pack.

I know that I may look silly with my monstrous pack on the Camino, but I'm quite happy with it and don't want to sacrifice comfort.

 

[SusanH]

Just incase you haven’t heard it before - every bigger city has a store (on the way) where you can buy ANYTHING that you may want or need!

 

[camino.ninja]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

here's my 10 cents:

You can save 1 to 1,5 kilos on a smaller backpack (in the end the amount of weight being carried to you knees and feet is what matters)

Hiking Sticks is not needed on the camino for regular healthy people with normal balance

One of the smallest Swiss army knifes is all you need for the camino
https://www.swissarmy.com/us/en/Pro...-Knives/Classic-SD-Classic-Colors/p/0.6223.3G

Solomon shoes is the ones I see most people having trouble with because they do not expand in width as your feet does after some days of walking. You might need to change during the way but I can see you have an extra pair. Sandals is what works when everything else does not.

10 degrees celcius sleeping bag works all year round (Nordisk Oscar +10 / Patagonia Lightweight Sleeping Bag / Cumulus Heat Liner)

All albergues have pillows. No need to bring your own. You can use a stuff sack with your clotes in if needed.

Silk liner is not needed if you have a sleeping bag

It is true the Ninja App has all the information you need while walking, but guidebooks usually provide more history and stuff that might be nice along the way. If you are not sure, bring the guidebook and leave it at an albergue if you do not use it.

First Aid: Try to avoid compeed. Heat blanket should not be needed. Bring vaseline instead of lip balm as it can also be used for blister prevention and recovery

Toiletries: Hair Wax, Deo and Soap Bar not needed. Use shampoo for body and laundry.

Day Sack: Someone already told you about the cheap ones from Decathlon

Flask and Hydraulic Reservoir not needed. You can just reuse a water bottle (or two)


The cheapest way to reduce weight is to leave stuff you don't need at home.

When you buy stuff you can usually shave off more grams pr euro on your backpack and sleeping bag than anything else.


10% of your body weight is a really old formula

People with more body weight should not carry more
With 5 kilos you can walk like normal
With 7 kilos or more it becomes heavy and uncomfortable on long multiday hikes


I have a packing list on https://camino.ninja/packlist if you need more inspiration for what you don't need

Best
Andy

 

[Oravasaari]

Just incase you haven’t heard it before - every bigger city has a store (on the way) where you can buy ANYTHING that you may want or need!

Good shout! The Decathlon on the way out of Logrono is just a 100m off the way. By the time you reach Logrono you may have determined the item you forgot/want to upgrade or some extra bit of clothing or a replacement you may need.

 

[Oravasaari]

Hello All,

I have been a Forum loiterer for a while now, but as my Camino approaches I feel the need to join the conversation more.
A lot of discussion is held on here around packing / pack lists / 10% body weight / 15% skin out weight and so on so thought i would take everything i have learned and share my current lists, thinking's and reasonings. Warning - long post!

I hope you are all sitting comfortably…. If so let’s begin…. for context - I am a 38 Year Old relatively active male.


Backpack.
The biggest factor I considered with my pack was comfort in use. Thanks to everyone on the forum who suggested taking gear into a store and trying packs. The staff at go outdoors definitely looked at me funny taking 10kg of random stuff into a store and walking round with various packs.

In the end I settled on the Osprey Atmos AG 50. First controversial choice. It is quite a heavy pack (1900gr with rain cover). Secondly it is a lot bigger than most people recommend.

However, in using the pack loaded, I found it felt lighter than other packs due to how it fit and loaded the weight to my hips. The second factor in this choice was that packing, and accessing, the same stuff was much easier in the larger capacity. Things like hip storage for easy access, pole holders, bottle holders etc all seemed better to me than other packs.

I have been using this on training walks and 100% feel I made the right choice.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me– Try the packs on loaded with gear before deciding.



Shoes and Socks.
The next biggest decision to make was footwear. I did the same thing as the pack. I went into stores and tried on a big variety of shoes. Trail runners, hiking boots and everything in between. I found that the most comfortable and versatile were the Solomon X Ultra 3’s. I then went on decent walks in said shoes with single socks, liner and thick sock and dual layers. The Dual Layers gave me the best outcomes. So, I went with the 1000 Mile Fusion anklets. This combo has seen me do up to 20mile day walks with happy feet.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – Everyone’s Feet are Different. Try different combos on trial hikes. Great Big Hiking Boots are overkill.



Pack Weight.
At the start of the year, I weighed 90kg. Taking this through the ringer of advice suggests that I should be aiming for a pack weight of ~ 9kg, or a skin out weight of ~ 13.5kg.

My Packing list as below has hit a Pack weight of 8kg (9%) and a skin out of 12kg (13%) both within the agreed tolerances – after questioning some items a LOT before dropping them - there are still a number of "maybe's" that i have justified in my head.

HOWEVER! 90kg puts me at borderline obese (a BMI of 31). So rather than fighting grams in my pack I’m fighting the belly fat. Dry January, HIIT training and healthy eating has seen me drop so far to 83kg! I’m working hard to hit a target of 76kg (BMI of 26) before I start in April.

This means my pack will then be almost 11% of my weight and skin out becomes 16% - over my “recommended guidance”. However rather than losing 1kg from my pack I will have lost 14kg from my body along with a lot of calisthenics building up my strength all over my body. Just got to maintain the motivation!

I have also been completing practice walks with my pack loaded, but just for giggles adding 2kg extra (sack of bath salts). Hopefully this means when I actually begin walking the Camino, the pack will be lighter than I’m used to.

Key Point the Forum Taught Me – There are ways to reduce your walking weight other than kitchen scales for every item in your pack, but setting a baseline helps you question what is necessary.



Clothes and Organisation.
So, it seems the common consensus is 2 sets. Wear one, wash one. The next controversial point for me is that I plan mostly 3 sets meaning laundry every 2 days. The extra shirt, socks and underpants weighs in at 300g. I may live to regret it, but doing less laundry is worth it – though I’m only taking 2 pairs of zip-offs. As long as I have clean pants, socks and shirt I think trousers will last 2 days.
The next piece is organisation. This again seems to divide people, though I like the organised approach (as you can tell by a spread-sheeted pack list!!). Having my items in organised bags means if I need something I pull out bags to find appropriate colour rather than emptying loose items everywhere - a number of forum members have posted images of this packing and it just looks so neat!
Finally on clothing I haven’t packed a fleece or anything warmer. For cold I have Lightweight shirt as base, long sleeve shirt as mid and rain jacket as third. I can manage in the English Lake District in Jan in this so I'm sure ill survive Spain in May
Key Point the Forum Taught Me – You are all going to tell me to do my laundry more often and take less clothes!



First Aid, Toiletries Etc
My list includes several items that may be shared between me and my walking partner. So, it may well be that I don’t carry all of this as we split it. For example, apart from taking our own toothbrush, we may carry one first aid kit between us and one wash kit between us, replenishing as we go. This is another forum divisive discussion as there are pharmacies all along route etc. But then if I start to feel a blister or an upset tummy, I want to deal with it there and then, not in 5km or 10km time.

My Full Pack List
Ok Here we go, my pack list is attached as an PDF'd Spreadsheet. Links to all items are available if anyone likes any of the suggested items. Feel free to pick it apart. I do not offend easily All items have been weighed using the kitchen scales for accuracy

With my 5th camino coming up in April, your post reminded me to go searching for all my kit and bits n bobs that have been scattered about during these Covid years. I was worried a few things would have gone astray. Nope! I managed to source everything and pack it in automatic mode in about 10 mins! The camino experience does make you a damned good speed packer for sure! Now my pack is sitting there ready to go it makes it all seem more real

For interest, mine comes to just under 5kg based on an Osprey Talon 33, not including water, and taking only one change of clothes. It would have been lighter but anticipating that things may be busy this year I’m taking gear to give the option to sleep out (I’ve done this on orevious occasions too, if you’re an experienced bush whacker it takes the bed race nonsense right out of the equation).

 

[Ussasx]

Thanks again to everyone's input and the ongoing conversation. I have made a few more tweaks and i will update the original post and a new packing list shortly. I have also been perusing the forums around some other elements, particularly some discussions around the drone. This decision will make @Anniesantiago Happy from what i have seen and read

Having tested the drone from the pack, one of those feelings that was mentioned in another thread was that stopping, taking the drone out and setting up, waiting for a period when there are no other pilgrims around to disturb to try and get some footage is going to be a somewhat jarring break in the day (and lead to lost friends who will walk on without me).
I wouldn't dream of disturbing other people with the drone same as I don't in the UK, so I will likely have very few opportunities along the way at end of April and through May. So why carry it?
Maybe if I do another Camino, where I'm familiar with what is where (so I don't miss out), and its a quieter time of year / route. But for now, its just dead weight so it is out!!

 

[Viva Terlingua]

Thanks again to everyone's input and the ongoing conversation. I have made a few more tweaks and i will update the original post and a new packing list shortly. I have also been perusing the forums around some other elements, particularly some discussions around the drone. This decision will make @Anniesantiago Happy from what i have seen and read

Having tested the drone from the pack, one of those feelings that was mentioned in another thread was that stopping, taking the drone out and setting up, waiting for a period when there are no other pilgrims around to disturb to try and get some footage is going to be a somewhat jarring break in the day (and lead to lost friends who will walk on without me).
I wouldn't dream of disturbing other people with the drone same as I don't in the UK, so I will likely have very few opportunities along the way at end of April and through May. So why carry it?
Maybe if I do another Camino, where I'm familiar with what is where (so I don't miss out), and its a quieter time of year / route. But for now, its just dead weight so it is out!!

I'm a drone owner and enthusiast and am certain you made the right decision.

 

[MaryStella]

Just a few ideas:
- do you need the multitool? I carry a 35g pocket knife which, contrary to your tool, has a very useful corkscrew for uncorking... waterbottels ;-)
- clothing seems fine, but i personally am not a fan of merino undies (switched out mine mid camino for synthetic)
- sleeping kit could lose some weight, i carry a 240g sleeping bag and a few grams of earplugs.
- First aid and toiletries seem excessive.
- electronics.... i carry only my trusty smartphone. but if thats your thing, go with it.
- i can understand the whish for a guidebook but prefer digital.
- i would leave the flask and hit an extra bar or two for hot or cool drinks.
- if you got access to a decathlon they have those tiny 10L daypacks for next to no money that weigh around 50g

what kind of sleeping bag is your 240g bag?